TFC Fiat CR42 and Ki43

I wish I could say more but doing so would certainly put an end to any more information coming my way and will get others in trouble. Nothing is I have heard is offical or finalised, but I wouldnt be surprised to see the Mossie back at Duxford in bigger bits than it left.

Carry on please,i am interested in what you have to say.

There was comment that the Mossie was going to the US and certain people were upset about it. Just wondered if they were told it was being sold to go to the US or if they just heard it was going over there i.e not being sold. I hear rumour it is leaving Duxford today, but I wouldnt count on it not coming back.

RE: last paragraph whats all that about? please explain.

I really think we should all just feel very priviliged to live in a time when there are so many people who are buying and selling aircraft for us to see. Many do not do it as a business, we all know the way to make a small fortune in aviation is to start with a large one.

Planes are sold and planes are bought, and for the time they are around we should enjoy what is in front of us. We are blessed with a preservation scene that rivals in numbers some countries airforces. So when you are at your next airshow enjoy watching what is there rather than, as some do, moaning about the same old stuff.

As far as the Mossie goes were you told it was being sold or just being sent to the US? THere is a big difference and you might be very happy with what happens?

Thats an excellent photo never seen that before,a lot has been said about DOUG ARNOLD but he did so much in collecting warbirds complete or derelict throughout the world.

And to think SM832 is now flying and in TFCs hanger for all to see.

Doug Arnold – Spitfire Mk XIV SM832 – Dehra Dun, India –
29 Feb 1976

Mark 12,

Besides having an absolutely marvellous name you are absolutely correct.

Haydon-Baillie did indeed rescue a good number of Spits from India in 1977 including MT719, but Mr Arnold (in my opinion the founder of the warbird preservation movement as we know it today) was already doing it (rescuing Spits from the sub-continent) rather quietly and rather successfully.

Wensley took over after Ormond was killed as they were sold on as part of his estate. I was told that Doug bought his ones from Wensley.

I doubt if anyone of you know the slightst thing about WOGB and the Arnold family, but I suppose that someone will fill me in on the details, I mean it would be nice to know:) 🙂 🙂 🙂

Nope.
The first Spitfires from India were Doug Arnold’s in 1976.
MV262, MV293, NH799, SM832 & SM969.
The next batch were the Wensley Haydon-Baillie aircraft MT719, MV370, NH749, SM845, TP263, TP276, TP280 & TP298.

I think you’ll find that Ormond Haydon-Baillie originally found those airframes. I know he definately found the Spitfires in India and was arranging for them to be brought to the U.K when he was unfortunately killed. If he had lived god knows what we would have had over here. If it wasn’t for him we wouldn’t have had the Blenheim. He also had a number of F-86’s ready to come over here too.

Originally posted by Willow

The only good that came of this was the Lanc which is now with the IWM at Duxford, which came from WoGB.

Willow

I think you are being a little unfair here, Doug Arnold was one of the pioneers of the current preservation scene and did an awful lot of work to secure a lot of aircraft from uncertain fates so as they can be preserved for the future with different operators.

Willow

What rumours would you like to start about the P-61 Black Widow. Unless you’vr got one hidden in the back of your shed I think you should be looking behind the bamboo curtain??

DOUGHNUT

I cannot comment on the KI 43 but the P 61 story has gone a bit cold now,a 61 was found in china but was all to difficult to deal with the locals,apparently in good condition but thats all i know.

The source was somewhat a suprise (not duxford based).

I think you’ll find that one of the main reasons TFC was originally based at Duxford is because of the free hangarage.

Because of this, poor old Sally B has to live outdoors during the Summer (and Autumn, and Spring as well).

Can you imagine the uproar (from Lancman alone) if the BBMF had to keep their Lancaster outside for most of the year?

It’s exactly because TFC is based at Duxford that it is frowned upon for what it does sometimes. Flying A Services at North Weald are, I believe, the Legacy of Doug Arnolds Warbirds of Great Britain collection. His organisation existed purely for trade, and probably exported more warbirds from this country than everybody else put together including an AIRWORTHY Mosquito.
The only good that came of this was the Lanc which is now with the IWM at Duxford, which came from WoGB.

At least we get to see TFCs aeroplanes regularly.

So maybe they’re not that bad.

So I’ll stop complaining now.

And I’ll even shut up about the Mosquito (especially because, as has been stated, it hasn’t been confirmed by TFC yet).

But I’d still like to know if the Ki43 still exists,
and what the rumours are about a P61!!

Willow

Oh the link is to a site which has info and pics on most restorations. Is the TFC hurricane,the mark iv going to tbe the only flying mark iv in the world?

Graeme

yeah apparently the TFC have a p-36 ,p-40B and i read a while ago they have a p-40E in storage also. This makes you wonder what else they have in storage? anyone got an ideas?

http://www.avions-de-legende.com/tablprof/Tabrest.htm

Mike J

Sorry, hadn’t read your response when I posted mine.

I’m not actually saying that I wished TFC didn’t exist, that would be incredibly short sighted. I agree that without it, we wouldn’t have the mix of warbirds in the UK that we have today. We also wouldn’t have Legends.

I am very grateful.

I just don’t like historic aircraft being a business instead of Heritage.

Sorry!

Willow

OK Willow,

Thats the negative side what about the positive? I can think of a few big positive points, there must be more:

Sea Fury
Beafighter
Gladiator
Ki 43
Cr42
Hurricane IV
Nimrod
P51C
78th FG Vet P51D

Plus the opportunity to experience the collection as it has evolved over the years, as well as a show such as Legends and the co operation with the Friedkin Family.

I’m sure in percentage terms OFMC have sold off more aircraft ver the years:

P51D
Sea Fury x2
P40 (ok it was leased)
Spit XI (operated by them)
Statc Spit XIV
Dewotine (operated)
YAK 11 (N11SN)
Harvard IIB
Stearmen (x2)
F4U4 Corsair
Zeke
WW 1 Replicas
etc

I am all in favour of the trade of airframes as it leads to variety throughout the UK. I own a couple of classic cars, but I’m sure I won’t own them forever, one day something else may come up such as the need to have some cash, or a more interesting vehicle, or something with better history, or maybe I may be made a silly offer that I can’t refuse. I just hope that I don’t get constant grief for selling off my own property.

Now if someone like BBMF were to sell something which arguably was owned by the nation perhaps I would not be impressed. Oh wait a minuite, they did……………..