When will America learn?

I fear this has degenerated into a tedious UK v US comparison-fest

Time to call it a day – there is no enlightenment to be found here

Moggy
Moderator

Another would be Lieutenant William Calley.

Ah……bringing up ol Calley. So its ok then to bring up some English soldiers that massacred people? Do we really want to go there?

ZRX61 As i said earlier “Those that are “Dirt Poor” who are shooting for food.” I have no quarrel with its the Hunters who will go and kill a bear for the fun of it I take issue with Perhaps you are dirt poor or a yeehaw who enjoys blasting away at the wildlife for your idea of sport.I get my satisfaction from trying to rescue animals not destroy them!

@Edgar Brooks
Which is why it’s pointless to base our laws for the majority around him, and people like him. Why make millions give up their sport so that crazy guy has to use an illegal gun instead of a legal one. #

@Mr Creosote
Shooting is legitimate sport, it’s in the Olympics, and it’s been a sport for a very, very long time. Same goes for archery, sword fighting, martial arts, and boxing. I can’t think of any sports or recreational activities involving nuclear materials or biological or chemical weapons. If someone has a genuine purpose for them, and is safe to handle them, then I have no objection to them having them, Universities being an excellent example.

@Arthur Pewtey
In the UK the use of guns for hunting is more about wildlife management (Deer), or protecting farm animals/crops (Foxes etc). As I do not hunt, I cannot tell you whether it is pleasurable or not. This is separate to my initial point, which was with about pistols and semi-automatic rifles, where targets would be the main application.

350,000 deer must be culled in UK each year
The deer population in Britain has risen sharply in recent years and is now between 1.5 and 2 million.

The boom in numbers has lead to an increasing number of motorists being injured in collisions with the animals on the road.

They are also causing damage to the countryside.

Now conserviationists say a cull is the only viable option.

…

No-one wants to blast deer to kingdom come for the hell of it but its better to have them killed humanely and sensitively than to let them die in agony on the side of a road.”

He added: “The logistics of fencing off all the roads are impossible really to consider so a reduction of the population as a whole needs to be done.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/wildlife/4387477/350000-deer-must-be-culled-in-UK-each-year.html

I would imagine that the numbers that need to hunt for food in the US in order to survive is pretty small. If they can afford guns and ammunition they can afford food.
Anyway, killing for food is different to killing for pleasure. Killing for enjoyment is a peculiarly human trait.

Really? you’re an expert on US gun, ammo & meat prices are you?

So lets have the cost of a fully butchered deer please? to the nearest $25 will be close enough.

Cost of a 7.62x54R rifle for hunting: $60.
Ammo for hunting your deer limit (3 I think), lets allow 5 rounds for bad markmanship, so 15 rounds: $2.00

Lets says 50lb of venison per animal & we now have 150lb of meat

So, cost of 3 deer chopped up & stuffed in the freezer: $62.
Cost of 150lb of fresh venison from the butchers?.. I;m guessing a bit more than $62….

& then the next year you only have the cost of the ammo as you alreday have the gun…. so…
Year 2 Costs:
Ammo: $2.00

Remind me again, how much is beef in the UK right now?

No, but but on average around 25 did today and will tomorrow and the next etc….

The majority being worthless gang bangers, so no loss there…:cool:

What about the issue at hand? Not care to discuss that instead of having a go at forum members?

Can’t add anything to post 36; as he’s an inhabitant of the U.S., I’d say he has more knowledge of the situation there than any of us.
Also, if you check back, you’ll see that it wasn’t me who started addressing remarks directly at others.

Today, in the US, approx 70 Million gun owners didn’t kill anyone…

No, but but on average around 25 did today and will tomorrow and the next etc….

I would imagine that the numbers that need to hunt for food in the US in order to survive is pretty small. If they can afford guns and ammunition they can afford food.
Anyway, killing for food is different to killing for pleasure. Killing for enjoyment is a peculiarly human trait.

I’m sorry. You’ve lost me. I was talking about hunting not target shooting which I can almost understand; but hunting? What purpose does it serve in a modern society in 2012? It might be enjoyable for some humans but certainly not for the animal. Fun and enjoyment out of killing? What sort of person would do that?

For millions of people on this planet (not just Americans) it fills the freezer & feeds their families. It’s all very well saying “but they have butchers in the US & cattle farms”… true, but you won’t be filling your freezer with farm raised/store bought meat for the cost of 3 or 4 bullets…

Today, in the US, approx 70 Million gun owners didn’t kill anyone…

Pick your toys up, and put them back in the pram.

Oh OK. You are a new moderator then.;)

What about the issue at hand? Not care to discuss that instead of having a go at forum members?

How can he exhibit normal human behaviour? He’s just killed 12 people in cold blood (allegedly).
Anyway, who made you moderator?

Pick your toys up, and put them back in the pram.

Another would be Lieutenant William Calley.

I am getting lost here but Arthur has made some good points.

Fun and enjoyment out of killing? What sort of person would do that?

A wierdo American who thinks he is the Joker for starters?

Well I certainly didn’t and I think it was a reply to one my posts. :confused:

@Arthur Pewtey
Exercise… why? Don’t you have a car?
Job… Why? Can’t you claim benefits?
Seeing your children… why? Can’t they live their life at board school?
Holiday… why? Can’t you just stay at work?

Anyone have any clue what this is about? :confused:

As the OP here, can I just say that this was never intended as some UK vs USA contest or some criticism of America as a whole. As with (I suspect ) most people this side of the pond, there are a great many things I admire about the American way of doing things, and some I downright envy. But with respect, I do think you’ve got it badly wrong on the issue of gun ownership. Still waiting for someone to convincingly refute my belief that more gun ownership (compared to other countries) de facto means more gun usage, and that this is borne out in the much higher rate of gun deaths in the US compared to other countries. As for the counter-argument that “maybe we should ban knives, planes, trucks, power tools (Eh?!) etc because they can be used as weapons too” well frankly that’s pathetic: they have a practical, necessary function in everday life, whereas the only purpose of a gun is death or injury. Re the argument that the “bad guys” (loonies, terrorists, whatever) will always get hold of guns anyway if they really want to, would you “un-ban” lethal poisons, chemicals, nuclear material etc for the same reason, ie that if they’re really determined they’ll get them anyway so why bother? As for the assertion that “The odd massacre here and there is irellevent” that, frankly is immature and disgusting.

How can he exhibit normal human behaviour? He’s just killed 12 people in cold blood (allegedly).

Anyway, who made you moderator?

If any of you can stop fighting among yourselves, for a few minutes, I suggest that you take the opportunity to watch the accused’s behaviour, in court, today; if that is normal human behaviour, I’ve never seen it before. The man appears to be completely out of it, and heading for (or coming from)a different planet.