Shame

I saw the clip when it was first posted and it made me smile.

Regardless of which side of the fence we sit in this matter, there is a humourous content to the clip and I think that was its intention, to make us smile!

As for flying too low, I can see that some will consider the act was dangerous but didn’t OFMC do something similar for ‘A Piece of Cake’ and IIRC didn’t that also include flying under a bridge?

What’s the difference?

In either case, a ‘sneeze’ could have resulted in loss of life and a valuable aircraft but and this is the important part, there was no loss.

Further, isn’t all flying dangerous and as for the OFMC flying too close when displaying, what about the Red Arrows, Blue Angels or even the Diamond Nine Tiger Moths. All flying extremely close and in the case of the Toger Moths, one strong gust of wind could have had a real consequence for the whole team.

I don’t see anyone complaining the Arrows or any other display team should fly further apart and certainly shouldn’t fly at one another.

Are these teams more professional than the OFMC?

I personally don’t think so!

As I said above, I think that we should just view the clip as was intended and have a little smile and move on.

Tony

I think the low flying clip was great, and so I suspect do many others, if not the vast majority who viewed it. Life is not without risk, and those that fly understand that there is always that elevated risk when they fly. Dare I say it but if you stand at the end of a runway with a camera and a presenter then the temptation can become too much…………………. if you catch my drift. The film crew must have understood the risk, even if they did not quite expect what they got. Lets just enjoy it.

As for the pilot, well if it is who we think, then those of you who can remember back to the early 80’s and I’m thinking May 1982 at Biggin Hill would have seen flying of a similar nature from a number of pilots.

I can recall Ray flying both MH343 and Spencer Flacks Red MKXIV, the later in conjunction with the Red Hunter that was flown to perfection by Stephan K…… (I’m not even going to attempt the spelling but the name was Polish in origin but I believe that Stephan was from New Zealand). The crowd was in aware of the standard of flying, and I have to say I never had that feeling that things did not look right.

In those dark distant days the flying was a little more exciting, and the regulations at more relaxed. As I recall Ray always took off in the spits and flew the length of the runway at very low altitude gaining speed and then pulling up in the vertically and sometimes into a loop and rolling off the top if my memory serves me correctly. This was very impressive. So the manoeuvre that he allegedly pulled in the film clip was well practised and I assume well thought out. Standards and regulations have quite rightly been improved over the years and no one would wish to turn the clock back, but I’m sure much of the regulation has been aimed at some of the lesser lights that have come to display flying with the 10 fold increase in airworthy warbirds, some being flown by pilots with out even 100th the experience of the more established display pilots.

However words such as irresponsible do great injustice to the pilots and those that spend vast sums of their own money to feed our insatiable appetite for seeing ever greater variety of old aircraft fly. So lets not pass comment on who did what unless we were there.

And I would have to say that Ray is undoubtedly the Best spitfire pilot for flying this type of manoeuvre. This is not to say that others can not fly the same way. Others still such as Squadron Leader Paul Day have to fly and display the Spitfire to advantage, and at the same time bear the responsibility of ensuring that part of the nation’s heritage is not lost by not taking any elevated risks at all. That he does not pull off the ‘exciting’ manoeuvres that Ray has been able to do does not in my eyes make him a lesser pilot, or Ray for that matter a greater Pilot. Let’s just enjoy it all
🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

I certainly have seen similar ones before, some of which made my heart jump into my mouth, however not when somebody is standing in the way, my point was the claim that Mr Hanna is the best pilot in the UK and therefore it is OK and nothing could possibly have happened. Fantastic piece of footage and interesting to watch, but if you take a step back and think of the possible consequences had something not gone according to plan it takes on a whole new light, the P51 clip was just scary from the word go.

Yak 11 Fan

You must admit its quite unusual for members of the general public to actually be able to see video such as the one in question. I well remember a number of beat ups in Spitfires at Audley End, which were NOT at the point of take off, and just as low as that one (No names!!) I am sure you must have seen some similar ones yourself!

That said, there was rarely anyone at the end of the runway with a camera!!

Bruce

Originally posted by AlexisLambert
Secondly, the pilot as we all know was Ray Hanna and he is without a doubt THE finest pilot the U.K. He has thousands of hours of low level flying to his credit and if ever you attend Flying Legends you will see most aeroplanes hugging the ground after take off, especially ones flown as well as OFMC’s.

What a daft statement, he may well in your view be the finest pilot in the UK with thousands of hours of low level flying but that would make little difference if he sneezed and wiped himself, Alain DeCadinet and the film crew out. Thankfully it didn’t happen but things can and do go wrong, at that level it wouldn’t make a difference how quick your reactions are, it is still more than likely to end up in a big mess.
OFMC’s aircraft are spectacular in the way they are displayed but it depends upon your point of view as to whether they are flown well or thrashed to death, I have spoken in the past to two owners who have lent OFMC their aircraft only to have them return in a poor state, one of which needed a new engine at the owners expense, the other was used for a photo shoot and the first the owner knew was when he walked into a shop to see his aircraft on the front cover of a magazine.
This debate could go on for ever and it won’t make the slightest difference as these things will continue to happen up to the point where something goes wrong.
I would question whether Mr Hanna is THE best pilot in the UK as I can think of a number of others flying for people such as TFC who could qualify for this title and who make take exception to this, it’s all down to the individuals perception of what is good and what is dangerous.

Don’t bother Alexis, there is no arguing with the man. Facts just get in the way of his opinion.

Totally dis-agree with you WarbirdUK.
Firstly the aircraft was on take off and if you watch the clip properly you will see MH434 lift off the ground and retract the gear.
Secondly, the pilot as we all know was Ray Hanna and he is without a doubt THE finest pilot the U.K. He has thousands of hours of low level flying to his credit and if ever you attend Flying Legends you will see most aeroplanes hugging the ground after take off, especially ones flown as well as OFMC’s.

Originally posted by sconnor
The pilot had just taken off and kept it low after retracting the undercarriage. Perfectly normal procedure as anyone who attends Flying Legends would have seen.

It was not a low pass.

Warbird UK you are wrong.

Have to disagree with you there! It’s NOT normal departure procedure on take off to hold that altitude after take off, nor is it normal procedure to fly at people on the ground. There are three areas of stupidity here,
1, Air traffic for allowing the take off with people on the runway, if indeed this was shot from a take off which I doubt as I see no ground markings,
2, The pilot for agreeing to fly in that manner, especially in front of a film crew.
3, The film crew for positioning where they did.
All in all, fodder for the anti brigade, Not good for our industry!

Decadenet & film crew should have known better than to stand at what is effectively the end of the runway, having asked a pilot to take off for them.

What kind of irresponsible fool puts himself in such an obviously dangerous position. If anything had gone wrong during the take off he, and his team, would have been toast!

What I want to know is, who gave permission for take off, with blithering idiots in the aircraft’s path?

Certainly isn’t the Pilot’s fault it is a well known fact that nose engined propeller driven aircraft don’t allow any kind of reasonable forward vision when on the ground.

I know that, and all I am is (or rather was) a blasted SAC Telepop!

Perhaps there’s a way of private messaging or emailing the link to those who request to see/download it? I for one have seen the clip in question and tickled somewhat by and searched into the night trying to find it as the link had mysteriously dissapeared… Absoloutly fantastic bit of flying, so nudge, nudge, wink, wink… If anyone’s got it pass it on! 😉

No ! Not as I see it.

Is it possible that the Spitfire has just taken off the pilot has whipped up the UC quickly and is still low?

Or is there evidence here that the plane has been brought down low?

The resolution isn’t high enough to determine what is going on in the distance – and the plane is in front of a small wood – disguising it even more.

David,
Maybe I didn’t word my last posting very well, I think the flying was irresponsible, equally the TV or film Co must have asked for the flying to be that way & that was irresponsible too. A forum for me is an area to discuss items not to just have items of no consequence posted, what is wrong with discussing the Firefly crash? It is by discussing & getting other peoples views that most accident investigations work their craft. Over the years I have sat on several air accident investigations both civil & military in the UK & Europe & the least little thing has been taken into account, by listening to eye witness accounts you learn a lot especially if you are not at the site where the incident took place. Hope that clears up a few points! Cheers.

Interesting Warbird – you don’t approve of the low flying footage or even people having the ability to view the pictures but on another thread you don’t see any problem with people coming up with whatever explanation they can for the Firefly crash and posting it whether it offends people or not.
The fact that this footage might upset the ‘authorities’ begs the question why have any legislative procedures for flying if they are not enforced ? This footage is quite clearly in the public domain – no point in shutting the gate once the horse has bolted !
I can recall one case in the last ten years where a person on the ground has been killed by deliberate low flying and another
where a person was very seriously injured. In this case I have to wonder what the film conpany were thinking to allow it to happen. Having said that I once saw a photographer stand on top of a fuel bowser to get a better picture of a hovering helicopter so maybe people have moments of madness.

Just out of curiosity please Webmaster – how did the stepladder poll crash the forum? Any idea? This isn’t a trick question, i’m just curious.

Having just viewed the clip It is a seriously irresponsible bit of flying & I don’t care WHO was in the seat! If you want to add fuel to the anti-brigade this is it with bells & whistles, at that altitude you cannot see much ahead in level flight (having sat in a Mk9 in the rigging position you can see nothing forward past the spinner for some wayahead) how no one was injured was a miracle! No wonder it was removed from the thread.

I also feel that to post a short cut to the offending item Is also irresponsible & just about as daft!

For what it’s worth I reckon the Yak11 is a cracking bit of kit, best of all, It’s got a ’round’ engine!
Cheers

Rated 18
The clip is currently on the It’s All about Warfare World War II – Air War Forum:-

http://pub131.ezboard.com/fallboutwarfarefrm31.showMessage?topicID=3117.topic

I still think it is lower than I’d want to see a Spit but it does make for fascinating viewing – as long as nobody gets hurt.

Flood

The thread regarding the low flying Spitfire was removed on request of authorities within the aviation industry.

The “stepladder poll” was not removed it was responsible for the last forum crash and was lost in the rebuild.

Kind Regards

WebMaster

Welcome aboard Mike

cracking hit of flying innit !

Trying to see if I can set my pc up so it runs everytime I switch on….beats the hell out of the good old ‘Windows’ theme tune and looks infinitley better