Project Aphrodite and the death of Joe Kennedy

Thanks James.

Found your post very interesting. Being an ex-rigger I know nothing about ‘wiggly-amps’ but what you said makes absolute sense. They could have used your logical reasoning when writing ‘The Lost Prince – Young Joe the forgotten Kennedy’ and ‘Aphrodite: The Desperate Mission’.

Regards

Mike

Hi

Unless there was a deliberate facility to remotely detonate the explosive, then any radio interference theory can be discarded. That method would require some deliberate RF amplification in order for the signal to be picked up and then more circuitry again to detonate the fuses. Even if you are not familiar with radio its fairly obvious that very few items in your house or factory spontaneously go bang because of the radios around you, and there are places with serious RF energy being radiated – on large ships for example the radar and radio transmitters are very powerful and very close. While these do cause issues, that would be to sensitive equipment – I doubt if it would cause light bulbs to pop for example.

Static too is very unlikely, while the voltage is high the power is very low. A fuse would require power to ignite it, thats current x voltage so as the static current is very very low, then the power is low. Consider the fact that a static shock makes you jump but doesn’t kill you even though it is possibly a thousand volts or more (excluding lighting from this of course that does have a great deal of power – and I’m assuming that they didn’t have Van der Graff units in control system)

I’m wandering outside my knowledge now but I assume that most detonators are essentially wires that you need to get hot. They then have a very low resistance. without going into the maths what that means is that you need to fire a detonator from a supply that can supply a relatively large amount of power and generally that would mean connecting the detonator to the aircraft supply. That means that the contacts that were actually intended to be switched on to detonate the explosive were switched on when they shouldn’t have been. That makes it a control system fault, either accident or poor design.

I have worked on aircraft fitted with ‘squibs’, in order to detect that they were actually there we would pass a very small current through them. The actual detonation pulse required another circuit that was able to generate 15A at 20V, that was just to make sure they went off but even so the power required would be appreciable.

It would be total madness to design detonators that require a minimal amount of power to trigger them.

The documentary I watched had actors re-inacting the events and there was an example circuit ‘failing’ so if anyone knows what that might have been I would be interested to see.

Cheers
James

Just had a look at my copies of ‘The Lost Prince – Young Joe the forgotten Kennedy’ by Hank Searls and ‘Aphrodite: The Desperate Mission’ by Jack Olsen and both do not give definitive answers. They put forward the solenoid overheating and static electricity theories and that a British jamming station had just activated which might have sent spirious signals to the controllers.
Think that this is one of those mysteries that will remain just that.

Those Aphrodite crews have my utmost respect for their bravery.

Mike H

jamesinnewcastl………..

Thank you for response……..

I remember reading about this in Final Flights.

If you get a chance to go to Madingley American war cemetery there was quite a good display in the visitors centre about it.

Hi Planemike

I got that from a documentary about the event. I recall that they were claiming to have better information about why, and that it included words such as solenoid, overheating and EMC. Unfortunately I can’t remember the programme, sorry!

As with all technical issues those who write about them will tend to blur the edges becasue they a) don’t understand themselves and b) don’t want to bore you with a circuit diagram!

Cheers
James

In theory the mission should have been safe to fly as the crew baled soon after take-off but Kennedys aircraft exploded before leaving UK shores because of a simple design flaw in the arming mechanism.

……..””a simple design flaw in the arming mechanism.””???? Any details available ??

Hi

Never heard of TDR drones! So much going on in that period,

Cheers
James

The use of the TDR drones in the Pacific was at a similar time -a fascinating part of history.

I think Aphrodite was the USAAC. Anvil was USN. Joe was Anvil

Ah, right – sorry! Lt Joseph Kennedy II, JFK’s brother. I’ll see if I can do something about the thumbnail… How’s that? To me, if I put one picture in it displays full size – does that work for you?

Adrian

Hit and miss on my phone. I can’t see it, but will on my laptop. The Duxford thread is fine though.

Hi

Project Aphrodite was an amazing feat for the age and is another often overlooked aspect of the war. This exploit produced the first UAV but with a monster payload. It used two CCTV cameras with a live video link to a following aircraft and remote control of the UAVs aircraft controls. One monitor on the following aircraft looked at the forward view and the other at the control panel. Television at that time was in its infancy.

Technically this was cutting edge technology. I’ve always wanted to restore one of the cameras used but they are always ‘stateside. Interestingly they were sold as war surplus and used for CCTV surveillance purposes – so probably the first security cameras too.

In theory the mission should have been safe to fly as the crew baled soon after take-off but Kennedys aircraft exploded before leaving UK shores because of a simple design flaw in the arming mechanism. Even hundereds of feet up there was so much explosive on board that it left a crater in the ground below. That huge charge was intended for submarine pens which the aircraft should have been flown directly in to.

So when people ooh and ahh about todays amazing ‘drones’ older folk can just smile and think, been there, done that over 70 years ago…..

Cheers
James

Ah, right – sorry! Lt Joseph Kennedy II, JFK’s brother. I’ll see if I can do something about the thumbnail… How’s that? To me, if I put one picture in it displays full size – does that work for you?

Adrian

I can’t see the thumbnail Adrian.

(unnecessarily sarcastic post removed as it seems not everyone can see the thumbnail)

So – which Spitfire? Should be easy, given the mark…

Adrian

Joe Kennedy? Which Joe Kennedy?????!