US clears Arrow missile systems to India ?

Rule Britania! Rule USES! wooohoo

but seriously comparing the modern DAY us to what the British empire did and achieved you get a scale of how much of a bit player the US is (this is without taking into account socia-economic development because obviously US would not get away with what the Brits did 60years ago)

what was the British army during world war two? 4+ million or something?

oh no not yet, the Brits still rule in messing up areas, Israel, Kashmir and some other places in the world come to mind. US is a baby in comparison.

I agree 100%… no once can beat the brits.. :diablo:

oh no not yet, the Brits still rule in messing up areas, Israel, Kashmir and some other places in the world come to mind. US is a baby in comparison.

i guess the american should know best in regards to destabilizing – they do it the best .
i wonder how America wants to play the game , when their way of looking at things are way off !!

War on terror -( American Way – present )
1) Musharaaf – Dictator – nice guy – give them the latest arms, future , will see !!!.
PAST
2) saddam – dictator – was a nice guy – gave him the latest arms , future – got out of hand , invaded his country , all of a suddent became a world menace.

3) Shah of Iran ………The list goes on a on!!!!!!!!!!

AND WE ARE SUPPOSE TO UNDERSTAND AMERICA STANDS FOR DEMOCRACY !!!!!

Here’s what happened in 2002

India: Powell to Tell India He Opposes Arrow Sale
U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell is expected to tell Indian officials later this week that he opposes Indian efforts to import the Israeli Arrow missile defense system, the Washington Post reported today (see GSN, May 16). Powell has said he plans to visit India and Pakistan to discuss regional tensions (see GSN, July 10).

Israel uses Arrow to defend against short-range and medium-range ballistic missiles. Because Israel developed the system jointly with the United States, Israeli officials must obtain U.S. approval to sell it to other countries such as India and Turkey, according to the Post.

The Bush administration has not yet decided whether to approve the sale to India, but high-level officials are considering the proposal, a Pentagon official said. The administration plans to inform Israel of its decision “fairly soon,” a senior State Department official said.

Department officials oppose the proposed sale out of concern that India’s acquisition of the system could increase tensions in South Asia, where Pakistan and India in recent months raised international concern that they might go to war.

“We have concerns about the introduction of more missiles into this area,” the State Department official said. “It could be destabilizing.”

“Were India to proceed with an investment in missile defense, one thing is certain,” said Karl Inderfurth, former assistant secretary of state. “Pakistan will respond in some fashion, either by increasing its offensive capability to counter such a defensive shield or by pursuing its own form of missile defense wherever they could obtain it. That is an iron law of the action-reaction cycle in South Asia.”

State Department officials are also concerned that the sale might harm U.S. efforts to prevent missile proliferation, according to the Post. They worry that it would send the wrong message to Russia, China and other weapons exporters at the same time that the Bush administration has made nonproliferation a priority.

Another potential concern is that selling the Arrow system might violate the 1987 Missile Technology Control Regime, of which the United States is a member (see GSN, July 10).

“We have some issues we need to sort through, particularly how the sale relates to the MTCR. That’s an open question,” the Pentagon official said.

Sale Supporters

Several Pentagon officials and others have said they support approval of the sale. Some said they do so out of general support for Israel, which could make a good profit, and some have argued that allowing the sale would be in line with U.S. President George W. Bush’s advocacy of missile defense and efforts to cooperate on missile defense with other countries, the Post reported.

“We certainly understand India’s interest in missile defense,” the Pentagon official said.

Proponents of the sale to India have also said it could improve U.S.-Indian relations and reward India for backing down from a confrontation with Pakistan (see GSN, June 24).

http://www.nti.org/d_newswire/issues/thisweek/2002_7_26_misd.html#2

FYI india just crossed canada to become PRCs 10th biggest trading partner. bilateral trade has expanded by 41% first five months of CY05 and is expected to reach around $18 bil this year.

there are many mututally beneficial areas like china has a surplus of capacity in textile mill machinery and indian mills who cant buy enough are snapping these up. huawei and ZTE have supplied telephone gear at dirt cheap rates compared to lucent/nortel.

about the eyesore to the west, its management and care has been outsourced to Unkil for time being. going by the express speed of the crackdown post 7/7, it looks like the UK has significant levers there as well – perhaps the remittances by the large emigre community there are vital for the eyesore’s economy.

Not sure about Europe but single european countries would act.

It’s a very long, long way from Europe to Australia.

Interesting perception. I’m sure it would surprise most Australians, who perceive themsleves as a very small country on the edge of Asia dominated by China, Japan, and India.

But it seams the leadership thinks different. Maybe the UK media has played up Australian involvement more then needed because it doesnt want the UK public to percieve that the UK is the only backer of wrong US policies

Yes, but still based on pragmatic common and mutual self interest. China and Japan are important trade partners, but we have very little, if anything, else in common with them. Europe..do they even know that the Asia Pacific exits, or know anything about it apart from a few wildly inaccurate sterotypes? And if they did, would they ever be willing to act in its support (remember Bosnia and Kosovo)? South America???

Not sure about Europe but single european countries would act.

Why can India openly support taiwan like Chinese support for pak… enemy’s enemy is a friend…. that way India can get good support from US also..

And what will India getting accept for un-needed attention? as long as China percieves India to be weeker and not worth worrying about India is fine.

China IS bigger in all respects then India and India cannot afford to Antoganise it or even draw attention/have and arms race with China while the nuisence in the west still exists. it would be disadvantageous for India!

It needs to quitely build up and improve from the Inside! get rid of its own cancer and the grown in the west.

But Australia seems to be desperately trying to show it self as a world power

Interesting perception. I’m sure it would surprise most Australians, who perceive themsleves as a very small country on the edge of Asia dominated by China, Japan, and India.

it has mostly always sent in troops to “support” the us doing its work.

Yes, but still based on pragmatic common and mutual self interest. China and Japan are important trade partners, but we have very little, if anything, else in common with them. Europe..do they even know that the Asia Pacific exits, or know anything about it apart from a few wildly inaccurate sterotypes? And if they did, would they ever be willing to act in its support (remember Bosnia and Kosovo)? South America???

Burma would be one to watch out for. as i (if i was Chinese ) love to put missile on that side of India too, giving me reach to Diego Garcia

Why can India openly support taiwan like Chinese support for pak… enemy’s enemy is a friend…. that way India can get good support from US also..

IMO US might be stressing to put some Green pines on the Chinese border also… We have to wait and see how china responds.. US is indirectly putting pressure on China by engaging both Japan and India.

Burma would be one to watch out for. as i (if i was Chinese ) love to put missile on that side of India too, giving me reach to Diego Garcia

Australia, “mastered”, huh? Australia’s alliance with the US is based on mutual and common self interest; commercial, economic, cultural and strategic.

No offence meant mate.. But Australia seems to be desperately trying to show it self as a world power (apart from the nice cooh where australia finally got its hand on the oil in Indonesia) it has mostly always sent in troops to “support” the us doing its work.

No doubt about what you said.
What I said was that for India there are two main options – stick to its current status or become a first class US ally.
Both of these options offer great things for India, with the option to stand aside the US offering what you described above.

About India’s social problems – when I’m talking about India becoming a superpower, I mean not only by having a large and powerful army but also to reduce poverty to the minimum, developing the countrysides and developing science, academics and high tech.
As you said, economy and trade are the main keys for that – and that’s exactly what you’re doing now.

About the Green Pine and the Americans satellites – it depends how far you want to see. The Green Pine located in one of the Arrow batteries in Israel deteced to launches of the Syrian Scud missiles a while ago, in Syria’s northen border. That means a lot.

IMO US might be stressing to put some Green pines on the Chinese border also… We have to wait and see how china responds.. US is indirectly putting pressure on China by engaging both Japan and India.

inshallah we shall see the Arrow2 in few yrs atleast for major cities. however to be more effective the system needs feed from US early warning sats. israel gets this feed, we will need to sign on to this also if we want to extend visibility beyond the Green Pine.

Erez, there are huge benefits in trade, technology and geopolitics from siding with the biggest animal in the forest. if you look at “decent” US allies like EU/Aus/Japan/SouthKorea/Taiwan/Singapore/Israel they have benefitted a lot. some “allies of convenience” without the economy and political stability have ofcourse got the shaft – I need not name them here 😉

India’s main priority is not to be a superpower but moving 250 mil away from poverty as soon as feasible with the least amt of social disruption. Economy and trade is the key, power will follow.

No doubt about what you said.
What I said was that for India there are two main options – stick to its current status or become a first class US ally.
Both of these options offer great things for India, with the option to stand aside the US offering what you described above.

About India’s social problems – when I’m talking about India becoming a superpower, I mean not only by having a large and powerful army but also to reduce poverty to the minimum, developing the countrysides and developing science, academics and high tech.
As you said, economy and trade are the main keys for that – and that’s exactly what you’re doing now.

About the Green Pine and the Americans satellites – it depends how far you want to see. The Green Pine located in one of the Arrow batteries in Israel deteced to launches of the Syrian Scud missiles a while ago, in Syria’s northen border. That means a lot.

inshallah we shall see the Arrow2 in few yrs atleast for major cities. however to be more effective the system needs feed from US early warning sats. israel gets this feed, we will need to sign on to this also if we want to extend visibility beyond the Green Pine.

Erez, there are huge benefits in trade, technology and geopolitics from siding with the biggest animal in the forest. if you look at “decent” US allies like EU/Aus/Japan/SouthKorea/Taiwan/Singapore/Israel they have benefitted a lot. some “allies of convenience” without the economy and political stability have ofcourse got the shaft – I need not name them here 😉

India’s main priority is not to be a superpower but moving 250 mil away from poverty as soon as feasible with the least amt of social disruption. Economy and trade is the key, power will follow.

Nothing much is known on Arrow-3 except for the fact that Israel is working on it, It was reported that the Barak-2 SAM(70 km) proposed to be jointly developed with India has few of the features of Arrow-3, Mostly has to do with Netcentric Capabilties.

If we go by the optimism in the US regarding India, I will not be surprised If US offers to add India in the JSF joint development. Based on the Nuclear agreement, we get the feeling that US is trying to bring India on par with other allies. So JSF is not out of question.

Nothing much is known on Arrow-3 except for the fact that Israel is working on it, It was reported that the Barak-2 SAM(70 km) proposed to be jointly developed with India has few of the features of Arrow-3, Mostly has to do with Netcentric Capabilties.

Although India is more interested in Arrow-2 and the upcoming Arrow-3 , But so far Israel have not received the US go ahead , Again the report says *could* , Lets wait and watch before we open our Champagne Bottles and celebrate.

Any details on the Arrow-3, if such thing exists?
As far as I know, the Arrow-1 was the first experimental model, which was then redesigned to be the Arrow-2. The Arrow 2 is the operationl system in the IDF, and although the system is being upgraded, as far as I know it’s still on Block 2 or 3 level, nothing more.

Although India is more interested in Arrow-2 and the upcoming Arrow-3 , But so far Israel have not received the US go ahead , Again the report says *could* , Lets wait and watch before we open our Champagne Bottles and celebrate.