Vulcan at war….from another forum

I am absolutely sure Mr Bateson would be delighted with the buyer removing the cockpit! He would then be in the position where he has his 15K-the buyer has made it an eyesore and he can get the local scrappy to smash it up and give him quite a few quid for the aluminium scrap. I cannot see how he stands to loose!

Any news Chaps?

eBay don’t give a stuff – all publicity is good publicity. They’ll only be upset if the seller doesn’t pay his bills.

Yeah, maybe… 😉

Bring on the scrapmen now please.

Someone should have done so about 10 years ago, back then it might have been possible to get some useful parts from XL391, still like you said the lawyers will have a field day with their commission over this case.

Personally I say ‘a pox on both their houses’.
However, I’m not so sure this is as legally clear cut as you guys like to make out.
Also, Damien I’m not so sure the masters of E-bay will be so keen on the bad publicity this generates and any impact it might have on future business.

This one will run and run and what I do know is this, some lawyers will pay for their Summer holidays on the proceeds.
Very sad.

Bring on the scrapmen now please.

Cheers
Andy

Hmm. Wonder who will be the first to give the other a bit of poor feedback…;)

Flood

Ok guys perhaps I worded my statement earlier alittle inaccuratly, not so much illegal as just an entitlement to your money back ( quickly written at lunchtime ). Having checked it out abit apparently as long as he describes the goods accuratley then it’s a good sale. However if the sale went through the books of his company rather than a private sale then that opens a different can of worms!

Although you can only say that the buyer has been very nieve as I understand it it is illegal to sell something in this country without informing the buyer of any known defects, of which this has plenty!

Yes fair comment, but would you buy a £15K item from eBay without going to kick the tyres first ?

And its not as though the pubs in Kent or the Shetlands or Timbucktoo either. Surely he could have gone to view it just the same as Joe Public can ?

Although i seem to recall the bidding going a bit silly and a lot of bids and bidders subsequently cancelled, and bidders thereafter being vetted.

I wonder what criteria Mr Bateson saw in Mr Ollerenshaw, to allow his bid to stand…?

Maybe, because he wasn’t that far away and ~assumed~ he would come & view it before auction close.

I can’t believe he expects to remove the cockpit section and other parts and leave the rest for the former owner to scrap how can this possibly go through? If it were me and I was the former owner and heard of this happening I would not be stuck with the rest of it..

Although you can only say that the buyer has been very nieve as I understand it it is illegal to sell something in this country without informing the buyer of any known defects, of which this has plenty!

I think you are confusing a couple of regulations. Selling something “as seen” does not protect you from obligations under the dreaded Health & Safety regs but this is in respect of industrial machinery, not private sales.

“Sold as seen” is pretty commonplace, as mentioned above, I don’t think Mr Ollerenshaw has a leg to stand on here.

Although you can only say that the buyer has been very nieve as I understand it it is illegal to sell something in this country without informing the buyer of any known defects, of which this has plenty!

The point is was Mr. Ollerenshaw’s heart in the right place? Was he purchasing the Vulcan to secure the future of the airframe and perpetuate the memory of those who flew the aircraft during the cold war? Or did he just think it would draw punters to his pub garden and act as a useful umbrella?

If his motive was the former, then surely he would have known a little more about the logistics of moving such a purchase and the probable pitfalls which were highlighted clearly enough on this forum and, I suspect, others.

The notion of spending that kind of money on such a complex artefact sight unseen frankly beggars belief.

Regards,

kev35

How many of us would pay £10-15K for an item we’d never even seen “in the flesh”? Ollerenshaw’s a mug. Heart was clearly in the right place, but didn’t give it enough thought.

I have to agree with you Dave, I fear Mr Ollerenshaw doesn’t really have a leg to stand on. The man, apparently, didn’t make any effort to examine what he was bidding a massive (well it is to me) amount of money on. His words “It’s just a rust bucket. Alarm bells rang the moment I saw it.” say it all really. Why not go and “see it” before bidding?

That’s nothing short of stupid in my view. Much as I dislike Mr Bateson’s methods I’m struggling to see how he “misled” anyone in this matter.

I know all this has been said before here, but the more this thing develops, the more unbelievably foolish this man appears. 🙁

Agree with these sentiments 100%.

I find this whole sorry saga very sad indeed. The seller of the Vulcan clearly has not lavished any care on it in many years, and his /very/ brief summation of the machine on ebay, together with the poor photos taken from a distance leads me to think that the intended market was the scrapman.

What a shame then that the well intentioned but niave buyer became involved. His wife seems to have had her head more screwed on (I think the “rust bucket” comment came from her). Unfortunately their claim will fail. The rules of Ebay are clear, the buyer, however lacking in goodwill he may have been, made his position clear and a simple search on the net would have brought up enough information for any buyer to form an impression of what he was taking on before bidding. To bid sight unseen really does seem short sighted and will go against him.

Sadly the shadow of the axe has been hanging over this machine for many years, arguably ever since its wheels first touched down at Blackpool. What a shame that this once proud bomber will now be only be remembered as the rust bucket that some fool bought on Ebay.

I imagine the people in charge at e-bay are not to happy about this situation becoming a total farce, as lets face it this ain’t gonna be good publicity for them.

Talking of XL391 there is a good feature on said Vulcan on the airscene uk website click here.

Mr Ollerenshaw doesn’t really have a leg to stand on.

He has two – and he is going to have to stand up on them and take the bad publicity (and subsequent failure of his case, probably) like a man, not cry about how it all so unfair… – Nermal

I have to agree with you Dave, I fear Mr Ollerenshaw doesn’t really have a leg to stand on. The man, apparently, didn’t make any effort to examine what he was bidding a massive (well it is to me) amount of money on. His words “It’s just a rust bucket. Alarm bells rang the moment I saw it.” say it all really. Why not go and “see it” before bidding?

That’s nothing short of stupid in my view. Much as I dislike Mr Bateson’s methods I’m struggling to see how he “misled” anyone in this matter.

I know all this has been said before here, but the more this thing develops, the more unbelievably foolish this man appears. 🙁

Well i just reviewed the actual eBay auction, and its says “As is, where is”, plus the new owner is an eBay beginner, so i think the seller is correct.

Shame its gone to the ‘no win-no fee’ brigade, however eBay always claims such sales are a legally binding contract.

With this very public case, it’ll be interesting to see just how binding :confused: