Owner ponders electric motor to replace rotary engine in restored Avro 504

My range-anxiety comment, with regard to WWI era aircraft, was made with my tongue firmly embedded in my cheek. My limited experience of aircraft of that era is at Old Warden and I wouldn’t be surprised to find that one eye was permanently focussed on the landing strip anyway, just in case.

It seems as far as classic cars are concerned, electric conversions are hugely expensive and massively reduce the value of the vehicle.

Possibly an over-generalisation and it may change in the future but that’s my current impression.

In respect of aeroplanes, who knows?

Sabrejet…

As I said, I don’t have an issue with an electric conversion of this Avro. It makes more sense than many other projects.

If I were to fly it, I’d worry less about an electric motor than an original.

“Range anxiety ” is pretty much a non issue since most WWI types stick pretty close to the field (or bare areas suitable for a deadstick)…if the pilot is smart. 

​​​Yes, some people are converting classic cars to electric, but not many.  Pick up a copy of Classic and Sports Car…you will not find a headlong rush of average owners (of which Jay Leno…friends who know him say he’s a great guy…is not) chucking their ICEs in vintage cars. I’m not saying it won’t happen, but it hasn’t yet.

I write for an international classic car magazine. I haven’t noticed many conversions at events or on the market. You see a few pop stars and celebrities doing it, but not in the classics you are likely to see at a local show or pub.

Remember, the AVERAGE classic is not used on a daily basis, making any savings in petrol or carbon less of an issue. If I had a wedding car business in London, sure, convert the old Rolls, but a guy in Kent who takes his (Triumph) Spitfire on B roads on sunny days, probably won’t.

While I respecting the wishes of the owner and restorer, I wonder if they have considered the loss of character and flying characteristics associated with changing the Le Rhone to electric power?

Let’s not forget the ongoing losses we have already experienced of those who are suitably trained and qualified to maintain these wonderful machines.

The times they are a changing.

No, he’s a seriously loaded antique car collector.

Range anxiety is apparently bad enough on the ground, let alone when airborne.

“By: J Boyle – 21st February 2024 at 17:49  – Edited 21st February 2024 at 17:54

cometguymk1…

Run of the mill antique car collectors are not rushing headlong into conversions.”

 “Run of the mill antique car collectors”. First world issues eh? Electric is a great way to go: if a Warner is Ok in place of a Le Rhone, then why not electric?

And is Jay Leno as “Run of the mill antique car collector”? He has EV conversions already.

I suppose, but this 504 would be an aircraft restoration equivalent to the “man in a shed” conversion. 

cometguymk1…

However, most of the “classic car” electric conversions are either guys in sheds, or more visibly, companies doing high end conversions and charging an absolute fortune (£200,000) for them.

They are usually bought by rich folk or celebrities looking to make a statement..like the converted E-type in the fairly recent wedding of the silly guy to that ghastly actress.

Run of the mill antique car collectors are not rushing headlong into conversions.

Yes, feel free to convert a Mini, but if you pull the V-12 out of a Ferrari GTO, is it still a GTO?

wet fuels not going anywhere soon.

Well Junkers are making new planes using turbine engines with its corrugated skin system.Everything old is new again.

Electric power is already a hot topic in the vintage car world with a fair few cars having been converted in recent years to make them “future ready”. With the lack of fuels and oils becoming an increasingly big issue for operators it must be tempting  

Perhaps there is some way to ‘play’ the sound of the authentic engine over the feint hum of the electric motor.

Hornby seem to be doing this with some of their latest high-accuracy model steam locos!

To satisfy the purists…or really to ensure the final project doesn’t look like the dog’s breakfast….

How about mounting an electric motor in a 3-D printing produced plastic Le Rhone case?

The battery would take the place of the fuel tank (to avoid any CG issues).

After watching the somewhat problematic operations of a Le Rhone in a friend’s new Sopwith Pup replica, I’d rather take my chances in an electric powered  machine…provided the person doing the swap actually knew what he was doing and not just  some ill-experienced guy in a shed.

Obviously, overall weight and CG would be huge issues as would sourcing a dependable motor…probably something not just off Amazon!

As far as the 3- D printed case, yes it will be expensive, but if one is serious about this and not just looking for a lifetime project which will never fly,  then cough up the £ and do it correctly or don’t do it at all. After all, an aeroplane is not like “restoring ” a Reliant 3-wheeler on Wheeler Dealers.

So, a disguised electric would be a better option than putting a incorrect-looking modern engine in something of that era. 

As far as my friend’s Sopwith…It was beautifully built and very accurate. But in addition to its …shall we say challenging flying qualities (or lack thereof), you had the extra thrill of wondering when the 100 year old rotary was going to pack up.

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It’ll be blue tooth ,cordless 🙂   — sorry 🙂  LOL. It’ll be a sad day when engine sounds die for good. 

gona need some long extention lead