Research Photo Request: Firebird's Lightning Team Helmets

John Curry on the left. This is the helmet I have and will be forwarding you more detailed pictures.

Hi Red Mike! 😀

Thanks for the confirmation that it is Dave Stewards helmet…. I wonder if he still has the original? That would be something!

The picture you mention with the crew walking toward he camera, I have this copy: http://picasaweb.google.com/Scott.Bouch/FirebirdsHGU2#5544728405392976706

it is quite poor quality, but I can clearly see the only helmet with a solid visor cover is being carried by Dave Steward in the centre of the group (7th from the left, and 8th from the right as you look at the picture) as all British helmets never used solid visor covers (some exclusions: helicopter Mk4’s, 10’s an 15’s).

Today some more parts arrived (from Australia!) for my reproduction, these are the leather tabs which fit inside the “cheeks” with pop-studs for mounting the G-type helmet mask hooks.. these are new-replica items as you simply can’t find original replacements.

Only got one part left to find now, that’s an oxygen hose for the P1 mask. The early P masks (with larger microphone) had the oxygen hose end stretched OVER the facepiece inlet moulding. Later P/Q masks used the bent elbow to direct the hose forward away from the pilots chest.

So if anyone out there has a spare oxy hose (preferably with aluminium bayonet fitting on the end, to suit lightning PEC’s), and a rather large / stretched looking opening at the mask end, please drop me a line!

I’m also on the look out for some “spare time” to complete this project! any miracle-cures, please let me know!! 😉

Many thanks, Scott.

Hi Scott

How are you getting on with your research? I hope I can be of some assistance. Although it isn’t a very big picture, you will see the “Firebirds” walking back to their crewroom at Wattisham for a debrief after a practice display. The helmet did belong to Dave Seward and the photograph belongs to Gp Capt D.J Seward and it is on page 204 of English Electric Lightning Vol one “Birth of the Legend” by Stewart A Scott. However, there is a better picture of Jimmy Jewell taking a well earned breather! (BAC) In the book by Martin W Bowman “Lightning Strikes Twice” page54. He is wearing the Mk1 bone dome and it had the Firebirds motif over the earpieces and there was no other motif on the top or back of the helmets as far as I can remember. Certainly Dave Seward’s didn’t have any to my knowledge which is now 37 years old!!!

I hope that this has been of some assistance to you.

Red Mike

OC 56 at the time was Sqn Ldr Dave Seward. He had flown with the USAF hence the helmet. At the time standard issue helmet was the Mk1 Bine dome this consisted of 2 parts the cloth helmet and then the outer hard shell. The cloth inner had all the electrics ear pieces etc if you see pics of Roly Beaumont he only ever wore the cloth inner not the greatest idea! It looks from your picture if he may be wearing the inner under his US helmet the only way to keep the P type mask on as the two metal hooks were attached to the cloth inner. Frankly I always thought the mk1 helmet a dreadful piece of kit very hot and sweaty and pretty useless at noise attenuation. A lot of pilots wore the Mk1 helmet well into the 1980s as they were lighter. Hope this helps SF

Hi Salad,

I’d thought it was Dave Steward, and now you tell me about his time in the USAF, it makes sense! Thanks! Do you know any dates / years when he was over there? and what types he may have flown?

The HGU-2 was originally built with leather tabs fitted to either side of the shell front opening, these have 3 pop-studs on them similar to the G-type helmet (that’s the inner of a Mk1). I’m having a reproduction pair of leather tabs made in Australia, as they were missing form my shell. I’ve got a pair of the G-type mask hooks to clip on to the tabs.

This 56Sqn helmet has been modified using a loom form a G-type, you can see the UK mic socket has been screwed to the outside of the shell, and the original HGU-2 square grommet re-used to take the cable inside. I’ve found a G-type cable too, and the G-type speakers (which incidentally fit perfectly in the HGU-2 earpieces! so it’s a straight swap for the speakers!)

I need to know how the loom exits the helmet at the rear, it’s quire likely to be through a large round grommet, since the other US helmets of the era (P-series etc..) were set up like that.

Many thanks, Scott.

Firebirds Helmet

OC 56 at the time was Sqn Ldr Dave Seward. He had flown with the USAF hence the helmet. At the time standard issue helmet was the Mk1 Bine dome this consisted of 2 parts the cloth helmet and then the outer hard shell. The cloth inner had all the electrics ear pieces etc if you see pics of Roly Beaumont he only ever wore the cloth inner not the greatest idea! It looks from your picture if he may be wearing the inner under his US helmet the only way to keep the P type mask on as the two metal hooks were attached to the cloth inner. Frankly I always thought the mk1 helmet a dreadful piece of kit very hot and sweaty and pretty useless at noise attenuation. A lot of pilots wore the Mk1 helmet well into the 1980s as they were lighter. Hope this helps SF

Also Henry Ploesek was 1 of the pilots & went on to be the team manager for the Red Arrows in the 1980’s, maybe you could email the current manager & see if he can pass your details on as they usual have a gathering every year where past & present members get together.

An old friend of my fathers has a collection of aerobatic team helmets & I saw these about 15 years ago, I’m sure the disc on the mk1 was gold with a black outline & was red & White checkers all over, there was no markings on the top or back. The checks were about an inch square.

AMB! you’re an absolute star!! 😎

Thank you for taking the time to have a look through, it’s really appreciated, as my evidence to work from so far is very limited!

My main area of interest is the back and top of the helmet, as I’ve got a front/side image.

Also at the back, the comms cable seems to exit through what I assume to be a rubber grommet, but I don’t have any evidence at all on it… it may just hang down form inside the helmet… If it was a grommet, i need to know it’s position..
I need to make my mind up on this before drilling a big hole in the back of the shell!

Many thanks indeed, Scott. :D:D:D

Scott – don’t praise me just yet, as I have just been through my archives and have plenty of Firebirds Lightning photos, but no helmet close-ups.
I have a feeling it may have a white disc on the back with the Squadron’s Phoenix emblem on it, but not sure. I have put this to a group of friends that may be able to help, so keep your fingers crossed!

PM 4U Scott

Scott – sadly I cannot offer you any names on the Squadron; the C.O. who I interviewed has been posted and my ‘facilitator’ has left the RAF and now works for Aviation Heritage Lincolnshire.

Prompted by your enquiry I may now try and get the article on 56 (R) Squadron published in the Newark Air Museum newsletter! 😉

Scott,

I am an aerobatic teams historian and have lots of photos of the team, mainly the aircraft though. Don’t have access to my archives here, but will check them when I get home tonight.

AMB! you’re an absolute star!! 😎

Thank you for taking the time to have a look through, it’s really appreciated, as my evidence to work from so far is very limited!

My main area of interest is the back and top of the helmet, as I’ve got a front/side image.

Also at the back, the comms cable seems to exit through what I assume to be a rubber grommet, but I don’t have any evidence at all on it… it may just hang down form inside the helmet… If it was a grommet, i need to know it’s position..
I need to make my mind up on this before drilling a big hole in the back of the shell!

Many thanks indeed, Scott. :D:D:D

Scott,

I am an aerobatic teams historian and have lots of photos of the team, mainly the aircraft though. Don’t have access to my archives here, but will check them when I get home tonight.

Twin Otter – thank you very much!

I’d been looking at the National Archives at Kew, but they have vary little in the way of photographs, however the RAF museums navigator facility is good (http://navigator.rafmuseum.org/) but no images of what I’m after..

I’ll see if I can contact someone at Waddington, you never know what they may have!

Cheers a lot, Scott.

You could try the Squadron at RAF Waddington; I had some contact 18 months ago and they were very helpful. 🙂

I forgot to mention: 56(R) Squadron has a History Room on base but when I last visited I do not recall any Display Team items on display; but they might have such material in the Squadron Archive.

Bump…

Is there an RAF archive, to find 56 squadron photos?

Cheers, Scott

Surely someone has some Firebirds photos…?