Last Dambuster Knighthood Campaign

He’s been awarded an MBE in the Queen’s Birthday Honours:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-40301329

Spot the errors, I can see three…

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I saw a news item about the petition couple of nights ago, showing Carol at the door of number 10 and I think it said it was up to 200,000. JJ asked about it all said ” if I got any award it would be for the 55,573, Also there’s a picture of JJ as a Sqn Ldr with a Navigators brevet, did he retrain from a Bomb aimer…

regards,
jack…

ps sorry post 25 beat me too it…

For those that didn’t see the news the petition was delivered to Downing Street yesterday. 250000 signatures apparently so if nothing else comes of it, it has at least raised a bit of awareness.

BBC Mobile at the moment on this subject has a photo of the Bomber Command Memorial dedicated to the 7 man crew of a “Lancashire Bomber ” which doesn’t show a huge amount of respect or knowledge.

Definately not knowledgable but certainly not disrespectful. In fact, how can the writer be disrespectful if they’d thought they’d put down the right name and indeed if they were trying to be disrespectful it’s not much of a way to go about it. Maybe people need to stop getting offended on behalf of veterans with such knee jerk ease. I can’t see veterans up and down the UK getting two upset at one online article confusing ‘Lancaster’ with ‘Lancashire’.

… the 7 man crew of a “Lancashire Bomber “.

I’m sure that will be added to the RAFM’s want list. 🙂

I hope I can clarify a few points. The honour nomination made last year wasn’t for the fact he was the last surviving British Dambuster, nor was it for his wartime exploits – despite what the press has been saying and indeed the subsequent campaign. Both of these are not reasons for receiving a honour. As I understand it, a specific honour wasn’t mentioned, once again not what the press are saying. He wasn’t turned down for a Knighthood, he was turned down for an honour by the Cabinet Office Honours Committee.
The nomination was actually for services to education (particularly related to Bomber Command) and for raising money for service charities (including the IBCC) which he continues to do at 95. These are two potential reason for a honour – the press and the subsequent campaign have totally missed this point.
Regarding accepting an award for a “group” – a group honour – this is not possible. However, a recepiant often says something along the lines that he or she is accepting it on behalf of group and the work they have done.
What’s concerning about this is what Johnny himself thinks about this. There is an element of certain people and the press pushing their own agenda. To use an elderly veteran for this isn’t nice.

BBC Mobile at the moment on this subject has a photo of the Bomber Command Memorial dedicated to the 7 man crew of a “Lancashire Bomber ” which doesn’t show a huge amount of respect or knowledge.

Hi All,
I hope none of you above posters mind but nobody linked the petition so here for all those who want to sign:-
https://www.change.org/p/give-britain-s-last-surviving-dambuster-hero-a-knighthood?source_location=petition_footer&algorithm=promoted&grid_position=2&pt=AVBldGl0aW9uADTElgAAAAAAWHOpuEZa8XQ3YmU0ZmM1Mg%3D%3D

Geoff.

Well the awarding of honours you are never going to please everyone and there are many who deserve recognition and will never receive it. I’ve nothing against it a rather quirky British institution (yes I know other countries do have honour systems). Reminded me of Capt Daniel V Gallery when asked what DDTSM stood for after his name: Dan Dan The Sailor Man.

[QUOTE=avion ancien;2366337]All of which demonsrates that the ‘honours’ system is anachronistic and serves no purpose these days. It has been

Spot on correct !

I signed it, perfectly happy to he’s served this country both in war and peace and his generation are almost extinct, BC were treated terribly after the war you mention them and Dresden will follow…logically though if he had been a civil servant he would have received a knighthood with his pension book and bus pass. A OBE, MBE are given today are no comparison to what they used to be for, i’m not knocking Sir Bruce, or Sir Ken they’ve entertained us and done charity work for years, but JJ risked his life for this country and has done and is still doing charity work.

just my tuppenceworth, regards,
jack…

this post may contain grammatical errors…

That is usually what an OBE is awarded for, hence the nickname for it Other Bu@@ers Efforts. My current boss has just received it as did my previous boss. MBE is for something specific an individual has done – My Bloody Efforts. A chap I used to work with got it for his work with the boy scout movement. Knighthoods usually for a multitude of things through a lifetime. Not hard and fast rules though.

Allow a question from a ex-colonist…
Are knighthoods usually given to one to represent an entire group (as post #9 above seems to suggest)?

I attended a talk JJ gave to an audience of well in excess of 200 just before Christmas;- an evocative, spellbinding and moving account of his wartime service, delivered with exceptional clarity for a chap of his age.

I’ve signed the petition.

During the questions he made it very clear that he was not happy with the post war recognition of former Bomber Command personnel particularly those who died or carried long term injuries. The subject of his own recognition came up, to which he replied that he feared that his position regarding the wider Bomber Command recognition might have upset too many influential people. It would not surprise me if offered, he would decline, but here’s one person trust to make the right decision no matter which he path he follows.

I totally agree, but a person still has to be nominated for it, they don’t troll through the populace looking for deserving cases.

I think some of us just get a bit ‘uncomfortable’ about some of these campaigns pressurising for honours and awards.

Yes that is the way I look at it – honours are things granted not demanded.

That is contrary to what we were told by the Cabinet Office Press/PR department.

Also, 4 refers:-

https://www.gov.uk/honours/types-of-honours-and-awards

Hi Andy. Well as you say it does seem contrary because if you go directly to the nomination form it just says there is no needto select the honour as the appropriate one will be selected by the committee. It doesn’t say you can’t suggest one, nor does it say nominations stating an award will be disregarded. Anyway, all this is really irrelevant to the purpose of the thread. I put it up to make people who hadn’t heard aware of it and hopefully add signatures to the petition, I don’t care what the system is, I don’t believe adding to the petition will harm his chances. I believe he is deserving of the award – any award – and hope the campaign is a success.
I agree though that these campaigns can make it a bit uncomfortable for people. I think it is disappointing that people (Ms Vorderman, people at The Sun etc.) felt that this is what it would need to make it happen as it should have happened anyway. I think it still causes discomfort among the hierarchy, be it royalty or government, when it comes to honouring anyone from bomber command. Just my thoughts.

All of which demonsrates that the ‘honours’ system is anachronistic and serves no purpose these days. It has been – and is being – debased too frequently to have any value in modern society. A man’s or a woman’s good deeds speak for themselves. They don’t require to be ‘flagged up’ with some sort of ‘gong’.

I think some of us just get a bit ‘uncomfortable’ about some of these campaigns pressurising for honours and awards.

I couldn’t agree more.. but i believe that Johny Johnson has appealed via a social media page to receive the award on behalf of the 50.000 plus comrades that were lost from bomber command..

But i can see the uncomfortable part, it just dosnt make any sense to me why lesser people are recognized for an award.