July 8, 2004 at 2:58 am
I had posted this in the Navy thread but GarryB and I have been discussing this privately and now we’re curious as to others insight on this subject!
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After the DCR came out I have spent the past few months picking it to bits and have now come up with some questions.
1. The Two Adelaide class FFG’s that are to be paid off, will they be sold off and if so to whom and at what price? I see New Zealand could use these in their attempt to gain a more common navy with ours which is their plan to also help them reduce their costs in maintainence.
2. The two Huon class MHC’s which are to be mothballed in Sydney, why not lease them out to either New Zealand or Papua New Guinea (both of whom have need of such ships). Surely the monies generated in such a venture who be welcome. And if the government should need the ships an clause could be entered into such a contract in which both said navies would willingly honer at any calling.

HMAS Huon MHC 82
3. The four FFG’s left in the fleet are to be upgraded with a Mk-42 VLS forward of the current Mk-13 Rail launcher. the Mk-42’s are to house SM-2’s under current plans and not ESSM’s as reported originally. Given this error, is there to be an increase in SM-2 capacity onboard said ships or are the reporters correct in what they account and the DCR was a misprint regarding missiles? If it is to be SM-2’s, then why not invest in the more capable SM-3’s which are better suited for the very publicly mentioned Ballistic Missile Defence Shield program?
4. The two LHD’s that are to be aquired to enter service between 2010 and 2015 are said to be of 20K Tonnes, having this in mind, and also noting that they must also have 6 landing spots oin each deck to handle aircraft upto CH-47 size. One if forced to note that HMS Ocean is in this catagory, is this what the DoD has in mind for our RAN? it all fits into place and Ocean has been designed to accomadate Harriers on occasion, another pre-requsite for our new ships (jet operations and capability)!

HMS Ocean, note the six landing spots for Helo ops!
5. The DCR also acknowlodges the AAW difiency and it’s importance. With Three such ships being of need, why are we still waiting for an answer on which ship we are to get? Of the three contending designs:
Gibbs and Cox International Frigate has never been built and thus can not be seriously counted as a contender, especially since it is coming from a design company with no experience at all and that not one of the G&C ships is in service in any navy let alone it’s home countries!
MEKO F-124 is a serious contender mainly for it’s commonality with our other MEKO products, namely the MEKO 200’s or Anzac class. The only draw back on this design would be intergration of AEGIS radar which the government has said is primary to it’s naval needs, and thus leaves us to our last contender.

MEKO F-124, FGS Sachsen (F219)
IZAR F-100, this class of ship is the first to be built outside the US with the US AGEIS radar, it has very strong performance figures and very low maning (another requirement factor), Spain has a similar climate condition to that of Australia and as such hardly any work would be needed to convert these ships toward RAN use. It has all the weaponry the RAN is current with and uses the same engine system that our current fleet has thus intergration of such ships can not be a problem, Spain and IZAR have offered very reasonable prices of the ships with full building options in Australian yards, something the American’s aren’t willing to give and of the german firm they are requiring that they build part of the ship with final fitout to take place in Australia.

IZAR’s F-100, Alvaro de Bazan (F101)
If Australia is to make a stance against foregin influence on it’s defence issues then surely the Spainish deal presents the best solution!
By: Ja Worsley - 15th July 2004 at 16:34
Hmmm ok here are my questions…
1. Will the radar also be upgraded under a seperate deal, if so why wasn’t it included in this deal?
2. How many missiles will be aquired, is there a local production facility deal included (for that price I seriously doubt it)?
3. Is this going to replace the SM-1 missiles spots on these ships, thus correcting the miss information given in the DCR 03 document and thus meaning that the Mk-41 launcher systems to be installed are actually for the ESSM after all.
4. Given these major modifications, will these ships now be redesignated “Darwin Class” ships? Also will these now be classified as Destroyers rather than Frigates under international Maritime military system?
By: GDL - 15th July 2004 at 07:40
SM-2: Its official
The RAN will be getting SM-2s for four of the FFGs.
Navy gets $550m missile upgrade
So will this mean they will be fitted with ESSM and SM-2?
By: Ja Worsley - 9th July 2004 at 04:36
IZAR are certainly the favourite to win the AAW and the SPS but I think that the government is looking at seperate contracts still, which is why Latham has to get voted in, he can see the sence of what is going on!
Here are the details of the IZAR design for the Strategic Projection Ship
DCN’s bid, here is the Batiments de Projection
By: koxinga - 9th July 2004 at 04:04
Izar is not the only one on the table. Armaris is also in the running with a modified Mistral design.
By: GDL - 9th July 2004 at 03:29
But then you aussies have been expending a lot of effort and giving up a lot of credibility locally in your effort to suck up to uncle sam… would it make sense to just turn your back on that?
Consdering the RAN is looking at the IZAR Strategic Projection Ship (SPS) as an option for a future amphibious requirement, the Spanish would be mad not to try and do a joint-deal for the two RAN requirements, AAW DDGs, and the SPS. If this happens, then you can bet the savings in many millions would make it hard for the RAN to ignore, and therefore press hard to get it sealed, despite whatever pro-US stance our little Johnny Howard might have.
By: Ja Worsley - 8th July 2004 at 04:21
Trust me mate, the feeling over here, well with all the people I know in the different states that is, all hate the way the John Howard has ridden the back of George Bush. I seriously think that when the election comes, I would be very supprised to see Johnny retain power, even after his slime finding mission digging up all this dirt on the opposition leader
By: Arabella-Cox - 8th July 2004 at 03:48
If Australia is to make a stance against foregin influence on it’s defence issues then surely the Spainish deal presents the best solution!
But then you aussies have been expending a lot of effort and giving up a lot of credibility locally in your effort to suck up to uncle sam… would it make sense to just turn your back on that?