Spade grips on Dominic Winter Books Auction site

£1,000.00 for a bent Me 109 propellor blade with an uncertain provenance???!

Yep. The world has gone mad!

Got one of those

I have one of those “Dakota” switches…..£100+…has the world gone mad!::…Didn’t sell though…..

In that case, I suspect it was rather less painful for Dominic Winter (if not the vendor!) when they refunded the purchaser of lot 444 which I gather they did shortly after the sale. I am reliably informed by someone in the saleroom that the auctioneers were told yesterday that this lot was not what it was purported to be. Hence the refund. All’s well that ends well!

I sent an email bid in on one of the RJ Mitchell items that Dominic Winter had estimated would sell for £200-£300.

I gather it went for £15,500 + commission + VAT on the commission. 🙂

Mark

It is entirely likely that both the vendor and saleroom genuinely believed the item to be the real deal. Unless one has some relatively specialist knowledge it might well be difficult for the “control column layman” to know the difference between a replica and the real thing. I am certain that an auction house with the reputation and standing of Dominic Winter would be nothing other than scrupulous in presenting their description and, had they thought it to be have been a replica, I have not the slightest doubt that they would have said as much or else not entered it. Unfortunately, these particular replicas are presented in such a way that the details on the brass plaque implies or infers that this is the actual control column from that aeroplane. After it changes hands a few times they sometimes “become” the real thing.

Of course, this item was sold with a folio of documents and I suppose it is possible that contained within those papers is something that describes it for what it is. In which case, and assuming the buyer is aware, then….well…good luck to the vendor. I’m just miffed that nobody was prepared to pay that sort of money for the ones I have had through my hands!!!

I now have a reasonable way of restoring the covering (which is a thermoset). Took me around 30 grips to get right!!!

XF940….I think I will pass as I have too many as it is!!

Not bad for someone who’s not an expert Tony 😉 If you aren’t i’m not sure who is.

I have a Firefly grip which I assume is fairly late – it has the standard wartime rubberised covering on the handle. Never seen that style of covering present on 424 before and just wonded if it had been ‘restored’. Incidently restoring these grips seems to be extremely difficult to get right – if I had a pound for every bad restoration i’ve seen I probably could have bought one of these!

Elliott, 424 is basically a later grip typically fitted to late Hurri/Tempest/Typhoon grip with the later type of covering applied to later aircraft like the Tempest and Meteor….the Hendon Tyffe has the same covering…the camera button is typical Hawker. 424 was a bargain. That said a Tyffie & Tempest would have had a electro pneumatic not a pneumatic like 424 has. On reflection (without checking the grip casting for an AH number and the gun button area to ensure the brass pipes do actually go to the button and that that the button has not been refitted) I would think it late Hurri. I would estimate its value around £1500-2000 subject to checking some issues with the grip. The other grip would not get house room….there are much better replica grips out there!!!
Looking at the catalogue, I am not sure 397 & 424 sold as they are marked £0. I think the vendor of 444 is off celebrating!!

I am not sure 397 & 424 sold as they are marked £0.

Don’t understand that as they both hammered at £740 – usually if any reserve hasn’t been met, then they show on-line as ‘Passed’ – it’s possible that whoever was working the PC didn’t click the ‘passed’ button and just clicked the ‘sold’ button at the max bid received – I couldn’t listen in as there were quite a few people in the cafe 😮

Why not give them a call and see if they will sell them as an ‘aftersale’? Most salerooms will do this for 1 week after the sale 😉

Elliott, 424 is basically a later grip typically fitted to late Hurri/Tempest/Typhoon grip with the later type of covering applied to later aircraft like the Tempest and Meteor….the Hendon Tyffe has the same covering…the camera button is typical Hawker. 424 was a bargain. That said a Tyffie & Tempest would have had a electro pneumatic not a pneumatic like 424 has. On reflection (without checking the grip casting for an AH number and the gun button area to ensure the brass pipes do actually go to the button and that that the button has not been refitted) I would think it late Hurri. I would estimate its value around £1500-2000 subject to checking some issues with the grip. The other grip would not get house room….there are much better replica grips out there!!!
Looking at the catalogue, I am not sure 397 & 424 sold as they are marked £0. I think the vendor of 444 is off celebrating!!

I was in the Little Chef on the A30 on my way back from Penzance, having a nice cup of coffee and a lump of cake ( 😀 ) using the free Wifi to watch the auction. I HAD registered to bid, but the prices were a bit rich for me.

Still, I know where to go when I want to sell off my collection :diablo:

PS. If the buyer of any lot finds out that the auction house have misdescribed, they can ask (demand) a refund. Whilst many auction houses tend to put the usual “….the buyer must satisfy themselves about condition and authenticity blah blah etc”, the auction house still has a duty of care not to misdescribe. Auctions are part of my professional life, so I have had much experience. Most salerooms are quite reasonable if you can prove that something is not as it was stated in the catalogue.

Here is the control column grip that Lot 444 pretended to be…..

Judging by the last one of these copies I bought a couple of years back I would say that this one was overpriced by something in the order of £1,660.00

If I had back-editions of FlyPast (1980 or 1990 perhaps?) and the time I’d trawl through to see if I could find the advert for these replicas.

Thanks XF940

I wonder who the vendor was? It would be nice to know. One of those grips (Hurricane lot 424) looked familiar. The coating on the grip handle just looked very odd to me. Had it been offered on a website before?

Yes Andy – a fair price for a BoB grip, but it plainly wasn’t!

Cheers

Lot 444 sold for £1700 + commission + internet bidding fees of 3% + VAT!!

397 and 424 went for £740 each + commission (& VAT) to a room or phone bidder.

The Pucara panel sold for £1200 + commission

424 is a bargain at £740…..lucky chap…hope it was someone on the Forum. (Not me I hasten to add).

Caveat emptor as ever.

The real ones sound cheap to me!

Bruce

You are kidding!!

If lot 444 had sold for £100 it would have been £25 above its market value.

Someone is not going to be very happy.

Lot 444 sold for £1700 + commission + internet bidding fees of 3% + VAT!!

397 and 424 went for £740 each + commission (& VAT) to a room or phone bidder.

The Pucara panel sold for £1200 + commission

Thanks Andy and Tony.

Tony is quite right about Lot 444.

I have had several of these through my hands in recent years. The last one I had sold for £75.00 which is about top money for them.

They are certainly copies, and intended to be just that! They were not intended to deceive and I am sure I can recall an advert for these in FlyPast many moons ago.

The estimated price is £600 – £800 I think? Well, I hope nobody gets stung.

The original of the control column this is supposed to represent is in the Kent Battle of Britain Museum at Hawkinge, I believe. I suspect very strongly indeed that it is not for sale, never has been and never will be!

Caveat Emptor.

Some amazing photo collections and flying clothing items on there aswel, how come these things are always flagged up on the actual day of sale!
Agree with Elliott, the Rapide fin, rudder, and prop looks v.nice.

The first looks nice. Would like to know more about the main AH number though as the one quoted is a partial and I do not recognise it. The button and lever look good.

Middle one looks nice. Could be a bargain for someone

The last looks a little bit like one of the reps produced for the 50th anniversary…though Obviously I am not saying it is. It really is up to the buyer to check it all over and look for the stamps in the usual places (back of gunbutton, brake lever etc). Though I am no expert.

Would be interested to know how much they go for.