Private military contractors – anti piracy patrols

..Also to keep an eye out on the crew. Many of these Somalia hijackings I will bet are inside jobs with the crew sending info…

I doubt if most are, but some certainly are. In one case, A Thai vessel (owned by the same fishing company as the trawler recently sunk by the Indian navy after being hijacked) was hijacked a couple of years ago by three Somali crewmen, who’d smuggled AK-47s aboard. Not for long, though – it was retaken by a USCG boarding party.

Dear Member,

There “ammo” was a water cannon. And there were only three on the ship. That is way to few. You need a minimum of ten if you want some to get a sleep break, etc. Also to keep an eye out on the crew. Many of these Somalia hijackings I will bet are inside jobs with the crew sending info.

Finally, the pirates are in for the money. Not to get killed. If one one or two ships you put a much larger guard unit with a lot of firepower they will really think about it. Especially if you mount dummy heavy machine gun mounts on ships (ie pipe and sheet metal and an arc welder). A lot cheaper method than all the money we are spending now chasing our tails.

Jack E. Hammond

PS> A classic example are the British Indiemen merchants that plied the SEA trade routes. Moro pirates learned plenty fast to steer clear of them.

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I apologise, my original source was part of the sensationalist press, having checked facts i see that they only had water cannons and a device that shoots out painful sounds!- http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/africa/article5253731.ece

according to this article, its almost impossible for these PMC#s to carry any kind of arms, which must be pretty frustrating, but still they are in great demand, it is a huge risk for the guards, and by the sounds of it they were very lucky to get away with there lives.

i read about this also, a shipping protection company from Dorset, it said they were very brave and used all there ammo before jumping ship-not saying you can blame them, no private job is worth dying for, but do you think the company who’s ship they were on gets a refund?

I’m intrigued what the pirates use the vast sums of money they get from ransoms on, i can’t say i know anything about the situation in the country. I heard the ship carrying tanks has had the ransom arranged and is close to being released

Dear Member,

There “ammo” was a water cannon. And there were only three on the ship. That is way to few. You need a minimum of ten if you want some to get a sleep break, etc. Also to keep an eye out on the crew. Many of these Somalia hijackings I will bet are inside jobs with the crew sending info.

Finally, the pirates are in for the money. Not to get killed. If one one or two ships you put a much larger guard unit with a lot of firepower they will really think about it. Especially if you mount dummy heavy machine gun mounts on ships (ie pipe and sheet metal and an arc welder). A lot cheaper method than all the money we are spending now chasing our tails.

Jack E. Hammond

PS> A classic example are the British Indiemen merchants that plied the SEA trade routes. Moro pirates learned plenty fast to steer clear of them.

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Used all their ammo??? Blimey so the Pirates are brave or stupid, they’ll board even if you fight back. Seems a strange story, surely no pirate thinks it’s worth dying for either?

all that ransom money, and no response, i was looking at the ships sheltering in the thames estuary with envious and plotting eyes last week!!! :diablo:

Used all their ammo??? Blimey so the Pirates are brave or stupid, they’ll board even if you fight back. Seems a strange story, surely no pirate thinks it’s worth dying for either?

I heard in a local newspaper that the three guys wo jumped were PMCs; two brits and an paddy. If so, then PMCs don’t seem very effective.

i read about this also, a shipping protection company from Dorset, it said they were very brave and used all there ammo before jumping ship-not saying you can blame them, no private job is worth dying for, but do you think the company who’s ship they were on gets a refund?

I’m intrigued what the pirates use the vast sums of money they get from ransoms on, i can’t say i know anything about the situation in the country. I heard the ship carrying tanks has had the ransom arranged and is close to being released

I heard in a local newspaper that the three guys wo jumped were PMCs; two brits and an paddy. If so, then PMCs don’t seem very effective.

Folks,

It seems that the Somalia pirates are even getting more brazen. They just took another ship that was part of a group of 17 that a German frigate was giving quasi escort to (ie it was just escorting one but 16 others tag along hoping for protection) to. It seems the German frigate sent its Lynx helicopter to investigate and follow the pouched ship and the pirates fearing boarding from the helicopter used an ole Moro pirate trick of the 1800s — ie they made three crew members jump into the water forcing the helicopter to rescue them and forget the hijacked ship. Also, I don’t think the German Navy will use lethal force no matter what, unless the warship itself is in peril and the pirates know the difference between navies use of lethal force.

I have given this problem a lot of consideration. And it seems that there are now two options: Pay the pirates or send very expensive warships (in hardware, manning and logistic cost) to patrol or a third option. The third option I believe would be to put guards with heavy weapons (50 caliber machine guns, etc) on each ship having to pass through the area. Now you will say that is expensive also. Yes it is, if you use French Marines or US Marines, etc. But not if we can get Egypt to supply the merchant guards. And by that I mean pay them (ie NATO, India, etc offer military aid and loans, etc). To wit, the UN Security Council pass an authorization allowing certain nations to provide guards to ships no matter their flagging and the right to arrest and put them on trial no matter their nationality.

It would work like this. At one end would be the Suez Canal. At the other end a nation would provide a bunking/logistic ship that also provides boats to ferry the merchant guard squads out to the ships. As a ship enters the Suez Canal going south one of these ten man squads would be put on board with bolt on mounts for their heavy machine guns and other weapons (and special grenades for throwing over the side against boarders). As they pass through the danger zone further south they would go to the area where the ship I mentioned is sailing and the guards would be taken off. And ships going north would pass this ship and take on a guard unit. It would be a continuous loop, with guard units resting after making a trip south and then north to the canal.

A lot cheaper than having expensive major warfighting naval warships wasting their time. Although there would have to be some warships for quick reaction in case the pirates decide to take out the logistic/bunking ship and just to make them not get to big an idea.

Pirates have on distinct disadvantage. Their small boats make terrible firing platforms for accurate fire, while large merchant and tankers are extremely stable firing platforms. In fact army snipers with must 7.62mm rifles can be a hazard to pirates in small high speed boats.

Jack E. Hammond

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Egypt is a special case, because of the value of Suez canal tolls to its economy. Canal tolls were about 4% of GDP last year, & a much higher percentage of state revenues. That’s in addition to the vulnerability everyone else has.

That as maybe but the Egyptian economy is in a bad way as is their Navy.

The Kenyans are having a pair of fast attack craft regenerated by Fincantieri (and missiles removed) with the apparent purpose of using them to help the anti-pirate effort.

I am confused as to why people are so obsessed with the locals doing more. I think you will find that most of the world is equally, if not more so, dependent on the sea lanes remaining open and cheap.

Egypt is a special case, because of the value of Suez canal tolls to its economy. Canal tolls were about 4% of GDP last year, & a much higher percentage of state revenues. That’s in addition to the vulnerability everyone else has.

I am confused as to why people are so obsessed with the locals doing more. I think you will find that most of the world is equally, if not more so, dependent on the sea lanes remaining open and cheap. Eastern manufacturing dependent upon western markets, western markets dependent on Eastern goods and everyone dependent on oil. Just because the UK is no where near Somalia it does not mean that it would not be seriously affected by increased shipping insurance rates and longer journeys pushing up shipping costs and thus consumer prices. We are all dependent upon free and open sea travel. Some here do not seem to realise it.

No Egypt is hosting an emergency meeting… i bet its an emergency.. shipping trough suez could fall by 50% in the next year. EU is assembling a flotila of combat ships apparently. Like somebody above said Greece should be doing more, as should Turks.. they are the ones who depend on Suez traffic, Italy too.

Did I hear something today about there being an urgent meeting of all the countries that surround Somalia to discuss this ? Will they do anything or just pass it to the big navy’s ?

DJ – PS: Jack, Egypt will be very concearned as more and more shipping companies choose to go long way around.. however they do not have capacity to get involved them self.. best they can do is champion the cause at the UN and push for tougher international action from naval powers.

Dear Member,

Egypt has the ability to get involved. In fact it would be better as they have much lower manpower cost and the type of vessels needed for the patrol work. They just don’t want to because they know we will. Sort of like Saudi Arabia not even imposing a call up of former soldiers and limited conscription in 1990-1990 even though there nation was in extreme peril and allowing their troops to cross into one inch of Iraqi territory.

Finally, the nation that should have a lot of patrol boats in that region that is not stepping up the the plate is Greece. While many of the ships are flagged with either Panama or Liberia they are owned by Greek companies and have a lot of Greek officers.

Jack E. Hammond

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Naah. You just put more profit into the hands of Afar & Issa overland traders. Expect a sudden rush of trucks (especially 4WDs) into Djibouti, & a lot more bales coming into Djibouti port from Yemen. 😀

Dear Member,

How much do you know about the market for Qat and why they fly it in. That would be my reply.

Jack E. Hammond

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The problem with Egypt is that they have a barely-contained radical Muslim faction that has tried to instigate rebellions several times in the last 20 years.

Attacks by Muslim pirates on Western (and infidel Eastern) commercial shipping are seen as showing the strength of the Muslim world… and acting to suppress “those poor, starving Muslims who only want to feed their children, but the evil infidels won’t let them” would play into the radicals’ hands.

I know that a Saudi tanker has been seized… Saudi Arabia is not in favor with the radical Muslim sector, as they are working too closely with the US for their liking.

Naah. You just put more profit into the hands of Afar & Issa overland traders. Expect a sudden rush of trucks (especially 4WDs) into Djibouti, & a lot more bales coming into Djibouti port from Yemen. 😀

hehe precisely :p

Its hard to believe in this day and age, such places still exist… like a bad dogs of war novel 🙁

Also, another think the West can do is crater the runways in Puntland. You cut Somalias off from their Qat and you get their attention fast like cutting off crack in Baltimore.

Jack E. Hammond.

Naah. You just put more profit into the hands of Afar & Issa overland traders. Expect a sudden rush of trucks (especially 4WDs) into Djibouti, & a lot more bales coming into Djibouti port from Yemen. 😀

Drug labs in Colombia are deliberately isolated. Not even the producers hang around them when they’re not working, which is only intermittently. Nor are training camps in Afghanistan at all comparable. You’re talking about towns, in which most of the people are not pirates, not closed military encampments.

And what in those coastal towns would you drop these guided munitions on? A PGM can only be as accurate as its targeting information. Remember, the towns house the captives. It’s unlikely anyone picking targets will know exactly which buildings they’re in – except that they’re buildings used by pirates, i.e. on any target list . . .

No not towns .. there are several mini harbors in Puntland used by pirates only, no civ population no fishermen, basically a pirate base. On Janes Security, last report on Somali piracy had a good article with maps and locations.

Now hostages are problem, that is a given… but at this rate pirates are winning.. for ever hostage bought out, 3 new one are captured. This cant go on forever. I think if some of those taken were say Israeli .. you would have seen by now a proper way to deal with kidnappers. SAS action against west side boys was a perfect example… from what i recall after that action several other groups choose to volunterily lay down arms after hearing of the incident.

PS: Jack, Egypt will be very concearned as more and more shipping companies choose to go long way around.. however they do not have capacity to get involved them self.. best they can do is champion the cause at the UN and push for tougher international action from naval powers.

As far as buissines goes.. at least two major shipping companies are now rerouting their vessels around cape and will not be using suez canal … and more are sure to follow, as success of pirate raids increases and others are drawn in. If you ignore problem it will escalate and eventually it would have to be dealt with.

Dear Members,

What I can not figure out is Egypt. Egypt relies on two major sources for hard currency. One if tourism (the Pyramids, etc) and the other is the Suez Canal. After Egypt and Israel made peace, the US help financed the enlargement of the Suez Canal so Super Carriers and huge tankers could transit that canal instead of rounding the south tip of Africa. And if these huge ships (they are charged by the ton) stop using the Suez Canal, Egypt will loose a lot of money.

I just checked my WORLD DEFENSE ALMANAC and Egypt has 48 (forty-eight) small patrol vessels (excluding the minesweepers which would add another 10). If I were Egypt I would pass laws stating that piracy in the Aden Gulf is a danger to the Suez Canal and get permission from Djibouti for berthing rights for some of those vessels and one of its amphibious warfare vessels for crewing spaces. If Djibouti objects, I would start thinking maybe Djibouti is getting a pay off.

Also, another think the West can do is crater the runways in Puntland. You cut Somalias off from their Qat and you get their attention fast like cutting off crack in Baltimore.

Jack E. Hammond

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