Me 110 Crashed Woodcote Surrey Sept 9TH 1940

Wow! I wasn’t expecting the mystery-object to look like that; thanks for posting the scan.

Looking at that scan I’d put a totally different interpretation on the purpose of the object; I now think it is a ceremonial, spiritual or religious object.

…apparently the small piece of paper found inside was burnt…..it must have been burnt before the crash, but why?

So if the paper inside the object wasn’t accidentally burnt in the crash then it must have been burnt beforehand and so was probably burnt deliberately. Why would somebody deliberately burn a piece of paper with writing on it? The obvious reason is to destroy and therefore conceal the writing but then why throw it from the aircraft if it was already burnt; and when exactly was it burnt, surely not during the dogfight?

What if it was burnt before the aircraft took-off? But then why carry it at all if it was burnt and unreadable?

The only explanation I can offer is that it was some sort of spiritual or religious offering, such as a spell or prayer, which was written down and then burnt and carried by a member of the crew in the hope that it would bring good luck. It is not really my field of interest but I believe things of this nature are (or were) done. I can’t think of another explanation.

Wow! I wasn’t expecting the mystery-object to look like that; thanks for posting the scan.

Looking at that scan I’d put a totally different interpretation on the purpose of the object; I now think it is a ceremonial, spiritual or religious object.

…apparently the small piece of paper found inside was burnt…..it must have been burnt before the crash, but why?

So if the paper inside the object wasn’t accidentally burnt in the crash then it must have been burnt beforehand and so was probably burnt deliberately. Why would somebody deliberately burn a piece of paper with writing on it? The obvious reason is to destroy and therefore conceal the writing but then why throw it from the aircraft if it was already burnt; and when exactly was it burnt, surely not during the dogfight?

What if it was burnt before the aircraft took-off? But then why carry it at all if it was burnt and unreadable?

The only explanation I can offer is that it was some sort of spiritual or religious offering, such as a spell or prayer, which was written down and then burnt and carried by a member of the crew in the hope that it would bring good luck. It is not really my field of interest but I believe things of this nature are (or were) done. I can’t think of another explanation.

Thanks for your reply the news paper was local but i do not have the date it could have been the Sutton Advertiser

Thanks for your reply the news paper was local but i do not have the date it could have been the Sutton Advertiser

Thanks for the photo Alpine. That is a strange looking object. Unfortunately the guy from the website I linked to has not replied to my email. I’ll keep trying to ID it though. Is that newspaper clipping a local or national paper?

Thanks for the photo Alpine. That is a strange looking object. Unfortunately the guy from the website I linked to has not replied to my email. I’ll keep trying to ID it though. Is that newspaper clipping a local or national paper?

BF110 Crash

http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/attachment.php?attachmentid=203933&stc=1&d=1331668913 The Mystery Relic could have been donated to the Imperial War some time ago but that is only a guess on my part i am afraid that’s all the information i have at this time

BF110 Crash

http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/attachment.php?attachmentid=203933&stc=1&d=1331668913 The Mystery Relic could have been donated to the Imperial War some time ago but that is only a guess on my part i am afraid that’s all the information i have at this time

Thanks Alpine any photos and additional details will be interesting. Maybe the message was not for British Intelligence eyes. Who know’s interesting story non the less. 🙂

Thanks Alpine any photos and additional details will be interesting. Maybe the message was not for British Intelligence eyes. Who know’s interesting story non the less. 🙂

Interesting, do you own this artefact? Has the German message ever been translated? Maybe the crew member wanted this message to survive for a loved one back home upon realising his inevitable fate was fast approaching? Or maybe an attempt to help ID his remains? Who knows but it’s certainly worth investigating. This artefact rightly belongs to be passed on to the family if this is the case. There are people who can be contacted to maybe take this further if the item turns out to be of interest. 🙂

I don’t own the object but i have a picture i could scan it if your interested i think you are right about it being a map reading instrument apparently the small piece of paper found inside was burnt so no luck there. As far as i know it must have been burnt before the crash but why? The person who found the object was doing some research but i don’t know how he got on he was living about three miles away from me about 12yrs ago so perhaps i could find out more if i could contact him

Interesting, do you own this artefact? Has the German message ever been translated? Maybe the crew member wanted this message to survive for a loved one back home upon realising his inevitable fate was fast approaching? Or maybe an attempt to help ID his remains? Who knows but it’s certainly worth investigating. This artefact rightly belongs to be passed on to the family if this is the case. There are people who can be contacted to maybe take this further if the item turns out to be of interest. 🙂

I don’t own the object but i have a picture i could scan it if your interested i think you are right about it being a map reading instrument apparently the small piece of paper found inside was burnt so no luck there. As far as i know it must have been burnt before the crash but why? The person who found the object was doing some research but i don’t know how he got on he was living about three miles away from me about 12yrs ago so perhaps i could find out more if i could contact him

Thanks, I’ve taken the liberty to email the gentleman who runs the site I linked above. I included all of the descriptive details about the object posted by Alpine. Especially the circle wings (possible) logo to see if the guy can work out what it is? I’ll keep you posted. 🙂

Thanks, I’ve taken the liberty to email the gentleman who runs the site I linked above. I included all of the descriptive details about the object posted by Alpine. Especially the circle wings (possible) logo to see if the guy can work out what it is? I’ll keep you posted. 🙂

That sounds too much of a coincidence to be a coincidence…..excellent research; but what could it have been?

…wings above a circle…

The symbol of the Nazi military; an eagle carrying a swastika (in a circle) in its talons?

That sounds too much of a coincidence to be a coincidence…..excellent research; but what could it have been?

…wings above a circle…

The symbol of the Nazi military; an eagle carrying a swastika (in a circle) in its talons?

Maybe a mathematical or navigation instrument? Note the company name, location, and post code?

From here: http://www.mathsinstruments.me.uk/page8.html

Holtgebaum & Heinicke AG, Berlin NW7 “CHROM-PVII” branded set dating from c1940. An early example of a chromium plated brass set brought to England by a soldier at the end of World War II. The instruments have the same, stylised windmill Ecobra trademark as the set below. Made by Bayerische Reisszeugfabrik (formerly Eichmüller & Co, now Ecobra) and retailed by Holtgebaum & Heinicke AG.

Maybe a mathematical or navigation instrument? Note the company name, location, and post code?

From here: http://www.mathsinstruments.me.uk/page8.html

Holtgebaum & Heinicke AG, Berlin NW7 “CHROM-PVII” branded set dating from c1940. An early example of a chromium plated brass set brought to England by a soldier at the end of World War II. The instruments have the same, stylised windmill Ecobra trademark as the set below. Made by Bayerische Reisszeugfabrik (formerly Eichmüller & Co, now Ecobra) and retailed by Holtgebaum & Heinicke AG.

…inside was a piece of paper with a message in German also inscribed on the relic was the name G Heinicke Berlin 7

Possibly this is the name of the manufacturer rather than the owner (since it clearly doesn’t tie-in with the names of the crew) or possibly it is the name of who the message was intended for?

It seems incredible that the message was not translated at the time (unless it was taken by the British authorities) and the fact that it hasn’t been translated now leads me to believe that it no longer exists. It would be a great shame if the message was lost to history after all this time and after, apparently, successfully finding its way back into human hands after being thrown from an aircraft in the process of crashing.

…inside was a piece of paper with a message in German also inscribed on the relic was the name G Heinicke Berlin 7

Possibly this is the name of the manufacturer rather than the owner (since it clearly doesn’t tie-in with the names of the crew) or possibly it is the name of who the message was intended for?

It seems incredible that the message was not translated at the time (unless it was taken by the British authorities) and the fact that it hasn’t been translated now leads me to believe that it no longer exists. It would be a great shame if the message was lost to history after all this time and after, apparently, successfully finding its way back into human hands after being thrown from an aircraft in the process of crashing.