Sea Vixen- RIAT

I think this thread has reached the end of its useful life.

This moderator is closing it to new posts before it descends into even more mudslinging.

Bruce

Might I draw your attention to Peter’s comments a few posts above…

…ooooh, dangerous ground, pitching the moderators against eachother!:rolleyes:

Might I draw your attention to Peter’s comments a few posts above…

Chox.

The organisers of RIAT assembled a program

You didn’t like it, didn’t go, didn’t pay a penny, didn’t contribute to the RAF Benevolent Fund.

Why whinge here at such length? You made your point on page one. Others who actually went to the show disagree with you.

Why are you bleating on endlessly here instead of writing to the show’s organisers and telling them what you’d like to see next year. They can then make up their minds whether it’s worth investing a few more thousand quid in display items in the hope that there’s more than just you of the same opinion?

Job done.

Moggy

I share a lot of the views of Chox and Wyvern. Air show organisers seem to have little imagination at air shows these days. Plonk a few common types in the static and fly noisy fast jets up and down the flightline, concluding with the Red Arrows and they think that’s enough! Yes times change and we have the lovely CAA and Heath & Safety to ruin things.
I recall the wonderful RAF 38 Group set piece attacks with transports (Beverleys, then Argosies) deploying tanks and troops whilst Hunters beat up the airfield with pyrotechnics being let off on the groundand helicopters deployed more troops. These days with our armed forces being so stretched, I don’t expect to see such spectacles..until the RAF introduced the Role Demo which brought back all that excitement a couple of years ago! The Kemble show organisers have imagination and often have pyrotechnics whilst the airfield is ‘beat up’, so why did RIAT have such a lack-lustre flying display with nothing to excite or be ‘different’? Yes there was some good flying and airmanship, but they could do better overall!

It is strange that there seems to be a sort of shared belief that it’s somehow “against the rules” to criticise air show organisers. It’s almost as if we perceive ourselves as being “on the same team” and so we inevitably give them the benefit of the doubt even when the show isn’t much to get excited about. Ultimately it’s a crazy situation as of course we are merely “the punters” who pay the money and, therefore, are entitled to suitable entertainment in return. I think people seem to have forgotten that we don’t owe the show organisers anything and at least in RIAT’s case, they certainly don’t “give” us anything – it all comes at a price. Seems to me that in a wider sense, we have a slightly disfunctional relationship with them!

PS Wyvern thanks for your PM – appreciated.

This thread was interesting until comments by certain members quickly degraded the thread into a slinging match. May I remind you that there is a pm system available to use for such sniping and also a reminder not to post private message content on a public forum!

Also I removed the questionable comments regarding another online aviation forum. If you have issues with another forum then by all means take it up with that forums Webmaster. Don’t use this forum to snipe at another online forum.

At last.!!!

Anyway back on thread. I must admit that my recent (and first) visit to Kemble was extremely enjoyable. It had most of the ingredients that i look for in a good airshow, i.e easy location / entry, reasonable admission price, not too far a walk from the carpark, plenty of stalls / eateries, good static lineup (no Britannia?), excellent flying programme and good viewing point for the display (spoilt only by those right at the front).

No airshow will ever be perfect from everyone’s point of view.. but personally i think the closest i have come to such an experience was always Mildenhall. From 1976 to the early nineties i only missed two, but even then there were still problems with traffic (sometimes horrendous) and depending on how early you got in you could end up with a long walk to the exhibits. But the static lineups and the actual displays were generally superb and varied, and i think its now a sorely missed venue on the aviation calendar.

I actually live overlooking Duxford airfield and whilst i am extremely lucky to see so much activity there i have in the past thought some of the airshows (excluding legends) to be a bit samey. And judgeing by the early confirmed list for the September airshow its looking much like the May line up.. and sadly no Vulcan or Sea Vixen either by the looks of it.

Personally i think that the general public and enthusiasts alike appreciate a little variety between airshows at the same venues, as i’m sure many of the people attending do so for most if not all the airshows there. So value for money really must play a more important role if airshows are to survive and bring in the numbers needed to make them financially worthwhile. As has already been seen same ole same is not really good enough.. but thats just my opinion.

This thread was interesting until comments by certain members quickly degraded the thread into a slinging match. May I remind you that there is a pm system available to use for such sniping and also a reminder not to post private message content on a public forum!

Also I removed the questionable comments regarding another online aviation forum. If you have issues with another forum then by all means take it up with that forums Webmaster. Don’t use this forum to snipe at another online forum.

As I’ve mentioned before, I think Yeovilton’s show would easily have been the best show of the year had it not been for the weather and some cancellations. Less expensive than RIAT, certainly far less hype, varied, and with a good (under the circumstances) collection of military types on show. It was sad that their efforts were thwarted.

The Leuchars show in September still holds a great deal of promise too.

I have only been to RIAT once about 6/7 years ago. It is a good place to see the `big stuff`, B52, B1 B ect. but was not worth queing all day on the Sat (not getting in) and Sun morning. There was nothing there I had not seen at Mildenhall wich was much cheaper and a far better show. Probably the best show I have ever been to.

what do we think is the best show now from an enthusiasts point of view (not including Legends) ?

One way to improve RIAT is to ditch the themed show idea. Things like Anniversaries of aircraft entering service are useless (prime example being the Hercules 30th anniversay, the thing that persuaded me not to go there again. A hercules is still a Fat Albert no matter how you dress it up).

Other than the Navy100 flypasts, I think next full displays for the Sea Vixen are at RNAS Culdrose on the 29th July and then a couple of displays at the B/mth Air Festival between the 20-23rd Aug.

Luckily for me the Sea Vixen is one aircraft I see flying quite regularly, and she did look quite magnificent in her navy colours displaying over the sea at B/mth last year.:D

Oh she is displaying at Bounrmouth:D ? I saw her display there last year on the friday and thought it was a brilliant display and good choice of aircraft to end the day it was ment to be the typhoon but they made it the sea vixen, Hope they get her to do a flypast again. Last year I think she did it with the Red arrows on the sunday.

Scoobypilot did you fly for the SIMONS SIRCUS :confused:

All the best

James

I can’t say that I’ve noticed anything on UKAR which is of particular note – just the usual range of “I liked it” and “I didn’t like it” comments which don’t really make particularly interesting reading. I’d agree that there must have been some excellent demonstrations at this year’s RIAT but at the same time I’m sure you would agree that in all honesty, a considerable amount of the flying programme would undoubtedly be described as “dull” by anyone who has more than a passing interest in military aviation? I’m prompted to mention the very subject of this thread – the Sea Vixen. Nobody is criticising the skill of the Vixen’s pilot but I think everyone would agree that a simple flypast is – by any standards – dull?

On UKAR there is a decent discussion on the good points and bad points of RIAT 2009 along with useful suggestions to improve the event. Nobody is saying it was a perfect airshow but it was certainly a lot better than some would let you believe. Some of us can only attend a very few airshows in a year and have to be very selective about which ones we attend due to cost and distance. By choosing to go to RIAT I have got a fair idea what I’m going to get and this year I wasn’t disappointed.
There were many excellent displays in the air and to call some of them “dull” is a particular insult to many skilled aviators.

hehehehe best RIAT i’ve been to in 15 years:) however its been 16 years since i last went to one:D

[I]
If you want an “enthusiasts event” why don’t you go and organise one yourself? If you read the history of IAT that’s essentially that the original (and largely still current) organisers did.
Over time their priorities have changed. Thats what happens, get over it.

I don’t “want” anything, nor do I need to read-up on the history of IAT. I know already – I was there. Point is, RIAT repeatedly claim that their event is for the enthusiast. Seems logical therefore, that they should ensure that the event meets this aim? If priorities have changed, then why don’t RIAT “get over it” (as you put it) and stop pretending that the show is anything other than a commercial fund-raiser aimed at the general public?

Ahem..pure guff. Your argument boils down to RIAT advertising the event incorrectly in your view.
Haven’t you got better things to be doing with your life? We all know it’s not a true enthusiasts event.
As somebody else has pointed out if you don’t want anything, why oh why do you bother to whine so much?

Pity the Vixen didn’t do more than a flypast, it was good to see it in the air at Yeovilton.

Odiham tomorrow?

Well I was generally referring to public displays rather than the private ones, but yes, its listed as displaying there.

I guess there’s nothing really to stop anyone standing outside and watching if they wished.

Is it?

Not quite sure where this is actually stated. I thought it was supposed to be an Air Tattoo?

Seems odd that if a Vulcan and the BBMF are deemed appropriate, the Vixen isn’t?

Oh well, it was a lousy line-up in any case which is why I stayed home. Best part of £40 to see nothing of any great interest isn’t my idea of fun. Great show though if you like Gripens and Hornets!

Exactly the reason I haven’t been to Fairford for years. Too samey, too expensive, too little organisation of arriving road traffic. Fairford on a good day is worse than Duxford on a bad day and as we all know Duxford can be pretty horrendous at times.

Other than the Navy100 flypasts, I think next full displays for the Sea Vixen are at RNAS Culdrose on the 29th July…

Odiham tomorrow?

Wing Commander (retd) Chox – if you do not ‘want’ anything, why do you continue to post your interminable blocks of text, while avoiding any straight question put to you? Still waiting to hear what you did in the RAF.

RIATS DISAPPEARING SEA VIXEN

Sat, queued 1.5 hours from lechlade at 7am to get in, SEA VIXEN joined the 100 queue,then bu–ered off.
Sun,beat the queues,set off even earlier,SEA VIXEN did the same.
Mon, wrote disapointed blog on RIAT site, didn`t get published.
Tues,writing to this, noting others disgruntled at RIAT

CONCLUSION not going again (disgruntled SIMONS SIRCUS ex member)