New 717-300X!!

Hello there again! en dank je wel voor het welkom

Just to comment some bit on how I found out about the 717 order. Last week I was talking with a CRJ-200 pilot of Tyrolean. I inquired about if he would be interested in flying the larger CRJ-700 and if Tyrolean would make a same move as Lufthansa did (they acquired CRJ7 after D8’s, CRJ1 & CRJ2) He responded with a big no, because they were going to start training for the B717 for which Tyrolean and other members will take a big order in the near future.

He told me that with the B717 (and combination of the Fokker 70/CRJ200/B737(Lauda)/MD87(Austrian)) they will not have a need for the CRJ7. Lufthansa’s fleet structure is a different one in comparison with the Austrian Group’s one: LH have the B146/B735/CRJ7 to cover for the B717 and not yet ready to be replaced whilst OS has a need for the F70 of Tyrolean, M87 of Austrian and B733 of Lauda to be replaced. Later on the week a representative told me remembering reading about it internally, but was not able to comment any more. So I must admit the fragile status of this message, but it is certainly worth keeping an eye on.

With kind regards!

Well as a pilot perhaps he would know about future training plans for a new plane.

Welkom aan boord!

I read your post regarding this on scramble as well. There you mention that a pilot told you this. It’s not that I don’t trust you, but could it be possible that he is fooling you? Why would a pilot, from the regional division no less, know about the future fleet plans.

You also mentioned on scramble that LH probably won’t go for the 717. Now he [b]might[/b] have some knowledge of Tyrollean/Arrows, but why would he know what LH is up to?

Still, welcome on board! I hope you will like your stay!

Originally posted by robc
If i remember its for the space station so that the astronuats have a vehicle to come back down in or along those lines…

It’s the X-38, a lifeboat for the ISS. I visited Houston last summer and got to see the manufacturing hangar at the Johnson Space Center. I don’t own a scanner so I can’t share my pictures but here’s a picture from NASA. It’s the 2/3rd scale test bed.

Interesting , thanks.

Welcome on board by the way.

Star Alliance orders 717

Hi all,

First time on the forum. I’m working at the AMS Schiphol airport and a civil aviation enthousiast. Sometimes I find out about some ‘news’ So here’s a first:

According to Tyrolean Airways – (or re-branded as Austrian Arrows, Dash8Q400 showed up on the Vienna-Amsterdam services in new colours) – representatives the Group (Lauda-Austrian-Tyrolean) will take part in a Star Alliance wide order for the Boeing 717. Crew-training will start next year and an official statement will be made public before the end of this year. It will not be a surprise if the order will comprise both 717-200 and -300 (developed in conjunction with Star Alliance demands)

Comments anyone? I would like to know which other partner in the Alliance will take the 717? Probably not Lufthansa, because their needs already are covered with the 737-500, CRJ-700 and (aging) Bae 146’s.

OK all! Looking forward to your comments!

Originally posted by KabirT
oh you mean the Scramjet?:confused:

If i remember its for the space station so that the astronuats have a vehicle to come back down in or along those lines…

oh you mean the Scramjet?:confused:

So anybody know how the X39 or whatever that boeing spacecraft programm is going? 🙂

Originally posted by robc
Okay perhaps Airbus is cheaper than boeing! But one big reason is that the EU is pumping money into airbus, not only that but boeing has a huge military division and also has to put reasearch and money into that.

Im not biased in any direction, becuase i love airbus as much as boeing, its just that boeing is being unfairly critized

I agree on the EU part.

Dont worry…i myself am a staunt Boeing supporter!!:D

I believe they are looking at a smaller version also called the 717-LITE

Okay perhaps Airbus is cheaper than boeing! But one big reason is that the EU is pumping money into airbus, not only that but boeing has a huge military division and also has to put reasearch and money into that.

Im not biased in any direction, becuase i love airbus as much as boeing, its just that boeing is being unfairly critized

Originally posted by Hand87_5
Correct: The B717 (ex MD95) is a brand new jet compared to the old DC9 or the MD80 series.

Modern avionic , state of art engines etc …
It is one of the most efficient fuel comsumption in the industry.

However , what woul be a 717-300? Some kind of “lower range” 737-700 ?

If someone has more infos , I’m interested…

agreed about 717…modern avionics, engines….but its not a whole new aircraft.

B717-300 will be something similar to B736 i think?

tenthije thanx for the info.

Depends on how you are comparing. Recently Airbus has indeed sold more A340’s due to the succes of the A345 and A346. Before that Boeing ruled with a large margin.

Originally posted by PhantomII

These 717’s are brand-new. They aren’t 35 year old DC-9’s.

Correct: The B717 (ex MD95) is a brand new jet compared to the old DC9 or the MD80 series.

Modern avionic , state of art engines etc …
It is one of the most efficient fuel comsumption in the industry.

However , what woul be a 717-300? Some kind of “lower range” 737-700 ?

If someone has more infos , I’m interested…

I think A340 has more in the bag than the 777……can anyone shed some light on this?

Originally posted by PhantomII
I’d be interested in seeing what area of the market Boeing has not covered or a new design as well Kabir.

I still feel a double standard in favor of Airbus.

The A320, A321, A319, A318 are all essentially shortened and lengthened versions of the same airplane just like Boeing did with the 737 and Douglas did with the DC-9.

The A300 and A310 are very similar, with length being the big difference again.

Then you have the A330 and A340 which is only different in terms of engines used.

And an old airframe isn’t a big issue if its proven and they are still making new ones.

These 717’s are brand-new. They aren’t 35 year old DC-9’s.

And the 777? What does Airbus have that compares in both capacity and range?

The A340-600 might be close, but that’s pushing it.

And until the A380 comes out the 747 is still jumbo king, and we’ll just have to wait until the 7E7 comes out to see what it holds.

You’re being premature in your judgements.

Just because Airbus is getting more sales now doesn’t mean that will continue.

You are completely missing my point.

What i am trying to say is even if Boeing has covered all the areas, they are not covering them with economical solutions.

The B717 IS NOT brand new…its the MD 95 (or 85?) refurbished thats all.

The 777…Airbus has the A340 series which unfortunately is geting more sales than the B777. Although agreed B777 is much better than A340…but the economics of A340 are better.

About the B747…lets face it its time is up….the A380 will be out in 2006, the only few orders the B747 is geting are for the ER and F versions.

Alitalia should be in need for replacements to their older MD-88 fleet, and this 717-300 would be the answer.

I’d be interested in seeing what area of the market Boeing has not covered or a new design as well Kabir.

I still feel a double standard in favor of Airbus.

The A320, A321, A319, A318 are all essentially shortened and lengthened versions of the same airplane just like Boeing did with the 737 and Douglas did with the DC-9.

The A300 and A310 are very similar, with length being the big difference again.

Then you have the A330 and A340 which is only different in terms of engines used.

And an old airframe isn’t a big issue if its proven and they are still making new ones.

These 717’s are brand-new. They aren’t 35 year old DC-9’s.

And the 777? What does Airbus have that compares in both capacity and range?

The A340-600 might be close, but that’s pushing it.

And until the A380 comes out the 747 is still jumbo king, and we’ll just have to wait until the 7E7 comes out to see what it holds.

You’re being premature in your judgements.

Just because Airbus is getting more sales now doesn’t mean that will continue.

The question is not really of class here…….. is the aircraft offered in that class is economicaly competative with Airbus.

Boeings short-haul fleet is, the midium size is where Boeing is very much loosing it. They have the B767 and the B777 to offer which are loosing out to A330/A340, simply because the Airbus series is more conomical than Boeing even though its not as good as Boeing.

Airline today look at economics more than total passenger comfort agree or not, and bringing old airframes of MD’s into the market will not help Boeing in gaining that economical edge over Airbus.

See it this way, Airbus A320 family offers the A318, 319, 320 and 321….. each aircrafts fits a particular role…. Boeing tried the same..B737 500/600, which failed, both the aircrafts were guzling gas more than expected.

The A320 and family share the same base, but with total different parts given to them and them being designed for those roles itself.

The B737 500/600 did not do this, they were from same base as B737-400, and they were not customized as much to suit the roles what airlines were looking for.