Strathallen Lancaster

Probably something to do with a certain long-delayed film containing ethnic non-cats.

It would be nice to see KB976 out of the containers though

Update

Things are happening with KB976’s nose and, all being well, some pictures should be available soon.

James,
I think Lindys Lad might be having withdrawl symptoms seeing as he has just finished working on a ,soon to be airworthy, Lancaster……..

As he said to me a while ago, beats working on 737’s! 😀

Cheers, Alan

You are quite right. I do miss the old girl, but sadly I’m off to belgium tomorrow to play with an A300……

I do like creating controversy. Thanks again to everyone who has posted!

Neil. Septic and Spit.

Many thanks for the info.

Beginning search now.

Dak

Kermits Lancaster “kit” is largely based on KB976 despite the Hangar collapse, based on the parts of KB976 and KB994 elsewhere it would seem the containers hold:

KB976
Wing outer panels, Wing Centre-section, Cockpit, tailplanes, fins & rudders and I assume Engines and props.
KB994
rear (mid upper turret) fuselage section
Tail (rear turret) fuselage section

Based on the number of containers required to shift the Lincoln from Sadtoft the 5 high-cube (9′) containers and 3 standard containers shown in the photos could easily be accomodating all of those parts, although the Lincoln Centre Section was too large even for a enclosed high cube container and required an open top, the centre-section of KB976 was understood to be in pieces for repair when acquired by Kermit?

At least Kermit did acquire the major KB976 kitset and has it safely under lock and key, and more importantly under cover, so it did not trapse around the UK in a derelict state, or got split up into smaller seperately owned piles of parts as happened to the remaining parts from Charles Church’s Lancaster/Lincoln holdings.

The remainder of KB976 that Kermit didnt acquire was passed on from Charles Church to Aces High with the “Tail” fuselage ending up on display at Aeroventure in the UK, and the and rear (mid upper turret) fuselage section passed onto Imperial Aviation at Sandtoft along with the stripped cockpit and centre-section (covered wagon section of fuselage but with spars and wing ‘stubs” removed in Canada) from KB994, the Sandtoft parts have been subsequently acquired and shipped down under as part of the Lincoln RF342 acquisition.

Therefore most of Kermits Lancaster is KB976 less 2 sections of fuselage which are KB994, and probably best described just as “KB976”

Most of the Lancaster parts we have acquired and shipped downunder with the Lincoln are from KB994 other than KB976’s rear (mid upper turret) fuselage section, these fuselage sections are expected to be restored to a fuselage display and nothing beyond that- probably best described as being “KB994”, although by length or weight its more truelly a hybrid fuselage of both IDs.

The future of Kermits Lancaster project may be uncertain but at least its stored all together and under cover, for him to eventually, or someone else to undertake.

I would agree with others that there is no urgency for Kermit to commence restoration, and certainly no logic in repatriating it back to Canada where there is already 10 Lancs in varying need of increased support and care, I personally think a Lancaster on display within the US is an excellent preservation and display outcome for future generations.

There is also as JDK stated little prospect of the Australian/NZ Lancs being “resurrected” one is a rare mark 1 combat veteran and National Icon, the other 2 are mark VII aircraft but both are undercover and well loved by their respective collections.

I think our generation is a little too demanding to expect ALL aircraft projects to be under restoration, (and under restoration to fly) to suit our own time lines, its more important that all of these airframes are conserved or preserved from further deterioration, and then made available for many generations besides us, and not neccessarily all in the air?

Restoration to ground running is an exellent “half way house” of bringing history to life again without the financial costs, operational complexities, risks and compromises that airworthy restoration can dictate?

If that means Kermits aircraft doesnt hit the workshop until 2030 does that really matter? as long as its stored appropriately in the mean time?

I also think that we dont really know and appreciate how good we have it, two Lancasters airworthy, another 2 ground running with perhaps 1 more airworthy/ground runner in the offering? currently we have 10% of the survivors flying, not a bad result, and given only @20 complete airframes survive they are a rare and endangered species to be operating in terms of operational spares and risks of loss, ignoring the complexities and costs.

I personally think our generation, and perhaps the next, will see “peak-warbirds”, as equivalent to peak-oil, at least for WW2 vintage aircraft.

The number of unrestored/available wrecks or derelict/abandoned airframes are dwindling rapidly in the last 20 years, after a major increase in activity in the 20 years before that after the “battle of Britain” and Tora Tora Tora springboarded the warbird movement.

National and public collections are occasionally acquiring airworthy aircraft to complete their collections, while the operational parts for certain engines, tyres, undercarriage legs etc are all drying up, other than for high demand types such as Spitfires, Mustangs, P40s, T6 and T28 where new-built parts are flourishing through the demand, or the inventory of NOS stocks will last for many years? Thats also not to take into account the attrition and losses airworthy aircraft have suffered and unfortunately will continue to suffer either through pure “accident”, pilot error or equipment failure.

More unique/orphan aircraft will be harder to support ongoing, will suffer metal fatigue life issues with spars etc that require expensive and uneconomic maintenance/repair and overhaul.

(In Australia an AD to put inspection panels along the wings of Tiger Moths and regularly inspect the wooden spars has dinted the Tigermoth market price considerably)

We are already seeing younger generations pilots wanting to fly aircraft of their own vintage, hence the T28s, DragonFly’s etc dispersing the market, and the lower level warbird market of Nangchangs etc, all of which may make 4 and 2 engined bombers and even single engined piston fighters expensive and difficult for anyone other than large operators such as CAF to undertake.

The other issue for warbirds in the next 30 – 50 years will not only be spares for the WW2 piston engines, but also the high octane fuels, “global warming” reactions threatens a massive shift away from fossil fuels in the longer term, few of our Warbird engines are certified for automotive fuels, none are likely to be certified for ethanol? or combined cycle gas or hydrogen that future automotive developments may deliver?

I therefore think the current situation of two flying lancasters is something we should be cherishing.

regards

Mark Pilkington

Hmm “no time for 4 engined bombers”. Or really much else with four engines. The B-24 has sat for years, it’s complete and was flying. He has enough to put a B-29 together and a B-17, but hasn’t. His A-26 was being put back together but it never flew, nor has the Tigercat. Kermit’s a great collector, but not really flying much. He’s more of a David Tallichet, buy it, then store it for 40 years without touching it, while flying only a few of a collection that goes into the 100s. On that note, I’m actually glad the Marauder is grounded, that’s what I hoped for. After the loss of the CAF airplane, it’s too rare to fly ever. The only way the Lanc would ever fly, is for someone to make Kermit an offer he can’t refuse, then pour ten million dollars (or more) into a restoration. Who’s going to do that? I’m a huge fan of Kermit’s and I’ve dealt with him in the past and he’s always been very kind, so don’t take my words the wrong way.

John

Does anyone have a complete list of Mr. Weeks collection? I have never been able to trace one, perhaps even he doesn’t know exactly what he has in store?
Be lucky
David

Hmm “no time for 4 engined bombers”. Or really much else with four engines. The B-24 has sat for years, it’s complete and was flying. He has enough to put a B-29 together and a B-17, but hasn’t. His A-26 was being put back together but it never flew, nor has the Tigercat. Kermit’s a great collector, but not really flying much. He’s more of a David Tallichet, buy it, then store it for 40 years without touching it, while flying only a few of a collection that goes into the 100s. On that note, I’m actually glad the Marauder is grounded, that’s what I hoped for. After the loss of the CAF airplane, it’s too rare to fly ever. The only way the Lanc would ever fly, is for someone to make Kermit an offer he can’t refuse, then pour ten million dollars (or more) into a restoration. Who’s going to do that? I’m a huge fan of Kermit’s and I’ve dealt with him in the past and he’s always been very kind, so don’t take my words the wrong way.

John

While it would be nice to see KB976/994 restored–or even slated for such treatment–nothing untoward would be happening to her while containerised; were she reassembled in the open, especially with the wacky weather that is apparently becoming the norm everywhere now, she’d surely fare worse. In the meantime, I don’t doubt that if someone with the wherewithal to restore the Lanc approached Mr Weeks with a decent offer she might change hands. (Given the calibre of Mr W’s completed rebuilds…she’d be worth the wait if she stayed put.)

Point taken about a “runner”/taxiable Lanc versus a flyer. At least a couple of the Canadian ones could become taxiable in due course. Three Mk.10s are still “in the cold”, but that may change. Happily in recent years all three pylon Lancs came down (with assistance…none of them fell!) and two of the three are now indoors.

S.

Thanks to those who’ve saved me the trouble of walking to the bookshelf to check those titles! 😀

Peter – surely Canada’s got enough Lancasters to look after already? I really can’t see any rationale for asking to take a crated Lanc out to put on external show in this day and age, in a country with half-a-dozen of the type, including several still outside. Far better to do what you are already doing, knowing there’s another ‘Lady in waiting’ safe for the future.

I can’t see any way that it’s currently economical or technically possible to restore another Lancaster to airworthy condition. The debate about ‘Just Jane’ – the arguably most likely candidate come around again and again, and simply shows (IMHO) the gulf most enthusiasts have in understanding the cost, engineering and paperwork differentiation between a taxiing aircraft and an airworthy one.

In forty years, who knows?

Hi Dakkg651
If you need any further details about the book “THE LAST LANC” by Patric Kilvington they are as follows :- isbn 0 908175 32 9 and it was published by an Aussie Company called BOOLARONG PUBLICATIONS of 8 Henry Street, Ascot, Queensland but I think it is OUT OF PRINT NOW but try the Printers who are Poly-Graphics Pty, Ltd in Brisbane, Aus. Hope this is of some help as it is well worth reading and the last few pages give the Fate and Dispo of every known Lanc (then).;) 😉

The other book that JDK refers to is called ‘The Last Lanc’ by Patrick Kilvington, this follows the epic flight that NX611 made from Australia to the UK for preservation with the Historic Aircraft Preservation Society.

Septic.

James,
I think Lindys Lad might be having withdrawl symptoms seeing as he has just finished working on a ,soon to be airworthy, Lancaster……..

As he said to me a while ago, beats working on 737’s! 😀

Cheers, Alan

Canadian book

The Canadian book is called- Mynarski’s Lanc. Written by Bette Page, Publisher- Boston Mills Press. ISBN- 1-55046-006-4
An excellent read..
Neil Medcalf

mr weeks

I think he should let it go in exchange for something he needs. I know a group in canada would snap it up but sadly it would be on outdoor display.

As is said here, no worries. 😉

Get the book on the CWH Lancaster’s restoration, and the book on the return of NX611 to the UK,

JDK

What books?

Please give me titles and where I can get hold of copies. Sounds like two books that must be read.

Dak

JDK,

Unfortunately Mr Weeks plans aren’t even that good! I asked him about the Lanc 4 weeks ago when I was there. I can’t remember the EXACT quote, but it went something along the lines of ‘I haven’t got time to me messing about with large 4 engined British bombers’ –Thank you Mr Weeks… Then you just leave it there in those containers – I couldn’t think of a better home!!!!

My apologies to our southern hemisphere cousins… by “resurecting” the southern Lancs, I meant return to flight…. I certainly didn’t mean to put any noses out of joint. I am an aircraft engineer, and an avid enthusiast of airbourne aircraft, and possibly obsessed with seeing more than two Lancs in the air (together?!)

Thanks for all the posts so far…. lets hope that someone can confirm Mr. Week’s plans…

And another thing to spark debate… if he did get the beasty airworthy, RAF camoflage, or Canadian transport colours?….choices choices…

As is said here, no worries. 😉

Get the book on the CWH Lancaster’s restoration, and the book on the return of NX611 to the UK, then the scope of ‘wouldn’t it be nice’ type dreaming might gain a bit more reality. Don’t think it’s going to happen. Of course, if you believe the PR put out by Peter Jackson’s film-puff dept, there’s going to be a bunch of full size plastic Lancs, that bounce…

Mr Weeks’ plans are probably along the lines of ’35th in the queue, commencing in 2155 on current rate of progress’; and the paint scheme’s the least of his worries.

Why not just be grateful for what we have got? And toddle off to get a flight in the CWH machine – it’s in a good cause.

Cheers

My apologies to our southern hemisphere cousins… by “resurecting” the southern Lancs, I meant return to flight…. I certainly didn’t mean to put any noses out of joint. I am an aircraft engineer, and an avid enthusiast of airbourne aircraft, and possibly obsessed with seeing more than two Lancs in the air (together?!)

Thanks for all the posts so far…. lets hope that someone can confirm Mr. Week’s plans…

And another thing to spark debate… if he did get the beasty airworthy, RAF camoflage, or Canadian transport colours?….choices choices…

When I was a sprog JT at Cottesmore in 1962 (or perhaps it was in 1963), one day there was much excitement and a Canadian Air Force Lancaster landed. Would that have been 889 as mentioned by Peter, or a different one?

And finally, are there any more plans at resurecting possibly one of the australian/new zealand lancs?

Hi ‘Lindy’
I wasn’t aware they needed ‘resurrection’. All the Australian and New Zealand Lancasters (note caps – it’s a courtesy) are in good hands and are either restored, conserved or in the process of further restoration conservation. While it’s technically possible one or two could be restored to fly, or change hands, it’s not going to happen.

The work done by private individuals and organisations has been magnificent, and should be recognised as such.

Thanks to the French, there are three ex-Pacific Lancasters in preservation in the UK, New Zealand and Australia; all ex-Aeronavalle aircraft, all three having running engines at various times. The last (derelict) Lancaster south of the equator is now back in France under restoration.

Cheers