Spitfire Crash – 1941? France?

Are you sure it say Amiens? I mean N and M do look similar I guess, but the ‘N’ looks pretty much identical to the ‘M’ if that’s what they are, I know there’s no such place as Amiems but then maybe it isn’t Amiens because I can’t see an ‘S’ on the end of the word, as hard as I look?

Tangmere1940, the ‘accent’ over the name could well be the dot of an ‘i’, as in the word ‘bei’. That said such captions should be treated with caution.
Try squadrons with a second letter U. Not that many: DU, JU, OU, WU and maybe FU & AU. The upstroke of the letter closest to the roundel has a deceptive curve level with the centre of the roundel to give the impression of an O or D, but that apparent curve is probably the result of damage. If a ‘proper’ curve in the lettering then it would make a very small O or D and be quite disproportionate to the size of the roundel and the G. That then opens the possibility for a letter U (or even J) in addition to O and D which remain just as valid.

Interesting photograph the Staff car looks Mercedes, it’s funny but the aircraft looks like its just be gently laid on the grass no disturbance even under the wing

Ah, as I suspected, I missed something – sorry!

You are correct in that it says ‘1940’ and it appears to be ‘bei Desvres’ or ‘bei Amiens’ – or something like that. Tricky to read. That said, there seems to be an accent over the name of the location.

However, there are problems with the year given the sky band on the fuselage and the heavy foliage on trees and hedges. That places it in summer. More logically, then, that ought to be summer 1941?

Sorry if I’m missing something, but isn’t the date on the back 1940, not 1941, and doesn’t the location simply translate as ‘crash near Amiens? I doubt this helps, but hope it does.

Thank you for suggesting that possibility.

An initial sweep of 222 Sqn losses has not thrown anything up.

This is likely 222 sqn Spitfire (ZD – G), see the very similar G on another downed 222 sqn Spitfire in 1941 – Sg. Ptacek, Aug 19, 1941, see http://www.conscript-heroes.com/Art01-Rudolph-Ptacek-960.html.
If there is another loss documented in mid 1941, we are looking at the replacement aircraft.

Best. David S.

Just another one to throw in- what about 1 Squadron RCAF with codes YO? It appears they converted from Hurricanes in Sept ’41.

Thanks, I thought it must be something simple 🙂

Electrically bonded for Wireless telegraphy.

John

What does the W/T denote on the tailplane, something all Spitfires had ?

A good point but Ortho darkens red – there just happens to be an orange tint to MAP Yellow. However, there are photos that show the same trend on the Red and Dark Earth yet leaves the Yellow light: whether this is caused by a filter that has much the same effect on the red as ortho film or a filter used with ortho that affects the yellow too, I can’t say. It would be unusual, I grant you, to have ortho film in German use; it seems to have been more a British thing.

That doesn’t work as a loss with 145 Sqn, but it was lost near Gosnay with 485 Sqn (OU codes) on 19 August 1941. Spitfire IIa.

Too much of a stretch, perhaps, to imagine that P7977 retained its ‘G’ letter when it went to 485? Seems unlikely. Plus, 485s pattern/style of squadron codes seems much different.

P7977 SO-G.

Mark

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And don’t dismiss any squadron codes ending in ‘U’, if there are any. That apparent curve near the ground indicating a D or O could just be a bend in the skin or a piece of wreckage in the way.

Indeed so! Another possibility to check. Thank you.

145 Squadron Va (“SO”) is a possibility?

Its not orthochromatic film. Ortho film darkens yellows so that they come out black. This is not the case here.

I think mid-August 1941 is the correct date for the change of scheme. Looking at the photo, the dark appearance of the red in the roundel, and the overall dark appearance of the upper (or at least side!) surfaces suggest the earlier scheme photographed on orthochromatic film.