Anybody know what is actually happening with this airframe?
It seems as if a late-mark Spitfire has been used in a swap, reference has been made to the acquisition in a formal RAF Museum Annual Report, and planning permission has been sought for accommodation to display the airframe
So………………….
By: Peter - 31st May 2015 at 21:41
Video found on facebook showing the airframe after the guns and ammo were removed… This doesnt appear to be the same one that was released back in 2012??
By: pat1968 - 19th February 2015 at 15:23
I hope you have made a similar approach to Kennet, as they have received an unfair lambasting for their part in the recovery in the mainstream media, without all the facts being investigated, IMO
Still no response to my question? I can only assume that there has not actually been any ‘unfair lambasting’? No comments regarding the treatment of Dennis Coppings family? No surprise there!
By: pat1968 - 15th February 2015 at 22:17
I hope you have made a similar approach to Kennet, as they have received an unfair lambasting for their part in the recovery in the mainstream media, without all the facts being investigated, IMO
Could you elaborate on this as i am not aware of any ‘unfair lambasting’, I think the mainstream media have been critical of the RAFM and the deal that they struck? I am aware that Mr Manna feels that he/Kennet is being criticised but that is hardly the same thing.
Personally I don’t really care about the deal, I am interested in Dennis Copping. If people want to state that a search was made then why can those details not be released to the family? If this was done then surely that would mitigate any unfair criticism wouldn’t it? The family have been kept completely in the dark about the activities that have taken place during the recovery, they have been fed misleading and wholly incorrect information by JCCC and public speeches have taken place without any of this being presented to the family. Lets not forget as far as the UK media is concerned the first interviews and information they received was from the RAFM with interviews on the national television news herlding the impending arrival of ‘their’ Kittyhawk. This furore over the deal struck by the RAFM and Kennet came into the mainstream media via the RAFM museum themselves when they published their yearly statement of accounts (which they have to do as they are publicly funded), So while you are busy crying that the poor RAFM and certain parties feel hard done by now that people are asking difficult questions spare a thought for them!
By: Mark12 - 15th February 2015 at 18:30
🙂
Strangely not a mention of an imminent report.
By: Mike J - 15th February 2015 at 18:29
Poor old Mortimer Wheeler must be spinning in his grave to have had his name appropriated by such an amateurish bedroom publishing operation.
By: Bruce - 15th February 2015 at 18:23
So there is. One Mr Brockman. Not doing himself any favours there I suggest.
By: jeepman - 15th February 2015 at 16:49
What a poorly-written piece, full of political bias, factual inaccuracies and spelling and grammatical errors. Whoever ‘The Pipeline’ are, I would strongly suggest that they at least engage the services of a proof reader. No wonder that the person who cobbled this together (largely from posts on this forum, it would appear) conveniently neglected to attach their name to it.
there is a strangely familiar name on the sidebar though……………….
By: Arabella-Cox - 15th February 2015 at 12:35
Our piece focuses on the media storm directed at the RAFM and looks at the story of Dennis Copping himself.
Since the controversy was very much directed at the RAFM we have asked for and been provided with a statement by the RAFM.
To the very best of my knowledge there has been no ‘lambasting’ or criticism of Kennet Aviation in the mainstream media. My press cuttings from the Express, Mail, Telegraph and Times certainly make no critical comment in that direction whatsoever. Since the story, here, relates to matters arising from the RAFM report and the subsequent media attention, and since no criticism (to my knowledge) has entered the mainstream public domain via the news media of Kennet Aviation in respect of this business arrangement, we have not addressed any issues relating to Kennet Aviation. That is not the story, although I accept that it has been on this forum.
The piece is factual, uncontroversial and balanced and merely echoes what is already in the public domain but with a full statement of facts from RAFM Hendon.
By: Mike J - 15th February 2015 at 12:18
I hope you have made a similar approach to Kennet, as they have received an unfair lambasting for their part in the recovery in the mainstream media, without all the facts being investigated, IMO
By: Arabella-Cox - 15th February 2015 at 12:13
Yes, to answer your question, Bruce.
‘Britain at War’ magazine has asked the RAFM for a statement. This will appear in a two page news feature in the April edition of the magazine.
By: Bruce - 15th February 2015 at 11:42
And has anyone asked the RAF Museum what their intentions are for it?
Whilst ‘pipeline’ might seek to claim the idea for his/her own, I think you will find that it was always the intention to display it as such – as, when and if it can come to the UK.
Bruce
By: Moggy C - 15th February 2015 at 11:25
What chimed with me was the close
“However an exhibition of his aircraft, ET574, broken, and fragmented, but placed in its historical and environmental context where it can inspire the imagination of the viewer, would be a haunting reminder of the sacrifice of not just Flight Sergeant Copping, but many other aircrew of all combatant nations, who suffered a lonely death fighting not a human enemy, but the beautiful and lethal wilderness of the North African Desert. ET574 should be the last occasion where the recovery of an aircraft is undertaken because of what it is rather than the historical and archaeological story it can tell.”
Moggy
By: Bruce - 15th February 2015 at 11:04
Meanwhile, as far as the desert P40 is concerned what is undoubtedly needed is for a White Knight to step forward to inject a large dose of professionalism, accountability and almost certainly cash, into this process and then to recover both the aircraft and as much archaeological information as might still be obtainable, to an appropriate Museum setting, while also undertaking an assessment and if practical search for the remains of Flt Sgt Copping. Once recovered the aircraft should then be stabilised, conserved and restored to the state it was when found and no more.
Love to hear how they intend to go about this? What do they think Kennet Aviation were doing out there?!
Articles like this that have made no attempt to discuss the project with either party are wholly meaningless. As I said before, and as others have also said, an attempt was made to locate the pilot at the time of the aircraft salvage. As no information has been received by the Italian team – even after 2 yrs plus, where do they propose that a third party start looking?
Clearly, not everything went as well as it could have done. But hindsight is a wonderful thing…
By: Mike J - 15th February 2015 at 10:48
What a poorly-written piece, full of political bias, factual inaccuracies and spelling and grammatical errors. Whoever ‘The Pipeline’ are, I would strongly suggest that they at least engage the services of a proof reader. No wonder that the person who cobbled this together (largely from posts on this forum, it would appear) conveniently neglected to attach their name to it.
By: l.garey - 15th February 2015 at 10:33
Thanks for publishing that Moggy. It is an in-depth review of the present wholly unsatisfactory situation. The fate of the aircraft is one thing, but that of its pilot is another. In this case the family of Dennis Copping would like to see his remains found and recovered. That is the important thing, as he can no longer express what he would want. Maybe the MoD has a policy, but in this case the buck is being passed back and forth between the various representatives of HM Government, whether in Egypt (“case closed”) or the UK (“it is being handled by the embassy”).
I still cannot understand why this whole affair has been confused and confounded by irrelevant and misleading information. What happened to the remains found by ARIDO? Left in the desert or “tested”? Was there a “second set” of remains that were found “unsuitable” for “testing”?
Why is there an apparent cloak of secrecy (or is it simply that someone is inventing a story to cover up a lack of knowledge) about the recovery and identification of any human remains? If there has been misinformation over the last couple years, it’s surely time to tell us.
By: Moggy C - 15th February 2015 at 10:06
Some interest to be had here:
Moggy
By: John Green - 3rd February 2015 at 17:37
Well, that’s two of us !
By: jeepman - 3rd February 2015 at 17:33
This thread encouraged me to revisit, for the first time in about thirty years, the story of the discovery of that other well known Sahara wreck, the Lady be Good and the subsequent search for the crew. If you need a feel for the sheer enormity and extreme difficulty of the task facing a team searching for a body in the desert, you can do little better than obtain a copy of After the Battle Number 25, which outlines the story of the search for the bodies of the crew of the B-24 in 1959.
Although they bailed out over the desert, the crew, minus a member killed when his parachute failed to open, all eventually joined up to start walking through the desert to safety.
Once the plane had been found, search assets included desert navigation and survival specialists, trucks, an SC-47, a Bird Dog and two Sioux helicopters (flown in by C-130) as well as an RF-101 Voodoo and RB-66 specifically tasked with photo recce for the search on two separate occasions. 5,500 square miles of desert were painstakingly searched by land and air over a period of three months without finding the crew – although evidence of waypoint markers placed by the crew were found..
The first group of bodies were found by chance by an oil exploration party the following year – more than 50 miles from the bail out point. The final body was subsequently found, again by chance, over 90 miles from the point where the crew joined up after the bale-out.
At every level, the numbers are absolutely astounding.
By: Mark12 - 3rd February 2015 at 17:16
A letter in today’s Times.
Mark
By: TonyT - 3rd February 2015 at 13:25
This is Ground Control to Maggie Appleton
You’ve really made the grade
And the papers want to know whose shirts you wear
Now it’s time to leave the office if you dare
“This is Maggie Appleton to Ground Control
I’m stepping through the door
And I’m floating in a most peculiar way
And the exhibits look very different today
For here
am I sitting in a freight can
Far across the world
Planet Earth is sandy
And there’s nothing I can do
Though I’m travelled past one hundred miles from home
I’m feeling very still
And I think my container knows which way to go
Tell Hendon I love them very much (they knows!)
Ground Control to Maggie Appleton
Your circuit’s dead, there’s something wrong
Can you hear me, Maggie Appleton?
Can you hear me, Maggie Appleton?
Can you hear me, Maggie Appleton?
am I sitting in my freight can
Far below the Moon
Planet Earth is sandy
And there’s nothing I can do
:stupid:
Sorry Mr Bowie, but they were all getting far to serious.
Happy Birthday Tony! Started on the sauce early we see 🙂 Mods
Sign In
November 20, 2014 at 9:54 am