Spitfire Mk1a P9444 (Science Museum, London)

Actually, the 1937 Spitfire drawing was mentioned by the late Edgar Brooks on this Key Publishing forum. Topic here.

Gentlemen, I have read on another forum that there is a 1937 Spitfire camouflage drawing in the National Archives. Can anyone suggest which group of documents this drawing might reside in at Kew?

Oh right ok, yes I should have guessed it was the differing roundel positions and not the actual camouflage pattern that differred. Thank you for your comments. 🙂

So would you say that the Ducimus camouflage plan is accurate?

Yes.

It is an amalgamation because it covers the time-frame variations, roundels etc, from 1938 to 1942 on just the one drawing.

Mark

Thank you for the information, Mark.

So would you say that the Ducimus camouflage plan is accurate?

I notice that there is another plan in the Mk.I camouflage in the October 1969 issue of Scale Models which closely matches the Ducimus scheme. You say that the Ducimus scheme is an “amalgamation” of various sources of information for the lower marks. Does that mean that they differred over a period of developement?

In your opinion what is the most accurate published scheme diagram for a 1939/1940 Spitfire?

Evidently not the 1940 work’s drawing. In 1940 Supermarine used DTD 308 Cellulose paint not DTD 517 Synthetic paint. The new finish was introduced on Spitfires by Mod 697 ‘Introduce Improved Paint Scheme using DTD 517 Type S (retrofit all marks)’, date 11th August 1942. In 1940 the stencilling would have been DTD 308 C not DTD 517 S.

Ah, but supposing it was repainted in synthetic in the 1961 restoration. 🙂

A dilemma.

Mark

Ducimus book on the Spitfire Camouflage and Markings they refer to a “SUP.DRG30064 SHT.17G” drawing on the camouflage plan page. Do such drawings still exist?

There are many iterations of the works paint drawing. The ink on linen originals was continuously updated rather than redrawn in every modification case.

The Ducimus drawing is an amalgamation of the basic information for the lower end Marks.

Prints from the linen originals are in private hands, certainly I have some for the later Marks.

If the original linens exist they will be located with the rest of the Spitfire drawings at the RAFMus.

Mark

Evidently not the 1940 work’s drawing. In 1940 Supermarine used DTD 308 Cellulose paint not DTD 517 Synthetic paint. The new finish was introduced on Spitfires by Mod 697 ‘Introduce Improved Paint Scheme using DTD 517 Type S (retrofit all marks)’, date 11th August 1942. In 1940 the stencilling would have been DTD 308 C not DTD 517 S.

There are a couple of names I haven’t seen mentioned for a while

Used to send stuff back to JDR Rawlings back in the day, and worked with Robert Rudhall…..RIP lads

Tim

Mark12, thank you!

You mention “Works paint drawings”. Do these still exist?

I notice that in the Ducimus book on the Spitfire Camouflage and Markings they refer to a “SUP.DRG30064 SHT.17G” drawing on the camouflage plan page. Do such drawings still exist?

On a related note if you look at the underside of the wings on the adjacent Hurricane you can just about make out the smaller size roundel under the paint of the current one.

Regards,

Dan

Here is a crop from a shot I took in 1967.

With that amount of stencil detail it is clear they were working to the Works paint drawings.

Mark

I wonder how in terms of accuracy they dealt with the application of the markings/maintenance stencils. I appreciate it was a long time ago, but is anyone here familier with the restoration? Was it covered in a modelling/aviation magazine of the period? It would be nice to think that they had access to information or knowledgable former wartime painters that could ensure reasonable accuracy with regards to the markings and camouflage.

Thank you, Gentlemen. 🙂

Here a shot on Horse-Guards Parade in September 1949 in the new ‘exhibition’ livery

Image- John D R Rawlings

Mark

Thank you! 🙂

The boo says :-

…It then passed through a chain of M.U.s, Nos. 39, 82 and 52, before being allocated for display purpose on 28 August 1949.

Its first public appearance in its new-found role was on Horse Guards Parade in September 1949, moving to No. 58 M.U. Newark in 1951. Background participation in the ‘Angels One Five’ film at RAF Kenley followed before allocation to the Science Museum and transfer to their store in Sydenham on 16 December 1954. It was restored in No. 72 Sqdn markings in 1961 and put on display in the new aviation hall in 1963. Here it has remained suspended for over 40 years, although it was re-positioned recently due to a reorganisation of the exhibits.

Mark

If you compare the Robert Rudhall photo in this link you can see that it has been repainted http://www.warbirdregistry.org/spitregistry/spitfire-p9444.html