Where's the handle?

Edgar,

Do you have any information when the door handle was introduced as the picture above states taken in late 1939.

Regards

Jay

Hi
Would like to thank everybody for their input, especially Mark12 and Edgar for sharing their in depth knowledge and information. My apologies for not writing sooner but I wanted to research the subject a bit more and have spent some time delving into books, finally finding a clearer photo of a cockpit door without a handle which I have scanned in to share with you, it appears to be the standard spring loaded catches seen on all spitfire cockpit doors connected to each other via cables with a metal ring connecting each one.
Also scanned is some information from another book regarding the crow bar.
Regards

Jay

27-3-39, modification 30 was “To modify locking of cockpit hood.”
12-7-39 mod 31 was “To modify forward catch on emergency door.”
As so often, the mods say what happened, but not what was done, nor why.
3-2-41 mod 320 was “To provide stowage for crowbar for emergency operation of sliding hood.” This was on the Spitfire I & II.
14-8-41 the crowbar was deemed surplus, due to mod 324 “To provide means of jettisoning hood.” This is believed to be the Martin-Baker system, but there’s no concrete evidence.
Presumably wiser counsel prevailed, since 23-1-42, mod 483 was “To re-instate mod 320 stowage of crowbar,” and this was on the Mks I, II, & V, so appears to have been retrospective.
Most common “colour” seems to have been natural steel.

Google can’t find any appropriate pics at the moment – but does it mean that all current airworthy Spitfires (Mk V onward’s) have to have a red crowbar – to comply with today’s ‘elf and safety??

…. and as such, …. are not authentic !! 😮

Ken :rolleyes:

{off-topic}

There’s something different about your avatar Andy. Have you shaved off your moustache?

Richard

I have certainly never noticed any trace of red on the wreck-recoved examples I have seen.

Crowbars were fitted from Mk V onwards. As stated it was to help the pilot escape. During the war they could be steel, Grey Green or black. The reason it was painted red may have to do with post war international agreements that stipulated that safety equipment be painted red. Anyway the reason that it was painted red was that it was deemed a piece of safety equipment. Yellow broken lines were also painted around the areas that rescuers were cut with instructions on how to open the cockpit from the outside.

Am I right in saying also that the crowbar, where fitted, wasn’t painted red on wartime Spitfires – that’s a post-war/restoration thing.

Modellers beware………

(At least that’s what I recall having picked up from these excellent, informative threads…)

Ken

Even at my age I can tell the difference between a door handle on a spitfire and a crow bar 😀

Apologies, you’ve got better eyes than me as well, the door in the first shot looks too fuzzy to make the detail out for mine:D

There does appear to be something showing in the right area though?

K9791 – the 8th Spitfire off the line.

Reserve a/c for K9787, demo-a/c for foreign customer, trial ì
install.& mods (11036), canon mock-up on wings (developm.of ì
Mk.Ib), trials w. 3bl./2speed DH prop, AAEE gun firing & ì
assoc.trials, DH trials with C/S prop (Rotol CS prop raised the ì
speed from 330 to 370 mph, with the deHav two pitch prop an extra ì
5 mph was available), trials with 2 x 70 gall.overload fuel tanks ì
under wings (1/40), fitt. Merlin XII, PDU Benson 4.6.40, FTR ops ì
17.8.40 (FA/mis) – 126 f/hrs –

The door handle appears to be missing and it is probably associated with the fact that K9791 was a development aircraft.

Mark

Tangmere,
thank you for the confirmation of the crow bar

Pagen,
If you compare this photograph of a later Mk1 spitfire of 609 sqdn and the one I originaly posted you will see that not only is there still no crow bar but also there is a door handle where as on my original posting there is no handle hence the title of the thread.

Even at my age I can tell the difference between a door handle on a spitfire and a crow bar 😀

Regards

Jay

From what I have read in a Alfred price book the early spitfires did not have a crow bar either until 1940.

Yes, and that is what is missing in the photograph of the door Jay, it’s not a handle that you see on later aircraft but the crowbar.

Crowbar not fitted to the very early Mark Spitfires.

From what I have read in a Alfred price book the early spitfires did not have a crow bar either until 1940.
Regards

Jay

It’s the escape crowbar that is missing, the one the pilot uses to help smash his way out in an emergancy.