Spitfire R6915

re;

Why changer her windscreen etc? total waste of time, this is the configuration in which she made her last flight, presumably with the guns removed. She is more or less as she was when the engine was shut down.

I wonder if any legendary pilots learned to fly in her?

Some thoughts on R6915 …

If the paintwork is that original why isn’t it showing any squadron codes?

R6915 is at Duxford for “Conservation” and minor repair NOT any restoration, re-build, conversion, or even re-paint.

R6915 is a “Time Capsule” like no other Spitfire in the UK, It is very complete.

R6915 is in original wartime paint, which we believe was applied at 39 MU RAF Colerne (Wiltshire) in late 1943, the Spitfire later assed through 82 MU Lichfield ( Staffordshire) in May 1944, before going to 52 MU at Cardiff for packing, the latter MU is where the yellow stencilled markings of its RAF serial number were applied to all major components, this was so that on final re-assembly parts of the same airframe were re-united.

There are only two other complete early Spitfires still in current wartime paint, these are Mark I P9306 in Chicago, and Mark II P7973 in Australia, all other early complete Spitfires (P9444, K9942, X4590 etc) have been re-painted many times.

There are no plans for R6915 to go through the same paint-stripping and investigation processes used on the FAA Museum Cosair, although the fuselage will be examined in detail at Duxford for any evidenc of markings below the current paint scheme.

The Spitfire unfortunately suffered some damage at IWM London many years ago when being moved, this is planned to be very sympathetically repaired whilst at Duxford,

The airframe has considerable evidence of wartime repairs to skin damage, even possible bullet hole repairs, these are all to be investigated, and are very much part of R6915’s history as a “time capsule”.

R6915 will return to IWM London in due course, current designs show it again suspended, however hopefully with more suitable slinging methods which will not damage the airframe.

Once re-installed at IWM London the aircraft is most likely to be in position for many years, thus Conservation work now at Duxford is vitally important to retaining a safe exhibit for many years to come.

R6915 can currently be seen in Hangar 5 at IWM Duxford, many superb photographs have been posted on this Forum by “DCW”, no doubt these will follow the Conservation processes over coming months.

The IWM Duxford Conservation Team are those responsible for the most excellent work on the Museum’s Vampire T11, currently on show in Hangar 4 at Duxford, so R6915 is in safe hands.

Although plans can change, I hope the above puts the record straight on the current situation for R6915, a most important display Spitfire.

Volume 2 of “S*** S***” (due to be published in late Summer 2013) will feature an update on R6915, also many other aircraft detailed in Volume 1, which have changed circumstances.

As a foreigner to most of you but very much aware of British aviation history I don’t inderstand why everyone is so passionate about keeping an iconic survivor of a Battle that changed to fate of western civilisation in an OTU guise? Why not fit correct canopy and stubs and as someone suggested put it back in war colours rather than this? I sign saying it was used in the BoB is a bit odd, in the proper context in its original guise there no need to.

If the paintwork is that original why isn’t it showing any squadron codes?

WELDING SOME ANCHOR POINTS ON!!! 😮

Last week I couldn’t spell engineer…….

This week, Ir1?

With Duxford keeping the P51 (rumoured) and the FW190 going back to the RAFM they will need the Spitfire at Lambeth to show what a aeroplane with a propeller looks like!!!

But she should stay in her current paint but on her wheels not a glorified airfix kit hanging from the roof!!!

curlyboy

Sadsack -thats an entirely sensible idea ! Don’t expect to see it happen!

re;

has there been any official statment what the actual plans are for her? It would be logical she go in the Battle of Britain exhibition, with Duxford being a BoB station. Any number of other spitfires or a replica could go on display at Lambeth.

I am one of the LEAVE IT ALONE brigade, and proud of it !

Can I tut tut tut too?

Hmm – I remember…

I went to Lambeth for the first time when I was a young teenager. I am now 64. The museum was still quite quiet, and there was a large area upstairs with models of first world war battles. I think they later changed all that to add the holocaust section. It was pleasantly tranquil with no kids anywhere.

In my opinion all that popularising of history has simply cheapened things. So much is ignored or left out so that screaching little *******s can run around making a nasty noise.

Also upstairs was a large scale model of a spitfire. Extremely detailed and beatifully done. (I believe it is currently in the Hendon entrance foyer, mostly being ignored…) I seem to remember that there was also an engine or two (Merlin?)displayed in that area. And I remember sunshine through the windows to the right.

On the ground floor, down a couple of steps, the Spit was sat on its wheels. I remember leaning over and touching the tailplane, there was only a rope barrier, and I seem to remember that the elevator was the early fabric covered variety. I specifically remember thinking that I was touching a real genine Battle of Britain spit.

I think there was a Volksjager jet displayed hanging on the wall and the V2 was lying along the floor.

Around that time my parents had bought a detached 4 bed house with a good bit of garden, 25 miles out of town, in Surrey. It cost around £1500.
I remember there being ‘new’ mothballed spitfires (3?) offered for sale in the Times, when the Times was still a proper newspaper, with small ads on the front page. And I remember the momentous freeze which started on Boxing day and went on for 3 months.

P.

Mark12
Ah! I re…member

R6915 – IWM Lambeth
I would estimate that R6915 was suspended in the first instance, in the hall adjacent to where it is currently, at some time around 1960, give or take a couple of years.

At that time the ‘value’ and price of a flying Spitfire was ITRO £4k based on the adverts to sell the COGEA Mk IXs, including MH434, for £4-6k in c1964.

Therefore at the time the original suspension holes were cut I would estimate that the value of a non flying Mk I at about £2-3k.

At that time £3k would buy a modest detached bungalow in North Bucks!

Mark

It still looks good

The holes do look horrible but keep it. get it down, tidy it up. dont repaint it. if that original paint keep it. i always liked it because its a nice generic wwII spitfire scheme

Jay

To quote Baldrick from Blackadder II, “which do you want me to do first”?!

It still looks good

The holes do look horrible but keep it. get it down, tidy it up. dont repaint it. if that original paint keep it. i always liked it because its a nice generic wwII spitfire scheme

Jay

Thanks for the input Bruce, Mark – I was intreagued by the spar repair.

As regards the crunching on the underside, it is a good example of the changes in (general) museum policy; now, lowering it onto it’s rads would be regarded as bl@@dy stupid (not that such things don’t happen) then (whenever then was) it would have been OK, as a Spitfire was by no means an almost priceless artifact.

STOLEN From S London. One set of undercarriage legs, Spitfire Mk.Ia. Date stolen not known. Cat burgler suspected due to location of objects.

Hi folks, sorry for the thread resurrection but just a quick post to confirm that the undercarriage legs are safely in store at Duxford. I know, I saw them today. [edit] oh, and I realise you weren’t claiming they were really stolen! Just letting folks know they weren’t disposed of in any way.

Deleted…..double post 😡

7th Oct. Better weather brought another battle over the South Coast. Sqn Ldr Robinson L1096 on his first patrol with the squadron Destroyed 2 ME110’s, having some assistance with one from a Hurricane pilot. Flt Lt Howell X4472 ME110 Destroyed, Plt Off Bisdee X4560 ME110 Destroyed, Sgt Hughes – Rees X4173 ME109 Damaged, Fg Off Dundas R6915 ME109 Destroyed, Fg Off Forshaw X4471 ME110 Probably Destroyed, Sgt Feary N3238 was shot down and killed. According to reports, his aircraft was in a spin, which he couldn’t correct and he baled out too late for his parachute to open. Flt Lt Howell X4472 was returning when his engine seized up, so he parked his aircraft down in a field, wheels retracted. Aircraft not badly damaged, pilot unhurt. Plt Off Staples N3231 was shot in the knee and then found his cockpit on fire. He baled out from 21,000 feet and landed safely. Fg Off Dundas R6915 was hit by an explosive shell and received numerous small pieces in his leg. Landed safely at Warmwell and walked casually to Sick Quarters.

So, a very historic airframe really in more ways than one, as, for it’s last Battle of Britain sortie it was flown by one of the RAF’s leading ace’s of the Battle, during which he scored one of his victories. Flt.Lt Dundas’s last victory of course was the Luftwaffe’s then leading Battle of Britain Experten Maj.Helmut Wick off the Isle of Wight on Nov 28 1940, only for he himself to be shot down and killed moments later by Wick’s, wingman.

It’s a pity, the IWM don’t display accordingly such items to enable the public to appreciate more of the significant history of what they are looking at……… 🙁

Actually, there’s a part of me that would like to see R6915 sympathetically displayed in the BofB hall at Hendon, in a suitably weathered in-service finish in her markings of Oct 7th 1940 on that John Dundas scored one of his victories.

A question for the restoration experts on the forum, sacrilege to some I know, but what would the chances be of removing the outer layers of that late war OTU paint to reveal her BofB Dk.green/Earth paint underneath?
I’m guessing pretty slim..??

The Fw190 was restored and repainted by ARCo (NOT TFC) in the late eighties, early 90s. I have no idea how authentic the colours are, but they don’t look right to mee (though I am certainly no expert!)

It was the upper part of a ‘Mistel’ combination – which may be an explanation as to why te gun troughs on the cowling are inverted to how they normally would be and, I suspect should be, as I can see no reason for reversing them. (See the IWM D-Day +60 thread for a pic.)

Incidentally, the number of earthquakes in Europe is quite low, Dave 😀 but suspension of standing, it’s the building falling on the artifact that does the damage. Suspension is actually quite a good way of dispersing the shocks of earthquakes in building design, incidentally!

Cheers

Dave..

I think that the FW190 is not in its original WWII paintwork.From memory in the early 1990’s it was restored by the Fighter Collection thus loosing its paintwork. I am not sure if its a reproduction of its WWII colours.

I hate to see aircraft hung up. I am prepared to make exceptions for the IWM at Lambeth and the Science Museum as they have no room. That doesn’t excuse the IWM cutting holes in exhibits or the Science Museum bolting half the Shorts SC1 to a wall.

Hanging Aircraft

The method used to hang that lovely Spitfire certainly looks frighteningly ‘gash’ (as we called rough jobs in the RNZAF), but at least it is securely hung. A very valuable aircraft hung at Motat in Auckland fell down and smashed!!! I think from memory it was a Monospar – it was the only one in NZ (perhaps the world, can’t recall now) and had quite a history too I believe.

I wish aircraft wouldn’t be hung up. It scares me, and they’re difficult to see (although the IWM Lambeth ones are in a good position with the mezanine balcony levels for viewing.

Those pictures on a recent thread of German air museums had many aircraft hung above each other, all crammed in. I think this is a terrible way to display them, and dangerous if there were an earth tremor or something similar. I guess it is a lack of money for building space that forces such space saving, but it is such a pity.

By the way, is the Fw190 beside the IWM Spit still in original paintwork too?

I can’t join you in the evenings i’m afraid, as i’ll be with the veterans all weekend, from Friday onwards. The Red Lion is THE place to be at 9am on Sunday morning though, without a doubt. A nice reminder of what its all about with a short memorial service to a Belgian RAF pilot of 609 who was killed in a take-off accident at Duxford back in 1942. You are invited to attend if you wish – everyone is invited to attend. Come early and you may have time to get breakfast…..

Oh, and Friday is arrivals day – definitely a day worth being there.