Welsh Assemby – Yes to new powers

Ooh, Linc – there’s a question. I think you’ll find a good cross-section in the film thread but a very wide range of films from comedy, to serious drama. I have loved film all my life so my taste is broad – I suppose anything which is well produced and well acted and that includes dozens of foreign, mainly European films. I would probably have a limited interest in the swashbuckling hero type of film, especially if it romanticised a true story, which I suppose brings us neatly back to Braveheart.:)

Thought it was a pile of drivel as well as being a fantasy……….:)

Just out of idle curiosity Pete, what sort of films do you like?.

Lincoln .7

Politics, dear boy, politics!;)

I second that.

Back to the question at hand though, I cannot understand why the question of Scottish and Welsh MPs getting to vote on purely English matters has not been addressed constitutionally, (and for the record, I don’t think the reverse should be true either).

Is there any reason, other than an unwillingness to bring it up?

Thought it was a pile of drivel as well as being a fantasy……….:)

Ah, Gotcha, Mel Gibson, damned good film, have watched it several times, disregarding the connotations re the film in the context it was being used therein.on the forum.

Lincoln .7

Braveheart.

All this cross border willy waving is not terribly productive for anyone. I am a Scot first and proud to call myself such- and a Brit second, but a Brit just the same. I voted against devolution and will never vote for independence. I cannot abide nationalistic bigotry and in the eyes of the world I’m sure all that just makes us all look a bit small minded. While I’m on my little soap box, that bloody film has nothing to do with Scotland and everything to do with Hollywood and anyone who takes it in any way seriously needs to go and read up.

Perchance I have missed something in your statement, what film are you referring to. :confused:

Lincoln .7

Just a few off the top of my head.

No.1 The oil is in Scottish territorial waters. That would make England worse off. Definitely

Hmm, around 89% of it is. And on independence those waters boundaries will be disputed. Not the straight line that exists today.
Oil revenue is 2% of the GDP of the UK, the whole shebang is a political red herring. Notwithstanding the fact it is running out & fast.

No.2 The army. 10% of the population but 15-20% of the army. That would make the English army worse off.

They would just recruit more. And a whole bunch of Scots would still join the army (just like the Irish today) for the ‘action’ especially as any new scottish defence force would be considerably smaller than the amount of Scots in the British Armed Forces currently.

It was a bail-out by a UK government to UK companies that stopped a much much worse crisis.

In the same way it is UK oil. The point he was making was that Scottish taxes would never have been enough to bail out RBS in an independent Scotland.

The West Lothian question needs to be solved. It’s no good moaning about we didn’t vote for Thatcher so the Tories had no mandate – of course they did. These were UK elections and there was no Scottish parliament. You might be interested to know that in the 2005 election England would have had a Tory government so much of what Labour did had no mandate either.

All this cross border willy waving is not terribly productive for anyone. I am a Scot first and proud to call myself such- and a Brit second, but a Brit just the same. I voted against devolution and will never vote for independence. I cannot abide nationalistic bigotry and in the eyes of the world I’m sure all that just makes us all look a bit small minded. While I’m on my little soap box, that bloody film has nothing to do with Scotland and everything to do with Hollywood and anyone who takes it in any way seriously needs to go and read up.

You bring a breath of fresh air to this thread. I have visited and worked in Scotland with varying degrees of frequency for more than 40 years and count dozens of Scots among my best acquaintances and friends. Not one has any aspiration to independence and all but 2 voted against devolution – twice.

They all regard themselves as British but enjoy Scottish culture in all its marvellous manifestations. As I do.

Let me start by saying, technically, I’m Scottish. I consider myself British.

I cannot see what benefit independence would bring; not for Scotland, not for Wales. It is not as if people are being oppressed or living in squaller that would warrant a separation.

As naive as it sounds, if the UK parliament was less corrupt, and had MPs representing all regions there would be no need for a Scottish Parliament or Welsh Assembly.

Why not free prescriptions for all in the UK, not just those in Scotland?

The way I see it – good or bad, England, Scotland and Wales are stronger together.

As an aside, it’s noteable that any country which has fought to gain independance from the UK has never asked to be allowed back in.
Heh heh – it used to be the Scots, the Welsh and the Irish who had chips on their shoulders…

Has any nation anywhere never asked to be brought back into their original “mother”?? I doubt it.

I really don’t see that the English, with a few notable exceptions, have any chips. We’ll go along with whatever transpires. What we object to is the inbalance of the West Lothian formula vis a vis Scotland. Most English would probably welcome Scots and Welsh independence because the whinging would end and the English exchequer would be around £20 billion better off, net after oil revenue and Scottish and Welsh tax revenues were deducted.

The reality is, of course that a large majority of the Welsh and probably a majority of the Scots feel the same so independence will remain a pipe-dream for all of us.

wearing T-shirts with a picture of an Australian millionaire film star in fancy dress and some bollox about ‘You can take our lives, but you can’t take our haggis’ ( or Mars Bars, or something?) Moggy

I agree Moggy, though with one slight amendment, he is actually American born, but brought up in Australia !!!

There seem to be some very ambivalent attitudes north of the border these days.

Apparently the English are the devil incarnate and have been exploiting the poor downtrodden celts for generations, but the moment anybody suggests that we feel we might be better off without the union they get all defensive about what a wonderful contribution Scotland makes.

No need to fight for independence. Vote for it and many of us will wish you all well. Vote to stay and we’ll make the best of it.

Moggy

As an aside, it’s noteable that any country which has fought to gain independance from the UK has never asked to be allowed back in.
Heh heh – it used to be the Scots, the Welsh and the Irish who had chips on their shoulders…

Indeed, I thought I was offering Mr Pewtey a compliment in differentiating him from the more independence-minded Scots.

You can’t win can you?

Moggy

Just a reminder – I post here as an individual, separate from my moderation task. I am entitled to hold and express any opinions I wish within the boundaries of the CoC

Well, Moggy, you will always get one who goes a bridge too far, There are many things we have on this forum that could start WW3, if you Mods didn’t step in and keep us in place. It’s a job I don’t think I would want to do.;)

Lincoln .7

Not at all, and that is the point.

Scotland should make all the decisions for Scotland and none of the decisions that are purely English and vice versa. The sooner the Union is dissolved the earlier situations like this will be put right.

Moggy

I fully agree with what you say. at the moment it seems to me to be a one way traffic system, we help out Scotland, and they have a say in Westminister, but we have our hands tied and cannot for want of better words, “Tell them what to do or say, because they take no notice, in their own parliament” Rather a bit like Brussels realy,gives out edicts that only, it appears to me that only the English follow.
And I don’t agree that ENGLAND would go down the crapper if we were left on our own, I.M.H.O. I think we would be better off without them, then we could start to get OUR priorities right.
And before anyone blows a gasket I am 50% a Scot myself.

Lincoln .7

Indeed, I thought I was offering Mr Pewtey a compliment in differentiating him from the more independence-minded Scots.

You can’t win can you?

Moggy

Just a reminder – I post here as an individual, separate from my moderation task. I am entitled to hold and express any opinions I wish within the boundaries of the CoC

Moderator Message

I see nothing in this thread so far that would normally require the intervention of a moderator.

Regards

GA