Spitfire Mk IX Stick Forces

Thank for your help Paul, private message sent.

Thanks Paul, very interesting.

I don’t suppose you have a copy of John Allisons comparison, I have looked on the Web and can’t find it.

Regarding the mk1 I hear the ailerons were very heavy until they replaced the fabric versions with metal skinned versions, is that shown in your table?

Thanks again,
Tony

Tony,

The John Allison article was in the June 2001 copy of Pilot Magazine.

I was/am in the process of scanning many of these pilot reports etc, so when I’ve done this one, I ‘ll send you a copy.

The various charts are available on the web, but finding them can be sometimes difficult, and I can’t always recall where I got them from!

However, I’ll send you all I’ve found and obtained to date. (PM me with your email).

Cheers

Paul

P.S. I do have one that shows roll rate of the fabric covered ailerons with the metal covered ones btw.

I have access to an RAE report (Tech Note Aero 1612 dated March 45) on the proposal to fit a Spit Mk 21 with remote control so that high Mach number dives could be carried out safely the stick forces estimated were +/- 150lb for the Elevator and +/- 70 lb for the Ailerons.

The early Spitfire ailerons were heavy at high speed – the speed at which these matters are quoted is very important.

Thanks Paul, very interesting.

I don’t suppose you have a copy of John Allisons comparison, I have looked on the Web and can’t find it.

Regarding the mk1 I hear the ailerons were very heavy until they replaced the fabric versions with metal skinned versions, is that shown in your table?

Thanks again,
Tony

I have a table that gives the elevator stick forces for a MK.I, and some roll rate charts somewhere that also give the stick force applied to achieve the recorded rate of roll.

The table for the MK.I gives values of around 2lbs pull force at 300 Mph+ IIRC!

In a couple of modern pilot reports, Bruce Lockwood says that the MKXIV he flew (NH749) was about 6lbs per G, whilst John Allison in a comparison between the BF109G, Hurricane, and Spitfire, gives 10lbs for a 2G pull in the latter at 260 Mph (MK.XVI RW382), using a purpose built handheld stick force gauge.

There is no doubt that the Spitfire was very light in pitch compared to other nations WWII fighters, and even the British ones too.

(In contrast, John Allison recorded a 30lb force in the 109G-2 ‘Black 6’ at 250 Mph for a 2G pull with the same stick force gauge).

I guess you can see why Spitfire pilots say that elevator control in the Spitfire is “a two finger job”, as opposed to a two handed job in the 109 & Buchon!

Cheers

Paul