Salmson Replica's

Hi Baldeagle, i was just interested as to the identities of the Salmsons in the film, had never sen them before!

If you want to build a replica Salmson 2A2 there are drawings available, http://www.ww1aeroplanesinc.org/docs/materials%20list.htm , and pretty complete, but they’re in Japanese!

Didnt think someone would have left a Luciole lying about!!!

It’s a non flying static. At Coventry there were one complete ‘Gunbus’ – a cockpit of same – a Salmson 2A2 – the sad remains of a Camel replica – at least two SE.5 front ends and the fuselage of the triplane thing used in ‘Gunbus’.

It’s vague evidence, but some unwanted Luciole / Salmson conversions are sold on by Amicile JBS, a ‘1 1/2 Strutter’ converted from a ‘Salmson’ shows up in the UK, it’s an easy conclusion. More likely than not, but you’d need to have a good look at it to be sure.

Is the “Strutter” version one of the flying Luciole conversions or is it a static rep that was made same as the Sywell “Funbus”?

The ‘Strutter’ was with Doug Hackins Motorcycles at Bolton recently. Texan the ‘Gunbus’ was built to replicate the flying D.H 2 replica so yes it is rather more D.H
looking than Vickers.

Here’s the extract from the book I referred to. I’ve enclosed some details on the Norseman / Laetocore as well.

The translation is a tidied up web-translation, so apologies if it’s wrong. I’ve enlosed the original French. Melv may be able to add / comment / correct.

Repliques Salmson 2

Alors que Ie tournage du «Temps des as» s’achevait, Jean Sails signait avec la Tele un nouveau contrat pour Ie tournage de « L’equipage », d’apres Joseph Kessel. Mais il lui fallait d’urgence deux biplaces de reconnaissance francais de 1917. La solution fut la meme que pour les Albatros:

dans la reserve se trouvaient deux cellules de Caudron « Luciole » (biplace d’entratnement d’avant-guerre) qui, moyennant quelques modifications, allaient pouvoir prendre I’apparence de Salmson 2.A2. Sous la conduite de Roland Payen, les travaux furent menes bon train. Fin septembre, les premiers tours de manivelle etaient donnes avec Ie premier avion tandis qu’une equipe travaillait nuit et jour pour mettre la derniere main au second.

Ces avions, tout comme les faux Albatros, ont participe en 1979 au tournage d’une nouvelle serie intitul6e « La conquete du del».

Moteur: Salmson 9 cylindres en etoile
de 135 ch. Envergure : 9,9m. Longueur:

7,7 m. Poids en ordre de vol avec equipage
deux personnes : 800 kg. Vitesse de croi-
siere : 120 kmlh. Vitesse ascensionnelle : 3
m/seconde.

Replique Latecoere 17

Pour Ie tournage de « La conquete du ciel», Jean Salis devait pouvoir disposer d’un Breguet XIV et d’un Late 17. Le budget et le temps ne permettant pas la construction complete de deux repliques, et fort de la reussite des repliques truquees d’Albatros et de Salmson, on decida d’agir de meme en ce qui concernait le Lat6. Ce dernier ayant en gros les dimensions du mono-moteur cargo canadien Nordyuin « Norseman » dont un exemplaire pouvait etre acquis, il fut decide de confier a Roland Payen cette nouvelle transformation dans la serie «a la maniere de» I… Le travail n’etait cependant pas mince, et les transformations commences a la fin de 1978 n’arriverent a leur terme qu’en mai 1979. Les spectateurs du meeting des 2 et 3 juin lui virent effectuer des presentations qui comptaient dans ses premieres heures de vol. Le tournage necessita un voyage jusqu’au Sud-Marocain ou il accompagna le Breguet en septembre et octobre 1979. Ne presentant plus un gros int6ret dans la collection, une fois son rcle acheve, il est destine a servir a la construction d’une autre replique des que la necessite s’en fera sentir.

Moteur: Pratt et Witney 9 cylindres en
etoile de 600 ch. Envergure : 14,8 m. Lon-
gueur : 11.8 m. Poids en ordre de vol avec
pilote (la cabine n’est pas amenagee pour
recevoir des passagers): 2400 kg. Vitesse
de croisiere : 180 kmlh. Vitesse ascension-
nelle : 6 m/seconde.

Replica Salmson 2

With the making of the “Age of the Aces” completed, Jean Sails signed with a TV company a new contract for the making of “the crew”, by Joseph Kessel. But the programme needed two two-seaters urgently of a French type of 1917. The solution was the same one that for the Albatross:

In store were two airframes of Caudron Lucioles (“Firefly”) (two-seater trainers of the pre-W.W.II period) which, with the help of some modifications, were going to be able to take I’ appearance of Salmson 2.A2. Under the control of Roland Payen, work was put in good train. At the end of September, the first turns of propeller were made with the first plane while a group worked night and day to get the second ready.

These planes, just like the false Albatross, have participated in 1979 with the making of a new series entitles “the conquest of the Sky”.

Moteur: Salmson 9 cylindres en etoile
de 135 ch. Envergure : 9,9m. Longueur:

7,7 m. Poids en ordre de vol avec equipage
deux personnes : 800 kg. Vitesse de croi-
siere : 120 kmlh. Vitesse ascensionnelle : 3
m/seconde.

It’s interesting to see that innovator Payen was involved, he of the Payen ‘Katy’ in le Bourget and many other ‘arrow’ designs.

I’d guess that it’s likely these are the same aircraft. What a story!

Cheers

A couple of photos showing one of the Salmson A2A Replicas at La Ferte Alais in 1980. In the background of one of the shots is the Norseman which was later converted into the Latecoere 17P and is the subject of the third photo taken at La Ferte in 1986.

Actually i think i might have answered my own question – seeing as looking further, Barton appear to have a 1.5 strut and an SE5 rep on show, together with GBH-7 their funbus… they must have come from BB

TT

Anyone know if the airframes below are still at Botany Bay – they are no longer listed in W&R – (aha MK12 i now carry an inflatable W&R for emergencies!)

following a google:-

‘Displayed here are G-IBED R22 (has G-BMHN markings also, on ground floor), J-1712 Venom FB54 (Pod Only on top floor), N5177 Sopwith 1/2 Strutter (on top floor), BAPC176/A4850 SE.5A rep ‘

[ from same source as above apparently…The Bygone Times Antique Warehouse on the B5250, to the South of Leyland has the following: C4940 Bristol M1C Replica, XG540 Sycamore (in the car park), F-OTAN-6 Nord 1002 (G-BAYV) (under tarp in the car park). ]

Spoke to Graham Orphan at CW this morning who reckons that the funbus rep looks more like a modified DH2 than a funbus =which would make sense…?

All t best

TT

I concur with David – I photographed the (static) machine when at Coventry. I understand that for a while it may have been stored at Barton before ending up reinvented as a Sopwith as per DB’s message.

My old 1980s ‘Les Vieux avions de la Ferte-Alais’ book has the two Salmson 2 replicas listed. Built for ‘Temps des as’ from Caudron Lucioles, they later apreared in ‘La conquete du ciel’.

Smart money says that they are the same besties.

More soon.

Edit – It didn’t like my Continental quotes!

One was derelict at Coventry in 1990 – it nwent to the Macclesfield group and ended up at Botany Bay antiques centre . It’s been mocked up as a Sopwith 1 1/2 Strutter.

I recall a French TV-series from around 1980/81 (?), that featured both the Salmson 2A2 replicas as well as a couple of Breguet 14 replicas. The series was about early French air mail pilots. I think that a Noorduyn UC-64A Norseman was converted into a Latécoere 25 (Not sure about the designation).

Incidentally, one of the Breguet 14s used was apparently F-AZBH, which is now on display at the Royal Thai AF Museum.

The link below has some useful photos and info on the Salmson 2A2:
http://groups.msn.com/Salmson2A2/_homepage.msnw?pgmarket=en-us

Regards,

Jan

This might interest:

Salmson replica in Japan

When I first visited the Jean salis collection at La Ferte Alais in the mid 80’s I seem to remember a couple of very similar Salmsom replicas lurking in the hangar. I’ll try to find a photo if I can.

Septic.

Its the salmsons im intigued about, carnt recall ever seeing them. The pic above was talken at Lt Grandsden in 1985.

I think there’s a pic of the DH2 in Melv’s WW1 book.

Found this pic of one of the reps on Airliners.net