Sri Lanka's Killing Fields, Ch4 last night.

Multirole.

Are you condoning the rape and murder of women? Even in Sri Lanka the law is such that women are protected. Sri Lanka signed the Geneva Convention on the 12th of August 1949 and ratified the Convention on the 28th of February 1959. I’m sure that you are aware of this Convention and in particular, the section relating to women (clause 27 I believe) which states the following…..

Protected persons are entitled, in all circumstances, to respect for their persons, their honour, their family rights, their religious convictions and practices, and their manners and customs. They shall, at all times, be humanely treated, and shall be protected, especially against all acts of violence or threats thereof and against insults and public curiosity. Women shall be especially protected against any attack on their honour, in particular against rape, enforced prostitution, or any form of indecent assault. Without prejudice to the provisions relating to their state of health, age and sex, all protected persons shall be treated with the same consideration by the Party to the conflict in whose power they are, without any adverse distinction based, in particular, on race, religion or political opinion. However, the Parties to the conflict may take such measures of control and security in regard to protected persons as may be necessary as a result of the war.

Now, I don’t really see how the contol and security of protected persons equates to the rape and murder of women.

As regards the insurgency, you might say that the Sri Lankan Government were fighting an insurgency, the Tamils might offer the presumption that they were fighting a civil war against all the elements of persecution mentioned above. The Sri Lankan Government knew that their actions were breaking the very convention they ratified in 1959.

All Governments and their armed forces commit atrocities. I suspect there are elemental forces which I have been fortunate never to have to explore which make some atrocities inevitable, but surely it is a matter of scale and intent? Is it a spur of the moment, small unit action which might be said of My Lai or Bloody Sunday? Or is it something which is far more controlled and purposeful? Part of the overall plan.

And has COIN got such a successful record? It didn’t work in Vietnam, it didn’t work in Iraq and it’s certainly not working in Afghanistan. You might go as far as to say it isn’t working in Libya or Syria either.

Regards,

kev35

Normal people don’t win counterinsurgencies. COIN is typically won by the most ruthless genocidal maniacs. Genghis Khan never had much trouble with insurgents. Dont think there were insurgents, as we understand the term, in existance back then !What you consider war crimes is the way COIN has been won for thousands of years.So rape, murder of innocent civilians, deliberate & targeted shelling of a hospital, murder of those who have surrendered ISNT a war crime in your book? Amatures are those who don’t understand this. Do you mean Amatuers ?

This kind of war is not going to be won by what you consider civilized means, and is best avoided altogether if you disapprove of it. No war is civilised but there are rules which most “normal” people,military and civilian, regard as being non-negotiable, especially when they are applied to non-combatants.

The Brits always had a soft spot for the Tamils. Maybe it’s a colonial thing. But this is the way it must end. Either the Tamil Tigers get their way through terrorism, or the government gets it’s way through war crimes. 1. I am not British, 2. It might be more a question that people in general expect a government NOT to act like some sort of blood crazed madmen rather than any Colonial sympathy.3 Your statement that this was the only way to win that particular war is to be frank nonsensical.

I presume that if this crime had been perpetrated against members of Western Armed forces or for that matter Western civilians it would be equally acceptable ? Were the crimes of Japanese forces against the resistance in the Philippines okay? or against American POW’s on the Bataan Death march? What about the actions of the SS against civilians in Oradour-Sur-Glane ?

Your arguments excusing the actions of the government of a “civilised” country are better left to history…a history that no one in the right mind would should be held up as something to be repeated.

Normal people don’t win counterinsurgencies. COIN is typically won by the most ruthless genocidal maniacs. Genghis Khan never had much trouble with insurgents. What you consider war crimes is the way COIN has been won for thousands of years. Amatures are those who don’t understand this.

This kind of war is not going to be won by what you consider civilized means, and is best avoided altogether if you disapprove of it.

The Brits always had a soft spot for the Tamils. Maybe it’s a colonial thing. But this is the way it must end. Either the Tamil Tigers get their way through terrorism, or the government gets it’s way through war crimes.

How did you imagine counterinsurgencies are won?

The Sri Lankans, unlike the West, still knows how to win COIN. Rather than condemning them for bringing peace to their country, the West should learn from their COIN methods. They are the real pros, the war in Afghanistan is amature hour.

Real pros ? are you serious ? Did you even bother to watch the documentary?

Or maybe you think that rape, mutilation and torture are acceptable means of winning a war? Is the deliberate shelling of a hospital ok ? Might be in your book but most normal people would find it unacceptable.

and what is “amature ” ?

I watched a similar programme on NHK the other night, covering the aftermath of the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia. Surprisingly, some of the younger people of today had heard of, but knew nothing, of Pol Pot. How time heals

Anyone watching this programme last night has to be have been sickened. Yes the Tamill Tigers were brutal and inhuman but the actions of the Sri Lankan government put them is a similar league to any of the most brutal regimes.

And as usual the rest of the world sits back and does nothing…

I deliberately havent put a link up for the programme as it far too graphic for youngers forum members to see.

How did you imagine counterinsurgencies are won?

The Sri Lankans, unlike the West, still knows how to win COIN. Rather than condemning them for bringing peace to their country, the West should learn from their COIN methods. They are the real pros, the war in Afghanistan is amature hour.

[QUOTE=KabirT;1759793]I saw it…while it was downright horrific I think it is very important that documentaries like these are made.

Well. KabirT, I remember when we had a spat some time ago and didn’t agree,;) however this time I am 100% behind you, inasmuch as graphicly detailed as it was, it brought home as to what other and how other Countries
treat the poulation. If films like this were not shown, then the rest of the world would think everything was hunky dorey, when in fact it damned well isn’t, and something needs doing, FAST.
Jim.

Lincoln .7

I don’t think it has become it – it has always been an ineffective and ineffectual organisation costing billions to run and showing little in return.

I saw it…while it was downright horrific I think it is very important that documentaries like these are made.

For the most, it just reinstates my belief that the UN has just become a disaster management organisation. And barely at that.

Indeed. I didn’t see it but heard enough about it not to want to inflict yet more visual abuse on myself. And the world does nothing, as in so many other cases. Action is only ever taken if the target is soft, and so it has been for decades.

It is all about political expedinecy as has been debated in other threads here.