Miles Messenger memories

Great stuff, many thanks……………………M

Glad to hear another Messenger is receiving some TLC, any chance you have a picture of the parts from G-AJFF, i used to pass it several times a week in a Garage forecourt near Elstree Aerodrome………….Martin

Miles Messenger 4a. G-ALAI.

Having googled a search on another matter I was interested to see this thread/topic which despite being stale I feel I can add some further information having had a part share in her in the late sixties.

She was then operated by “The Fourways Flying Group” at Middleton St.George, now Durham TeesValley, and based in Number 1 Hangar where she is seen posed in one of the photos. Same photo in Ian Allen’s “Civil Aircraft Markings” of 1969. I don’t recall the red fin flashes but memory dims. In the same Hangar was Messenger 2a G-AJWB owned by Les Povey in the colours shown in the photo on page 4. We were always given to understand that AI was one of the Monty aircraft and certainly the interior was lavishly finished in Burgundy upholstery complete with plaited tassle hand holds. I recall on one visit to Deauville the local Aero Club members were very impressed and after several interior inspections she was given several accolades such as “La plus Grande Vitesse limousine de l’air”.

My style of flying differed from my fellow group members in that I felt planes were for touring and we did many many trips in her but getting ‘consent’ to leave the area conflicted with the other members whose ideas went not much further that a Sunday jolly round the lighthouse.

Our C of A was annual and took some time to complete so that we often joked that by the time we got her back from one inspection it was almost time for the next. Inspections were done at Sywell by Brooklands Aviation so Alpha India was a common sight down there as well. We reckon she knew the way there so well we could just let her find her own way til we saw the Reservoir.

As C of A inspections covered all equipment we soon learned to strip out the Radio, ADF and other ‘non essentials’ so that Brooklands only got the bare airframe to work on. When safely back home it was quite easy to re-instal what we had removed and that way we kept the bills down.

A few fond memories if anyone is interested.

On one trip to France I stopped off at Biggn Hill for an overnight and was in the bar of Surrey and Kent Flying Club when a chap came in with a lump of metal in his hand. “Yours I believe” he said. It was an exhaust stub off the Gypsy Major. Just as well it came off when it did.

On another we had been stuck at Berke sur Mere for two days due to autumnal “Brume” but one morning it seemed to have cleared enough to make the channel crossing via the Light Aircraft Corridor. And so it proved until having cleared the coast at Cap Gris Nez on a heading for Folkstone the sky and the flat sea merged and there was no ground reference to fly by. In danger of spatial disorientation I hastily trimmed her straight and level as we overflew the Varne Light vessel and was very pleased when a thin white line ahead gradually emerged as the chalk cliffs. I think we strayed off track quite a bit by keeping them in sight.

Once we landed at Castle Donington for Sunday lunch with friends and on departigI remember that whilst on the long taxiway to the holding point we were followed by a BAC 111. With a stiff crosswind pulling at our three fins we were taking it very carefully and the Captain of the One eleven was not happy and radioed for us to hurry along. I agreed, but he got uptight and wanted us to speed up as he was burning fuel for which as Captain he was ‘responsible!’ I just radioed back that as Captain I was not only responsible for the safety of my aircraft but also responsible for actually paying for the fuel I was using. Tower was heard to chuckle.
There are many more happy stories to tell one day but that is enough for now. I may have hung up my well used Dalton Navigational Computer Mk IIIf but it is still in my flight bag. Probably an antique now in this age of Apps and GPS

After a happy time with ALAI we sadly decided to part with her in 1970 and she was sold to a Butcher from Mirfield, W.Yorks. I was very sorry to learn that on his first foreign trip he had run out of fuel and had forced landed in Northern France and damaged our gallant old lady and friend of many years beyond repair.

Found this one in my prints. Haven’t checked the negative collection, yet.

Many thanks

Many thanks, Planemike.
I’ve got those two now.
Mike

Mike………..

Have checked the David Whitworth collection, do not appear to be there.

However the Jackson Collection appears to have a negative of each aircraft.
http://www.ajjcollection.co.uk

Planemike

PS ABPIC to the rescue for G-ALCS http://www.abpic.co.uk/results.php?q=G-ALCS&fields=all&sort=latest&limit=10

G-AJOD and G-ALCS

Hi, I wonder if anyone has photos of my father’s Messenger G-AJOD or his Gemini G-ALCS.

He is aged 95 years now and I think it would give him great pleasure to see his old aircraft.

Best to all
Mike

G-ALAW quite possibly Skegness Ingoldmells,the wings were in the rafters 1966.
Superb photos,beats all the look-a-like types flying today.

Messie with tundra tyres

I have just swapped Emails with Peter Amos, the Miles guru who is very excited indeed at the image of the Messenger with big wheels. I expect he will visit this forum shortly and explain all. The incident is well documented but previously never thought to have been photographed.

Great thread!

HP

What a great forum

I am so glad i stumbled across this forum which hosts the most amazing collection of messanger photo,s i have ever come across in one place,its prompted to pick up once again tracking down the three messangers that Field Marshall Montgomery [monty] used during the war.
Where i left it some years ago now,this is from my memory as i can,t find my notes at present,monty used three messengers between 1943 and may1945 from what i gather from extracts of his personal pilot [eddie russell] logs all of which had a tail no RG333 and all being messanger 1,s with the earlier engine, larger rear side window configuration and earlier flap design after march 1945 he used a Fiesler storch pronounced [stalk] which was captured from the germans and found to have better S,T,O L capability better undercarrige for rough terrain which monty prefferd over the messenger.
Thus far i was able to rule out its not any of the messangers that are claiming otherwise as monty did not use a messanger built after may 1945 so i guess the quest continues, a interesting point i had discoverd though is that both monty and Winston Churchill flew together to france in a miles messenger piloted by eddie russell tail sign RG333 prior to the german surrender to monty.

Last set (for now):

G-AKIN (Still active Sywell), Cambridge 24-2-51:

G-AKIN again, 1950:

G-AKKG (W/O 1-6-68) Luton 22-7-51:

G-AKKG again, White Waltham 15-6-52:

G-AKKM (W/O 5-2-58) Cambridge 9-6-51:

G-AKZU (To F-BGOM 1952) Cambridge 4-7-51:

G-ALAG (W/O 30-12-57) Gatwick 19-7-51:

G-ALBE (Wfu by 1965) Hendon 21-7-51:

G-ALBE again, Hatfield 23-6-51:

The revival of this thread prompts me to add some more fifties Messenger photos. As before, all were taken by the late Gerald Lawrance, digitised and made available by Tony Clarke. Three or four have already been posted on my 1950’s posts, but are repeated here for completeness. Dates and locations unknown unless stated.

EI-AFH (Ex and To G-AKBL 1950-1953) W/O 1-4-53. Hatfield 23-6-51:

EI-AFH again at Luton 22-7-51:

G-AGPX (Wfu by 1962) Denham 7-3-53:

G-AHZS (Wfu by 1962) Cambridge 3-7-51:

G-AHZT (Wfu by 1970) Shoreham May 1958:

G-AIAJ (Scrapped Stapleford 1965) Cambridge 3-7-51:

G-AIEK (Still active as RG333):

G-AILI (W/O 23-5-64):

G-AILL (Wfu by 1973) Cambridge 4-7-51:

G-AISL (Wfu by 1967):

G-AISL again, Broxbourne 1-7-52:

G-AJDM (Scrapped Stapleford 1962) Cambridge 1951:

G-AJOC (Wfu by 1982) Stored?

G-AJYZ (Wfu by 1968) Cambridge 6-5-51:

Messengers

A great aircraft. I used to own G-AKBO, the aircraft used in the opening sequences of 633 Sq. Great fun to fly and rivaled my Storch in STOL performance, in addition to flying a lot faster on half the gas and carrying (at least) 2 more people.

I also own Falcon G-AEEG and Magister G-AKPF.

‘KBO was until recently stored at Enstone but has now changed hands and is under restoration to fly again.

I will alert Peter Amos, the Miles guru, to this thread. There was a Miles thread here that ran and ran several years ago. I wonder if it could be linked?

All the best

HP

old friends

Oh sorry about that. I got my Messengers messed up:eek::D:D Ofcourse I meant to write AJOE, but that is easy to say after the event:D:D

Wow,that has to be the most extensive restoration of a miles messanger that i have ever come across,my father owned this aircraft GA-JOE in the 70,s and maybe the early 8o,s aswell, we had it based at staverton airport,churchdown,glos,when he owned Ga-joe he carried out extensive refurbishment mindful to keep as original as possible,some of the refurb included zero time engine build,prop,radio nav overhaul,new dope coverings and he put it back into R,A,F colours with invasion markings and registerd it,RH378,at the time RG333 was also based at staverton and both these aircraft often travelled and displayed together at a number of airshows and gatherings,it was some sight watching the pair climbing out on prop wash just hanging in the air,a truly great aircraft that we had fantastic times in especially with the unbelievalbe S.T.O.L capabilities,i swear we flew backwards on more than one occassion.

G-AKBO at Scone …. from Colin Lourie’s supurb collection ….. Keith.

DCW and Duxman, don’t wait – start your own threads on topics relevant to the images in the collection and then post away. I don’t think that you’ll hear anyone complaining!

Messengers

Would it be reasonable to assume that the late Mr Lawrence had a penchant for Messengers or is his collection of negatives more broadly based?

No – Its just that there were a lot about in the late 40s and 50s !! As DCW indicates he and I are currently in the process of scanning a lot of Gerrys old negatives dated from the late 40s. He lived in Cambridge hence a lot of the images are taken at Cambridge Airport perhaps easily recognised by the old airport control or the apron outside hanger 1 or alternatively with the old cement works in the background.

Duxman

Originally Posted by DCW
Just waiting for the opportunity to post the Geminis, Proctors, Tiger Moths, Austers, Rapides….
Not to mention the Vikings, Bristol Freighters, Hermes, Yorks, Tudors…
Or the Valiants, Canberras, Lincolns
Those were the days.

Several parts of my body are quite moist after reading that ?????

Waiting !! Keith.

Just waiting for the opportunity to post the Geminis, Proctors, Tiger Moths, Austers, Rapides….
Not to mention the Vikings, Bristol Freighters, Hermes, Yorks, Tudors…
Or the Valiants, Canberras, Lincolns
Those were the days.

Indeed they were………..!!!! A load of Airbuses and RVs are just not in the same league……..!!!!

Planemike

Just waiting for the opportunity to post the Geminis, Proctors, Tiger Moths, Austers, Rapides….
Not to mention the Vikings, Bristol Freighters, Hermes, Yorks, Tudors…
Or the Valiants, Canberras, Lincolns
Those were the days.