PPL (H) near London/Essex

Turbulence?

It’s a bit like boating in a rough sea. Once you are really confident that the boat isn’t going to sink (or aircraft going to plummet) and that you are actually just riding the currents, you should be able to relax a lot more.

Moggy

I’m no expert only ever having flown 4 hours in a C172 and 1 hour in an R22. However all I can say is that there is a vast difference between fixed wing and rotary. I’d be inclined to say give rotary a go next and see if that is your thing before worrying about what type to fly.
My next thought is to try microlights to see if I like them and can afford that sort of flying.
EDIT Forgot to mention the turbulence. I worked down the back for a few years. You get used to it pretty quickly whether you’re in a small turbo prop or a 747. Do your pre flight planning properly to stay away from the obvious stuff, don’t get too close behind anything bigger than you (once pulled in a bit close behind a 747 on approach to LGW in an ATR42, like hitting a brick wall, spilt my tea and head butted the bulkhead) and don’t think you are OK because you are nearly on the deck. Last minute cross winds used to scare me more. I once sat on the stand in Jersey with a full load on board and a tug attached to the frontend and the aircraft was still being blown around in 60 kt winds. We stayed closed up until it passed. Moral of the story, don’t go trying to beat nature.

Somehow despite the weather, I actually managed to get some flying in!

Yesterday I did an hour in a PA-28 Archer II 181 at Southend (very calm skies) and today, slightly more bumpy, not sure if that was due to the weather or the smaller plane as I was in a PA-28 Cherokee 140, flying out of Panshanger Aerodrome, my first experience of a grass strip!

So, weather permitting, I intend to do a lesson in a C172 a Robinson R22 and maybe another C152 lesson, but out of Southend this time before the year is out, after which I should be in a good position to decide where to go from there!

So in total now I’ve had 3 hours (all in fixed wing) and I still seem to tense up a bit when we hit turbulent conditions, did anyone else find this a bit unnerving at first? If so, how long did it take before you just ignored it and just focused on the aircraft? Are helicopters affected more/less/the same by turbulence?

Sorry for the increasing number of questions!!!

My lesson today got ‘fogged off’, disappointingly, hopefully tomorrow’s will be okay…

On a side note, presumably some of the exams are the same regardless of whether you fly helicopters or planes, so I could get some of the books now, does anyone have any recommendations at all?

The alternative view is that once you are comfortable in an aircraft, you will find the 172 a bit of a steady old barge and something more responsive would be more to your taste.

But truly, what you train on is of no particular significance. Once you have qualified you should soon move away from them dreary spam-cans, to something more rewarding

Moggy

Regarding the C152 and C172, I have flown both and found the C172 was more comfortable to fly and handled turbulence better than the C152. I really enjoyed flying the C172! I’ve got about 74hrs and I think about 50 of them are on the C172.

Well I’ve been busy booking up trial lessons, previously I had 1 hour in a Cessna 152 at Denham, (weather permitting) tomorrow, I’m flying a Cessna 172 at Andrewsfield, Thursday a Piper PA28 (4 seat) at The Flight Centre (Southend Airport), then on Friday a Piper Cherokee (2 seat) at The North London Flying School. I had hoped to fit in a go in a Robinson R22, but that was fully booked, so hopefully that will be next Friday.

Now, the helicopters aside (for now, will re-asses that after my R22 lesson), when factoring in everything I can think of (including taxi fares to and from the aerodrome when not by a train station), it turns out that as it is very feasible for me to learn in the C172 for only a fraction more than the C152/Piper Cherokee, with this in mind and the fact the whole reason I’m swaying towards planes over helicopters is the economics of carrying more than one passenger, do you think its worth doing the training in the C172 (my only lesson so far was in the C152 and this got blown around alot which was a bit off-putting, does the C172 hold up better in turbulent conditions)?

As well as remembering all the good advice on here already try doing what you like if you can afford it.
Try them both for an hour or two and see which one you prefer.

For a PPL, the overseas intensive courses are only really possible if they are comparatively well funded in order to continue their flying.

Take the following examples for comparison only.

Student A goes to the US and spends three weeks getting his PPL over there, say £4,000 to include all costs (Accomodation, flights, beer, etc)

He comes back to the UK and then does his checkouts and familiarisation with UK conditions £500

He then rents an aircraft once a fortnight for the remaining 48 weeks of his first year’s flying. Say £150/hr. £7,200

So he has spent on his first year of aviation some £11,700

Student B does his PPL in the UK. He flies once a week at an instructional cost of £175/hr for the first 45 hours and a self hire of £150 for the rest.

At the end of his first year of flying he has spent £8,925.

OK, the US guy has flown more hours, but if your budget is really tight overseas training is not the best option.

However if you are after a career and time is important, or you just fancy the holiday, then why not? You will experience different flight conditions and have a lot of fun.

But always remember, many students come home without their PPL having run out of time.

Personally I would have hated to rush through my training in three weeks. I spread it out over 18 months and loved (nearly) every minute.

Moggy

I have no intention of becoming a commercial pilot by the way, so a PPL, with perhaps additional ratings would be as far as I take things. …
What does everyone think of Rotorway helicopters? Do you think it would be possible to own one without having to self maintain it, or alternatively does anyone rent out hours?

Whatever you choose, I would recommend that you attend CPL/IR lectures whether or not you intend to fly commercially. There is a wealth of knowledge to be had which can only benefit you.

Ownership can be rewarding, particularly if you are qualified to maintain your own machine. Maintenance and insurance costs can be prohibitive.

Another way to do your license is to look at other countries with a favorable exchange rate who offer a license which you can easily convert to a UK license. My friend and ex colleague, who is now a BA B777 captain, learned to fly in South Africa, did his CPL there through a package deal, worked for two years to gain experience and then came back to the UK. There are several flying schools who offer holiday/accommodation/flying training package deals at excellent prices due to the exchange rate. The USA might also a be viable alternative.

Wow, that looks like great value! I’ve not seen any share offers like that, when doing my research on London based schools/group shares!

I am currently in an 8 person group flying a PA22 Colt out of Old Buckenham.

Moggy

Are you in a group, Moggy?
My flying has never been as cheap as the prices you are paying.

Cool, thanks for your advice, sounds very much like you’re saying (as I kind of suspected anyway) that planes are looking so much more practical option on cost, that other factors almost become irrelevant. What are you able to fly for £50 per hour by the way, that sounds incredibly cheap!

I did say it was ‘normally’ cheaper 😉 🙂

… or even the NPPL (This is normally cheaper than the PPL)

That is a little misleading. The cost of the minimum number of hours to qualify for an NPPL is less than a PPL, very few qualify in the minimum.

If your love is flying there is no point in stinting on the training. It is by far some of the most enjoyable flying you will ever do, so why short-change yourself? You are flying solo much of the time from around hour 15 – 20 anyway.

I think on the Cons for helicopters you missed out the fact that mostly, unless your pockets are very deep, you will be flying R22.

They fall way short of any definition of ‘cool’ that I have ever come across that one of your Pro is wiped out. Plus they have an unenviable safety record.

I fly for £60/month standing charge, and £50 / hour. I don’t have to think if I want to go flying. At £400 /hr I would be far less tempted to head off to the IOW when the sun shines.

A final caution. Block booking for a lower rate is very attractive on the surface. But unless you can do it on a credit card and thus gain protection in the event of financial failure – just don’t do it.

Aircraft clubs and rental operations come and go far too rapidly.

Moggy

Helicopters are more often than not more experience to rent than aeroplanes. I dont know why that is, but it seems to be the case most of the time.

I fly aeroplanes, and as you’re just wanting to fly for leisure i’d suggest saving your money and going for the PPL/A or even the NPPL (This is normally cheaper than the PPL) However, the factor of expenses purely comes down to your situation, if you have loads of money to burn and prefer choppers, go for them.

Go and talk to a few flying schools over at Stapleford and also North Weald. See if they have anything taylored to your needs, or even supply you with the relevant information to help you make your decision.