Things that really tick me off with the forum

RE: My say

“Glad we sorted this out – I’d much rather have you for a fellow member than an opponent.”

We don’t become opponents over one issue… 🙂

I don’t even consider posters like Vortex or PhantomII opponents even though we do disagree on quite a few issues. There are also many issues we agree upon… ie The Death Penalty, plus I do like the Phantom… it was an excelent aircraft in its time, and with upgrades is not a bad aircraft now. (With AWACS support and AMRAAM I would suggest that its higher top speed would make it a better interceptor than the slower F-18… any model F-18… the only area that lets down the F-4 is its age and increasing maintainence costs.)
I am not of course suggesting that the US should reintroduce it into service }> but giving credit where credit is due.

RE: My say

Garry

Thanks for the reply. I appreciate the points you made and accept your perspective on each point.

I don’t think we differ much in our views. I prefer to become involved in discussions on issues which really matter, then keep on track, to ensure that the views we all express are directly relevant to the original thread. I must confess that I was miffed by the J-35 thread as I felt there was still more to go on that issue, but it digressed, quite quickly, to a discussion about tanks, gas turbines, heat melting sand etc. I couldn’t see the connection and felt that the original thread had been “killed off” as a result. I guess time could show that I was quite wrong, and that the thread had in fact, petered out. I know it’s still on the forum, but you would know how few threads revive after a break of a few days.

I won’t respond to each of your points, as I accept your right to your views and don’t disagree with most things you have said, except for one thing. “Harden up” DEFINITELY isn’t used over here in the same context as NZ – it also has sexual connotations, but that’t about the only thing you said which I refuse to do (because of the local interpretation!!!)

Glad we sorted this out – I’d much rather have you for a fellow member than an opponent.

Regards

Wombat

RE: My say

“However, you felt the need to repeat yourself on another post, so I assume you are serious.”

The only reason I repeated it here was because although it was relevant in the other thread it was also relevant here… you started this post and gave your opinion… my reply in another post might not have been read by you so I copied and pasted it here too, to make sure you saw it… besides as you meantioned in this thread I was the root of your discontent… (ie I deviated from the path… in the F-35 post)

I will repeat again (ie read other thread…) that I did not intend to offend you I was just voicing my opinion… the suggestions to harden up and get a life were not meant literally.
If my words upset or offended you then I am sorry.

I was serious in the sense that I personally think that if a thread goes onto a different subject that creating a new thread is not always a good thing. I personally don’t mind when posts go off topic… if the particular deviation is of interest I read it, if it isn’t I skip it… no big deal.
I prefer deviations from the topic to 10 new threads every five minutes with 1, 2 or even no replies. It makes topics disappear into the archive too quickly. Not that I think everything on one thread is good… I have a 56K modem that doesn’t like large threads.

“but strong enough in itself to justify its own thread”

That is the problem… how do you define whether it is strong enough to make a new thread?
Another problem is who decides?
Webmaster?
The person who started that thread?
The people participating in the discussion that has deviated?

I doubt the webmaster has the time… ( I don’t know but I suspect that like in most companies the webmaster was the company IT guy and the bosses said some time ago “What is this interweb thing?” and after having been told and having read in a coffee table magazine that the future is on the web they’d tell him to put something together… so he becomes webmaster as well as everything else he used to do… and probably for no extra money… so I doubt he has the time or inclination to sit and read what we have to say all day except for the occasional post about a new feature or request for feedback.)

Then there is the question of the person who started the thread… does that give them ownership?
Ownership… censorship… control.
Now if the new area of discussion is interfering or getting in the way of the other discussion or if it was stifiling the other discussion then someone… whether they are the original poster or not may ask for a new thread to be created, but to suggest that such rules should be enforced any more than they are now is a little impractical and in my opinion unwelcome.
Next someone will say that we are going to have a thread about how evil Iran or North Korea or Iraq is… but anyone who wants to point out that everyone else in the world including the US has done many of the same things will have to start their own thread… where do you draw the line?
I would prefer no line to a line drawn by someone else.
I’ll manage where I step myself… or am I not an adult… but a child? (Don’t answer that it was rhetorical… 🙂 )

“so I assume that was justification enough for you to take it your way, without consideration for anybody else who might have wanted to follow the original thread.”

I didn’t “take” it “my” way. If noone had replied to what I said it would have stopped there. It was a conversation that requires more than one participant.
I also did not abuse to put down anyone who posted on the original topic, not did I hack into this system and erase any posts.
The posts stopped naturally on their own without any influence from me one way or the other.

“You have missed the point I made in my second post, too. I said that I felt there was more value in maintaining a “global” perspective to the forum, by avoiding a preponderance of local interest issues. “

Surely it is the little differences that makes it a global forum.
If Ivan cannot give us a Serbian perspective, Harry cannot give us an Indian perspective, Scooter and Vort cannot give us an American perspective, Skythe cannot give us an Israeli perspective, you and glenn and Ja can give us different angles of an Aussie perspective, then what sort of global picture do we have?
A boring international flat view of a PC world.
What makes us different is what makes us interesting.

“…so I’m certainly not going to bore people with threads about Australian customs and laws”

I doubt anyone comes here specifically for that and many may be bored by such information. Of course if they are not interested in people or learning about the different ways people think why would they come here?
Why not just go to the library and read books?
Especially in the discussion forum opinions are important and customs and local laws are part of what make up your opinions… Weed might be illegal in your country… how does that effect your opinions?
Are you happy with the law or not?
The law effects how you feel… either it should be changed or it is OK as it is but either way you must feel somethign about it.
One of the advantages of this international forum is that you can discuss this with someone who might live in a country with different laws…

“I did try one post, with some success,”

Don’t judge sucess by the number of replies you get… you’ll end up with the wrong answer to the wrong question.

“I wanted the world perspective on the issue, not Australia’s. I can get that any day of the week. “

Indeed you can, but from my perspective all I see is what our media and your media tells me (we get Sky Australia here). Your contribution to the thread, as well as from your fellow Aussies offered not the views of the Australian Government, nor the Australian or international media, but of a slice of the local population… something we wouldn’t otherwise get.
Equally Snowmans views and opinions have changed mine regarding the Rainbow Warrior affair a while back when we broached that matter.
(I don’t dislike our former French alies as I once did… of course I do not like what their government and their military did here.)

“(I have to be honest and say that I’m not even sure what that means. Out here we say either “get a life” or “lighten up”.)”

To tell someone to harden up is to tell them not to be so fragile… not to take things personally. It can also mean not to take criticism of ones actions or deeds as personal criticism of ones worth or value.

Just as the get a life quip was meant to suggest that of all the worlds problems and woes the problems your were pointing out were (in my opinion of course) not that important to be unhappy about… it don’t let it get you down.)

“I still can’t be sure your post wasn’t a bit of a leg-pull, “

It wasn’t a joke… I did mean that I thought that use of the scroll bar would solve the problem you identified much better than the solution you proposed.
Of course I also did not mean to offend and it was meant in a light hearted manner… I should use the smilies more often where appropriate, though some time ago I was criticised for my excessive use of them… 🙂

“However, when I am interested in a post and people take the theme so far left of centre that the original post is wiped out, then justify doing so by stating that the original thread was exhausted anyway, seems a bit high handed to me. “

Do you think the discussion I and Vortex and others had “destroyed” the topic?
Were those discussing the F-35 and any potential Australian use of it were intimidated or frightened by a discussion of turbine engines?
My personal view was that those who wanted to have a say did… I know I didn’t stop anybody from posting.
The original post was not wiped out… it is still there. People said what they had to say and the discussion has currently stopped in the direction it was started.
Who stopped it?
I’d say the people who were having the chat stopped replying.

RE: My say

Geforce

I’d love to see a debate between Cyruss and James…(unless they are the same person). I reckon that would be a very interesting debate to sit and watch.

Wombat

RE: My say

Well, what I’ve read of James Caan posts had nothing to do with flaming. I do know what flaming is, I already had my portion. And even Cyrrus should have the opportunity to express his beliefs, how silly they may seem. I’m not here to defend anyone, I just think some people use the word ‘flamer’ a bit too often, that doesn’t mean someone can’t be an a$$hole. If there are flamers here, there’s only one thing to do : press that alert button.

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

>
>i’ld say that after havoing been on varouis oother forums
>that sometimes the kind of order and structre that you get
>at say ACIG isbetter – however that is not always quite as
>fun and takes a lot of time and effort to set up / manage.

I agree with Rabie here. The forum is not an encyclopedia (spelling!). When I need constructive information for lets say an official article, then I guess ACIG is the better place. But since my knowledge on military aviation isn’t big enough to participate in those discussions, I’d rather not post at all.

RE: My say

Geforce

I’m not sure that I follow your post fully, but your comment regarding attacking somebody because they are sexist or whatever wasn’t part of my original intention with this post. I didn’t attack anybody personally, and especially not their use of this forum. My whole purpose was to plant the idea that consideration for other members would sometimes go a fair way to improving the forum.

I’ve read the posts recently with Cyrus 666 and James Caan, and I suspect that they deliberately post the sort of messages they do to stir people up. And they are very successful at doing it. I am quite happy to let them continue to be the ogres on this forum, but feel that they are also necessary characters to liven things up.

I realise that GarryB was concerned at my post and I’m still not sure how to take his response, but I would rather think he was pulling my leg than taking me seriously. He certainly has the right to post whatever he likes, and is correct to say that, if I don’t like or am not interested in the post, then leave.

However, when I am interested in a post and people take the theme so far left of centre that the original post is wiped out, then justify doing so by stating that the original thread was exhausted anyway, seems a bit high handed to me. It is very hard not to digress from the original theme at times, but a little consideration for other members could go a long way.

Regards

Wombat

My say

I have to use this topic to say my thing. It isn’t going to make me popular I guess, but most people already rated me, so not much to do about it }> }> }> }>.

I think everyone has the right to say his/her opinion on this forum, but if you attack somebody because you find him sexist, racist or just a complete a$$hole, than you should have a reason for it. I’m referring to the “James Caan”-topics, which I do find highly amusing and entertaining, but the level of discussion is at such a low level, there’s really no thing we’ve learned from it. If you give somebody bad ratings, I can agree with it, but don’t just all follow like a bunch of (sorry, is not going to make me popular) sheeps!!! Most of the people who gave bad ratings to JC are people I can get along with very good, but this time I was really shocked, and most of all disappointed by the poor arguments that were used against JC.

These same people however don’t say anything when Kelly posts her “plane lover and all around beauty”-pic. Well, this is probably meant as a joke (or not?), but then why be so hard on James?

Also, somebody said JC’s probably some forum member with a new ID, specially meant to attack others on the board. Well, I do think people here have the right to stay anonimously (spelling!), this is not the CIA, but an aviation forum. As long as everyone agrees with the rules of the board, even Osama bin Laden or Satan himself should be allowed to post here, not?

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

Garry

I read your reply a few hours ago and didn’t have the time at that point to respond. I wanted time to think about what you said anyway, as I wasn’t sure whether you were being fascetious or serious.

However, you felt the need to repeat yourself on another post, so I assume you are serious.

In my original post on this thread, I made it clear that I sought not to offend anybody, simply to make a point. The J-35 thread wandered so far off field, I’m buggered if I know how you and Vortex got there. Anyway, that doesn’t matter, because my point was simply that, if you have a subject that is “off-topic”, but strong enough in itself to justify its own thread, then go that way and leave the original thread to those who wish to pursue it. You maintain the thread had fizzled out anyway, so I assume that was justification enough for you to take it your way, without consideration for anybody else who might have wanted to follow the original thread.

You have missed the point I made in my second post, too. I said that I felt there was more value in maintaining a “global” perspective to the forum, by avoiding a preponderance of local interest issues. Can’t see how that is disliking local issues, just that it is reminding people that this is an international forum.

To try to instil an Australian flavour to the forum by talking about Australian trivia (thanks for the two suggestions – really deep and meaningful, both of them!), I would be doing exactly what I was asking others to think about before they create so many “local interest” posts. Let’s face it, there isn’t an awful lot that happens in this part of the world that is of real interest overseas, so I’m certainly not going to bore people with threads about Australian customs and laws. I did try one post, with some success, but it was centred around the persepective the foreign press was giving to our immigration policies and illegal immigrants. I wanted the world perspective on the issue, not Australia’s. I can get that any day of the week.

I still can’t be sure your post wasn’t a bit of a leg-pull, so I’ll assume your memo was well intentioned, with no malice intended. There are plenty of other twits who have shown their true colours by attacking members, and I don’t wish to be one of them. I doubt that you do either. If you have another look at my first post on this thread, you will see that I dump on myself a couple of times, to lighten the tone of the post. I’m not dead serious about this matter, and don’t need to “harden up” or whatever. (I have to be honest and say that I’m not even sure what that means. Out here we say either “get a life” or “lighten up”.)

Regards

Wombat

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

i have !aquired” a mouse with a roler in the middle so i can scroll sat all teh crap at high spped without clicking on the scroll bar -great “investment” }>

rabie :9

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

I tend to wander around the subject I talk about and I appreciate that it may not be of interest to everyone… get a life!!!

IT IS CALLED A SCROLL BAR… you are not interested… USE IT. (and harden up a bit too.)

We were talking about australias choice of the JSF and some of those in the discussion went off on a bit of a tangent… so what?
The other conversation died naturally anyway, why clog up the system with all these extra threads?
The way the posts are set out below the first posts you can see quite clearly where the discussion has wandered… just skip them.
Your last post here seems to suggest that it is not tangents you don’t like it is localised discussions that you feel left out of.
Why not enlighten them with the strange and weird Australian customs… “Speed Humps” in your carparks, and thongs on your feet…
(BTW a Speed hump in NZ is a quick affair… 🙂 )

ie educate rather than exclude…

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

Guys

Thank you all for your comments.

The one thing I don’t want to convey is that I don’t think there should be light-hearted topics. As A330etc. (man, you HAVE to get a shorter name!!!!!) pointed out, he posted one of those topics and I got a real buzz out of it.

I think my real “objection” is the lack of global application of so many of these posts. This is, after all, a truly international forum and much of the delight I derive from it is being able to swap views and information with members from all corners of the globe. But I can’t talk about “favourite chips” or “best beer”, because Aussie chips wouldn’t mean a thing overseas, and the only Aussie beer that you “aliens” ever heard of was Fosters (lacquer thinners in a blue can).

Other trivial topics, like “contact sports”, has a much more universal appeal, so it is quite feasible to join in from down under.

Anyway, if those members who want to start digressing and talking about the price of peas in a thread dealing with the best-looking ten ton bomb ever dropped, would just think to start their new threads, and leave the bomb-droppers to salivate on the original topic, I think our forum could be just a little bit better.

Cheers

Wombat

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

Any way did you hear the joke about the Man and the parrot???

Only joking.

I get a little frustrated sifting through off topic posts but hey it has to be done. But good solid idea Start a new post.

Merlin

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

good topic wambat, and also a very good posting to start off this discussion.

while if may be a little anoying to have too many posts abt seemingly stupid things, but many of them do turn out to be very interesting if not entertaining. also they do bring a breath of fresh air into this forum, so the atomsphere is not too seriouse or charged up.

but hey, if u dont like those topics, u can always skip them. no one is forceing u to read or post in them.

but totally agree with ur point on keeping discussions on topic. i myself have gone off topic quite a few times, and would like to apologise to everyone if it has caused any incovenience or anoyences.

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

Alot of things about the forums annoy me,but hey,just get on with it.If you don’t like the posts,skip it.

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

A330… you’re certainly not boring. Not many people use the forum for 2 and a half months and end up with 18 ratings totalling 34 points!

I think however crazy posts can be, it’s gets people thinking and the younger members of the forum enjoy them.

If people don’t like a topic, they should simply ignore it – problem solved.

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 01-10-02 AT 11:58 AM (GMT)]Hi Wombat… I agree too, some of the posts in this forum are a bit silly, most of which in the last few months were started by yours truely. 🙁 Sorry if I have bored any of you, but as some of you have said, this forum has a lot of people of different ages and from different cultures, so sometimes I find it hard what to discuss?

Although Wombat, you had to admit, you took interest in one of my posts… the contact sport. 😛

Forgive me… I will reduce these types of posts to a minimum. 🙂

Cheers.

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

In all fairness, the silly topics are always more popular anyway. As Domin mentioned, his “hello” post was a raving success and his first post merely said hello. This prompted in excess of 100 posts and has been far more popular than people talking about more serious matters e.g. war.

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

as you see from all the numbers by my name i’ve been around here for along time

i’ld say that after havoing been on varouis oother forums that sometimes the kind of order and structre that you get at say ACIG isbetter – however that is not always quite as fun and takes a lot of time and effort to set up / manage.

imho getting the webmaster as admin and getting some people on here to be moderators would better suit this forum. the power to move off topic thread or chop up threads so that the tank discussion can become a seperate thread.

– oh well i belive you have to lump it here im afraid

rabie :9

RE: Things that really tick me off with the forum

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 01-10-02 AT 10:22 AM (GMT)]>>On the other hand side it is amazing to see the response of some of >>the discussions in this forum, i.e.

>>”Hold old are you?” created an amazing 59 replies
>>”What is the best flavour of crisps” managed to hit 24

Hehe, its a good job you weren’t here for the “hello” post. I dread to think how many views and replies that got, it must be in the region of 100+ replies and 400+ views. A true masterpiece in pointless posting from yours truely. 😀