RAFM, faded glory ?

….. The last time I was up there must have been 10 years ago,in a dusty corner was a glass cabinet. In the cabinet was the Schlesinger African Air Race trophy from 1936, the 1953 London to Christchurch air race trophy, one of the MacRobertson air race trophys and some Schneider Trophy’s that were given to the pilots. I was transfixed as none were labeled and took me a good half hour to work them out. Probably in a dusty corner at Stafford now? Anybody know what is in the galleries now?

Still there, slightly revised, in space kindly allocated to Royal Aero Club items. We are hoping to rearrange things a little and improve the labelling

Post edit facility – still not working for me; so here’s another link that might relate to the post above.

http://www.military-airshows.co.uk/press16/ahllotterypraug2016.htm

As has been posted about these parts before, a project at Scampton was being evaluated – tender information from autumn 2013!

I would suggest that with the Airshow now being organised at that location; Lincs County Council looking to change their heritage provision; changes at RAFM etc. that things have ‘moved on’ a bit since then!

Trouble is where in 2017 could you build a news RAFM on one site. Ideally a expansion period RAF station, current or former. It would need to be pretty central, with good transport links, so not Coningsby, but maybe Wittering or Cottesmore? What About Mildenhall, although not very central but shortly available. The former RAF camp at Biggin would also be interesting but lacks hangars. Of course it is just a pipe dream and it could cost millions.
It is interesting to see that visitors figures for Cosford and Hendon are roughly the same around 350,000, with Duxford at 278,000, according to this site http://www.alva.org.uk/details.cfm?p=423 .IWM London shows at 1.1 million!

RAF Scampton would be ideal! Long runway, lots of infrastructure currently unused, home of the premier aerobatic display team, move the BBMF there, build more hangars. A live home, RAF presence, central location, land is cheap and you’re not going to upset the locals! Oh and me only living 6.5miles away would more than welcome to this local… 😉

Profoundly depressing? Seriously. Over egging the pudding somewhat I think.

You are entitled to your opinion. It is just as valid as mine.

The corollary being that my opinion is as valid as yours.

Meanwhile, if you seriously think I value your opinion you are way off beam.

While not “magnificent”, better stuffed and displayed than not around at all,

Can’t disagree with that.

Moggy

Over egging? He bought the hen.

While not “magnificent”, better stuffed and displayed than not around at all, since most of the aircraft in the museum are extinct in airworthy condition (because of money/regulations).

But if they do they are several million times more interesting, in my opinion.

Grounded aircraft are corpses of something that was once magnificent. We can file past respectfully, but it is profundly depressing when compared to seeing them live, in their element.

Moggy

Profoundly depressing? Seriously. Over egging the pudding somewhat I think.

replacing the blown up hangar with an externally representative hangar would be nice too!

The remaining 3 hangars are listed buildings, so I don’t think that will be happening.

Just want IWM to remember roots and the origins of that wonderful museum in the EAG and other grass roots aviation groups. They have a good formula and hope it keeps going….replacing the blown up hangar with an externally representative hangar would be nice too!

It is sad that we cannot have everything on one site. But then again is it? A central airfield location with something to look at flying in the air would be great. Outstations with smaller collections would be nice. The Hendon site has gone as far as it can….the airfield is a corpse as Moggy would say. Maybe it should be the london outstation? Maybe Cosford should be the main site? Maybe other aircraft could be stationed at Cosford to keep it ‘live’? Maybe, in world that everywhere dishes to be world class, maybe Cosford should strive to be a true RAFM heritage site? Maybe it could have the BBMF there? To further RAF careers, maybe the Reds could be there too?
I don’t feel as negative on museums as moggy, sure I don’t like carpet laid halls where aircraft are so dormant they no longer bleed oil, but they are very worthy to have. Duxford has the right balance, however, their management does not always seem to be in tune with the golden equation that makes Duxford so good.
Landmark aircraft + exhibits + flying aircraft + personal stories + imagination catalysts + aviation rich buildings/infrastructure + good access = world class aviation heritage centre

So Duxford management.. don’t blow it! RAFM ….get your direction sorted and don’t forget the Battle of Britain!

If you’ve seen the Duxford master plan you’ll see that the IWM Management are doing their damndest within the confines of available budget to continually develop the site.

Trouble is where in 2017 could you build a news RAFM on one site. Ideally a expansion period RAF station, current or former. It would need to be pretty central, with good transport links, so not Coningsby, but maybe Wittering or Cottesmore? What About Mildenhall, although not very central but shortly available. The former RAF camp at Biggin would also be interesting but lacks hangars. Of course it is just a pipe dream and it could cost millions.
It is interesting to see that visitors figures for Cosford and Hendon are roughly the same around 350,000, with Duxford at 278,000, according to this site http://www.alva.org.uk/details.cfm?p=423 .IWM London shows at 1.1 million!

It is sad that we cannot have everything on one site. But then again is it? A central airfield location with something to look at flying in the air would be great. Outstations with smaller collections would be nice. The Hendon site has gone as far as it can….the airfield is a corpse as Moggy would say. Maybe it should be the london outstation? Maybe Cosford should be the main site? Maybe other aircraft could be stationed at Cosford to keep it ‘live’? Maybe, in world that everywhere dishes to be world class, maybe Cosford should strive to be a true RAFM heritage site? Maybe it could have the BBMF there? To further RAF careers, maybe the Reds could be there too?
I don’t feel as negative on museums as moggy, sure I don’t like carpet laid halls where aircraft are so dormant they no longer bleed oil, but they are very worthy to have. Duxford has the right balance, however, their management does not always seem to be in tune with the golden equation that makes Duxford so good.
Landmark aircraft + exhibits + flying aircraft + personal stories + imagination catalysts + aviation rich buildings/infrastructure + good access = world class aviation heritage centre

So Duxford management.. don’t blow it! RAFM ….get your direction sorted and don’t forget the Battle of Britain!

I first visited in 77, or 78 on a coach trip and it was just the two orininal linked hangars. The gallery’s were brilliant, I remember the dioramas and the ‘RFC workshop’. The last time I was up there must have been 10 years ago,in a dusty corner was a glass cabinet. In the cabinet was the Schlesinger African Air Race trophy from 1936, the 1953 London to Christchurch air race trophy, one of the MacRobertson air race trophys and some Schneider Trophy’s that were given to the pilots. I was transfixed as none were labeled and took me a good half hour to work them out. Probably in a dusty corner at Stafford now? Anybody know what is in the galleries now?

A great deal of gloom and doom.
Anyone remember Hendon in the 70s?
On my first visit in 1975, it was nothing compared to today, especially in terms in types of aircraft represented.
I believe the only US type represented was the Hoverfly.

They did have interesting model dioramas of the various WWII theaters showing the types/colours used therein. Wonder what happened to them?

So thing are much better.
Although closing the BoB gallery is puzzling, since the battle seems to be the defining moment of 20th century Britain….and you’d think if marketed properly (think of the other war related attractions in London) it would be a tourist attraction.

Aircraft do not need to fly to be interesting.

But if they do they are several million times more interesting, in my opinion.

Grounded aircraft are corpses of something that was once magnificent. We can file past respectfully, but it is profundly depressing when compared to seeing them live, in their element.

Moggy

I’ve alway felt it would be a stronger museum on one site. But I am aware that is really never going to happen.

It would certainly be impressive, and would have quite a few ‘duplicates’.

I’ve always felt that they’ve sent some of the rarer aircraft to Cosford as a means to ensuring that the enthusiasts go there – the Liberator and Thunderbolt were both there at one point, and now the Gladiator and Defiant have gone. The casual visitor won’t know any different and the footfall has to be maintained somehow…

Hendon would have been great if the airfield wasn’t sold off and built on. Now there is little to show that it was an airfield at all trapped between the railway and not the nicest housing estate. Wouldn’t have been big enough to land the largest aircraft either.

Cosford has the room the expand but the runway is too short -or more truthfully, lacking that safety margin to land larger aircraft in. What will happen when the Sentries, Airseekers, Voyagers and other large RAF aircraft are retired? Will one of each need to be dissassembled for transport to Cosford at great cost, or will some or all be missed, like the Tristar, only to be regretted at some future date.

Then there is the question the museum being split between two sites meaning neither can tell a comprehensive history of the RFC/RAF. There is also the expensive transporting of airframes from one location to the other (not to mention the disquiet that causes on this forum and others).

I’ve alway felt it would be a stronger museum on one site. But I am aware that is really never going to happen.

An official air force museum is best on/next to an airfield because it makes it easier to retire large types to the museum. No need to cut them up/transport them. See the NMUSAF.

What’s the obsession with a museum needing to be on a live airfield? Aircraft do not need to fly to be interesting.

Yes, Hendon isn’t an ideal location but it does have strong links with the RAF – the pageants of the 20s and 30s, not to mention it being a former Battle of Britain fighter station.

‘Penpusher’ Thats what the RAF should of done like the IWM Duxford put a live airfield aside and kept RAF types there that were relevant to what was once the greatest airforce in the world.Duxford is a Mecca and my favourite place but the types there are not just RAF and understandably so it perhaps could be a training place for new recruits aswell.