P-51 Mustang operations on aircraft carriers

Thanks JT for a very informative post and sharing these photos! I had always read (and figured) that the belly scoop was an issue for a naval Mustang, that it could cause a pitching-forward issue when ditching. Can anyone confirm this? I’ve seen a very clever “What If?” model of a “Seastang” with relocated radiator to get around this.

The talk of B-25 trials is fascinating, too.

The US Navy’s SEU (Ship Experimental Unit), which was tasked with the P-51 carrier trials, also conducted land-based and shipboard catapult tests for all of the main USAAF fighters – the P-51, P-40, P-39, P-38, P-47, and P-61. This was so that they could be delivered and launched from “Jeep” carriers in the North African and South Pacific Theatres. Fitted with bolt-on catapult hooks, the SEU’s job was to determine feasibility, trim tab and flap settings, and flight characteristics. The P-51 trials of course were considerably different and with requirements that were far more challenging than the other USAAF fighters.

The Mustang looked like it would be good for carrier ops. Wonder why they didn’t pursue it?

The main reason why it was never pursued was that the low speed lateral control on the Mustang wasn’t very good, and therefore it was deemed unsatisfactory for carrier operations.

And, as John points out, the taking Iwo Jima no doubt played it’s part as well.

Still, an interesting project, and always fascinating to see the pics and hear about the history of the trials.

Cheers

Paul

There was only one P-51D that was used for carrier trials. The program, conducted by the SEU (Ship Experimental Unit) saw P-51D-5-NA, 44-14017, borrowed by the Navy in the Fall of 1944 and modified with the addition of a tail hook, as well as a holdback bar/lasso at the base of the tail and a pendant-type hook at the base of the firewall, for use with the catapult launch system. Bob Elder, who headed the project, made 150 land-based arrested landings and an untold number of land-based catapult launches. (These land-based trials were done at Mustin Field NAS, which unfortunately isn’t around any more.) On November 15, 1944, Bob Elder made 4 landings and 4 deck-run takeoffs from the USS Shangri-La, near the Virginia Capes – a total of 25 landings and takeoffs were made on the Shangri-La in all, all of which were reported to be completely successful. (At this same time, the SEU was also doing similar trials with a B-25H and an early F7F Tigercat.) The aircraft never officially entered Navy inventory, and contrary to myths derived years ago (and repeated numerous times since), the aircraft never had a change in designation or BuNo. assigned. The aircraft later was provided to the NACA (forerunner to NASA) and became NACA 102 (not NACA 127, the one flying today, but there has been some rumors over the years that the tail of the Navy modified P-51D/NACA 102 ended up being fitted to NACA 127).

As Bob Elder noted, the bulkhead that the tail hook was fitted to started to receive some cracking after making arrested landings at 90 mph or more (this was found while still earlier in the testing, back at Mustin Field), and so they had to land slower than 90 – lateral control became unmanageable below 82 mph, the rudder being to the full right stop by this point. As a result, Elder made all of the approaches at 85 mph. This was no problem for him, with the experience he had, but for novice pilots that would have been a problem. Landing the aircraft required a constant curved approach, not unlike what was required with the Corsair, however Elder mentioned that the visibility over/around the nose was worse on the Hellcat and Corsair than it was on the Mustang.

The capture of Iwo Jima in early 1945 eliminated the need for carrier-based Mustangs.

All of the photos showing fleets of Mustangs on carriers are/were from deployments, with the carriers simply serving as cargo-carriers from one land base to another.

Here are a few more photos of 44-14017 aboard the USS Shangri-La, not seen on the linked webpage.

I’m not sure how serious the trials were. The Navy had plenty of Hellcats and the faster Bearcat was in the pipeline. It may have been a academic exercise, or perhaps the possibility of launching USAAF aircraft from carriers (like the P-40s in North Africa) for possible use in the Pacific.

In either case I don’t think the Navy’s preference for air-cooled engines was in jeopardy or would have prevented Mustang use if military conditions dictated.

The Mustang looked like it would be good for carrier ops. Wonder why they didn’t pursue it?

As I understand it – it was the engine rather than the airframe.

IIRC it was US Navy policy to use radials rather than inlines – with their attendant coolant requirements.

The radial was regarded as being more robust for carrier ops…….

Ken

I’ve since read that the ‘D’ had insufficient rudder authority and that the ‘H’ was good enough, but by then jets were taking over

He is a spammer, he posts on a number of boards under different names

I am with Moggy. His link does offer a some merit.

Never knew P-51 used in carrier trials.

He is a spammer, he posts on a number of boards under different names

The Mustang looked like it would be good for carrier ops. Wonder why they didn’t pursue it?

The moderation team are aware. We take the view that whatever his motives he finds some interesting pictures.

Nobody is compelled to visit his blog.

Moggy
Moderator

I’ve said before he, is driving traffic to his blog – be that for monetary reward or just boosting his hit counter stats.

http://boostblogtraffic.com/make-money-blogging/

Well, I think you’re right on that account. This is what he wrote in another thread.

I count on your visit!

Is it just me, or is this bad form?

Let’s hope every Tom, Dick and Harry with a website doesn’t continue this trend. Even the Duxford thread with regular posts would end up far down on page 2… :rolleyes:

T J

I’m pretty sure the OP has never responded to any of the posts offering answers to his questions.
The consensus here seems to be the entire point of his posts are to raise the visit count for his website.