LINCOLN TO AUSTRALIA

Thanks Mark

I never realised that until now. You don’t pay much attention to things like that when acquiring parts but I will for sure from now on. The cleaning job has made the parts look alot better than when they were in england.

Peter,

the parts are carrying dirt, spider webs, leaves and other material from its years in outside storage in “yards”, our import processes require such material to be removed via steam cleaning and dis-infectant treatment in a quarrantine environment to ensure soil bacteria, plant seeds, or inspects/animals dont enter Australia and affect native floura/fauna or agricultural activities or even public health, all of the lincoln parts being delivered have been going through this quarrantine / cleaning process.

Regards

Mark Pilkington

Quarantine wash??

Why do you need a quarantine wash never heard of that before?

Here are some pics of the latest arrival of Lincoln parts, taken at Melbourne port during quarrantine washdown, the centre-rear fuselage and one of the wing outer panel trailing edges with flaps and ailerons in place.

Regards

Mark Pilkington

Tom – there is a Canadian Ventura under restoration to flying condition in Canada.

for those interested,

The third 40′ container load of Avro Lincoln RF342 has now arrived in Melbourne for delivery to the ANAM, consisting of:

Centre-Rear Fuselage
(section containing mid-upper turret, aft of centre-section and forward of crew entry door)

Wing Outer Panel trailing edges

Engine Mounts, radiators, engine narcelles etc

These items are expected to arrive at the museum next week.

http://www.aarg.com.au/Lincoln.htm

Regards

Mark Pilkington

There is a picture of the Canadian wreck post crash in the book “Lincoln at war”… the front section was intact up to at least the instrument panel, as the canopy is shown in the picture.

From the text that is with the book, it appears the tail broke away, the rest was dragged up on shore, then stripped and broken up.

I’ll dig the book out tonight and find the picture.

Richard

Evening Peter

Yes I am aware that Victory Aircraft did build one Lincoln and it was sent to the RAF.

It is interesting to have this conversation as I have just come back from the NASM aviation museums conference.

In Canada the Lincoln is no more than a foot note in our history, we built (1) and Cold weather tested (1). While I wish we could save everything and hog it for ourselves (is that my greed showing) the facts are that we cannot save everything and must concentrate on the history that has the most provedence to Canada.

The Lincoln has very little unfortunately.

Austrailia is a different story…they built many of the Lincolns, operated them, modified them and used them till well worn and tired. They wrote large chunck of the Aussie maritime patrol and other history including their use in Malaysia.

The Lincoln has a huge provedence in Austrailia!

I would love to see the Lincoln recovered and used to provide the world with a wonderful example and all things considered I think our friends in Austrailia have a great case for supporting them.

Again, I would love to save one of everything that ever flew in Canada, but it is not practical….I would sooner see the time and effort that would be expended on the Lincoln here go into another airframe like our Ventura or an AVRO York. We have no examples of etheir and they were huge players in our history.

Just some thoughts from me…and I do really sympathize with wanting to save her here.

Tom H

ok…..

Tom that would be one of the fuselage sections that can be seen in the lake then including the tail? At least one of the wings is on shore possibly both and all 4 engines were salvaged.

Tom I am not sore if you know but canada did build one lincoln of which the serial number escapes me at the moment. I would really like to see the aircraft stay in canada and be restored possibly as this canadian one but doubtful wether or not any groups or museums coud(a) afford the recovery and (b) house it.

Morning Peter

Take this for what it worth….

It is my understanding from Vets that were here at the time and a couple of people that have visited the site.

When the Lincoln crashed it hit and went through the ice, the forward fuselage was essentially destroyed and a LAC was killed, his body not recovered till later by divers.

As you can imagine an aircraft that size hitting at hit speed through thick ice then damage would have been like hiting a cement wall. The nose, I have been told, actually broke away.

So far as I know the nose it is still underwater somewhere in the lake, as are the majority of the wings.

That is the best info I currently have until some of my other contacts return from flying up north.

Tom H

Lincoln in watson lake

Tom is the front fuselage in the lake or on land near the mid section?

Good evening Mark

Sorry in taking so long to get back to you I have been in the USA at the Aviation Museums Mutual Concerns Conference, just got back.

I have a couple of very good contacts that have been on site of the Lincoln, they will be back in country in a couple of weeks and I will get their information to you.

I do know from speaking with them over the years that the front section is very very damaged likely not recoverable, mid section of fuse through to the stab has large useable sections, wings are a mystery.

Check with CAPA on current statis but I knoew of no current recovery operations on this one…no noises of one etheir.

As I said earlier, the Lincoln does not have much provedence in Canada, if my research is correct the one in the lake is the only one to come to Canada.

It would be better to see a recovery that aided a restoration in a country where there is great provedence than it is to leave it age.

I’ll see what I can find out, but I need some time.

Tom H

Damn it.

If I wasn,t up the other end of Auss I would be over there in a flash with drill in hand ready to start derivetting the beast.Thank you Mark for saving another Aircraft from the scrappers.If anyone knows anyone interested in old aircraft down thataway please urge,bribe,blackmail them into helping out at Morrabine.I was down there before xmas and was gobsmakked with what the guys have achieved.The projects list just keeps on getting longer hey Mark…:diablo:

thanks Bruce

I saw those pics awhile ago. Yes there is a lot that has to happen with her before she is reassembled

Peter,

The pictures dont tell much of the story.

I am really glad Mark saved the aircraft – if it had remained here it would have been scrapped inside 5 years.

However, you really need to look close – this will be a huge job to repair and restore the aircraft. No-one should underestimate it.

Somewhere in this topic is a link to the pictures I took for Mark – Have a really good look – go-on, I dare ya!

Bruce

Seen worse

Thanks Mark.
She doesnt look bad from the outside but who knows what kind of corrosion problems are lurking after all the years on outdoor storage.

for those interested?

Here are some pics of the Lincoln arriving (in installments) at the Australian National Aviation Museum at Moorabbin Airport, showing one of the two wing outer panels that arrived in early March and the wing centre section that arrived in early April.

Regards

Mark Pilkington

http://aarg.com.au/Lincoln.htm

Mark;

It may be worth getting in contact with Jeremy Hall who built the Lancaster cockpit featured in Flypast a few years ago. It was built to original drawings, and he was the advisor for the build of a full size fuselage for the BBC programme “Night FLight” that is now at Woodhall Spa in Lincolnshire.

Regards

Richard W

Richard,

I was referring to the cockpit of TW911 in regard to the opportunity of obtaining RF342’s “original cockpit”, (as I am sure its original “factory” cockpit is long scrapped), ie returning it to its last configuration with Napier, however I am unsure if that is available for purchase and even more unsure if we could afford it – smiles.

Obviously it will always be RF342 in terms of its true identity, too much of it exists to claim anything else, it is simply how it is displayed and presented in terms of representation, relevence etc, and I am sure the museum will be keen to document, and present the history of RF342 regardless of the display presentation, and would welcome any photos, service histories, crew recollections of RF342.

At this stage I think colour schemes and identities are along way off being a problem to resolve, but thankyou for your thoughts.

I understand from the SAM Publications Modellers DataFile on the Lancaster, Manchester and Lincoln, page 55, that 16 RAF B2 Lincolns were also operated in Australia with WRE including the two python engine test beds RE339 and RF403, and that only RE418 was ever returned back to the UK while RA640, RA644, RE258, RE259, R423 and RF403 were all scrapped at Woomera (although seperate reference is made elsewhere of RF403 being scrapped at Tocumwal).

Of course RAF Lincolns also served in the Malayan Emergency along side Australian 1 Sqn RAAF Mark 30 Lincolns with RAF Squadrons, 7, 61, 83, 97, 100 and 148.

So there is quite a story to tell of Lincoln operations in the “local” area.

Tom H thanks for the heads up on those two entities I will certainly make inquiries, would you have any details on anyone who has dont onsite survey of the wreckage?

regards

Mark Pilkington

First of all, well done on finally getting this old girl to a point where she may be given a little love and attention:- even if it is half a world away from me. I went looking for her when she was near Doncaster, only to be told it had departed. On hearing the general location it was heading to I originally thought it might have been to do with the Dambusters remake.

Anyway, my view is that the identity of the aircraft should remain RF342. I realise you say this would depend on securing the cockpit section, but I would imagine this went missing years ago, as when she was used by Cranfield she was fitted with a Lancaster nose section anyway!!! I know the cockpit section (Lancaster) that was with her still exists.

In this way you could rebuild RF342 to B.30 spec… but it would never pretend to be something it isn’t, by wearing a serial number never assigned to her.

Best Regards,

Richard W