Which WWII aviator/s would you make a film about?

I think I know who yo mean…

Now, who’s got Spielberg’s phone number?

I know of one man on this forum who knows that gentleman personally. Will he speak up now? (No, he won’t, he’s far away…)

Just don’t let Tom Cruise know about it….! 😉

Certainly seems to be a hefty sway over to telling the story of the Poles (the Czechs have been done, but I think the Polish side of the war is a bit neglected?)

I mean which version of his death is correct?
I’m the kind of person who likes to separate fact from fiction!!

This is certainly true:

“…71-year-old “Johnny” Zumbach had been found dead in Paris. No cause of death was ever announced…”

But if you give it a thought, many people die at 71 without anybody thinking there is something unusual about it.

Speaking of mysterious deaths and potential film heroes, Eugeniusz Horbaczewski would be another one.
He joined the Polish AF shortly before the war, and his commission date was 1 September 1939.
When in Britain he was posted to 303 Sqn in 1941. He opened his score there, and was a brilliant fighter from the outset, despite the fact that he didn’t look much like a fighter pilot: short and thin, and rather weak in appearance. In late 1942 he was kicked out of the famous Polish squadron, the reason being that he ran a slightly too colourful life, so to speak. Incredibly, the 303 OC that had him go was… Jan Zumbach, not really a strict disciplinarian! It was then that Horby (or Dziubek as he was known to friends) swore he would better Zumbach’s score of air kills.
In 1943 Horby fought in North Africa in the Skalski’s Circus, and then volunteered to fly with an RAF squadron. He soon took command of no. 43 Sqn. He was really loved by his men. One of his pilots, Norby King, wrote in his memoirs that when he learned of Horby’s death later in the war, his first thought was if I am to go, it would have been good to have gone down with him…
Horby then went back to Britain and took command of no. 315 Sqn, soon making it the top scoring Polish unit of the period. He also managed to fulfill his oath, at the time when his squadron was part of a wing led by J. Zumbach. He was killed in an epic mission when no. 315 was credited with the largest number of enemy aircraft ever destroyed by a single squadron in one combat.
Circumstances of his death have not been ascertained. Some accounts said he was shot down by the Focke-Wulfs, others credited his death to Flak. It was said that he was ill when he flew his last mission, and said before taking off that if we encounter the Germans I will not return. Others said he may have chosen to die a glorious death rather than face political dilemmas – by that time he already knew the Eastern part of Poland (where his home town was) had been handed over to Stalin by Western Powers, to be incorporated in the USSR. And it seems certain that more than one girl weeped after he failed to return…

What do you mean by ‘right’?
I think he was this kind of a man that had he died a natural death in his own bed, surrounded by his family, many people would consider this was not the right way to die for him.

I mean which version of his death is correct?

I’m the kind of person who likes to separate fact from fiction!!

I have another one, a World War One pilot who also served in WWII as well.

Keith Caldwell. Quite an amazing chap really. He was on the first course of the famous Walsh Brothers Flying School at Kohimarama, becoming their second pupil to pass his test and get his licence. he then went to the UK and joined the RFC. He served in No 60 Sqn where he won the Military Cross. On one occasion in that sqn he saw that Major W.A. Bishop was under attack from seven German fighter, and despite having no ammo left himself he returned from the safety of Allied lines back eight miles over enemy territory to bluff the fighters away from Bishop so he could escape.

He was also one of the few pilots to escape a long chase by German ace Werner Voss (who had 48 victories to his credit at the time) by pretending he’d been hit and then turning the tables and loosing off 94 rounds himself. Voss escaped but Caldwell was at least not shot down.

After a rest period he got command of 74 Sqn, which included Mick Mannock VC and several other aces, and between Jan 1918 and the end of the war the Sqn shot down 230 aircraft.

On one patrol his aircraft collided with another in the flight, and was badly damaged. It dropped 1000 feet then went into an uncontrollable flat spin. He stepped half out of the cockpit and holding the strut he managed to balance the plane a bit better. It spun for 5000 feet. Just before it hit the ground he stepped off onto the ground, rolled, stood up and walked away, much to the astonishment of troops on the ground that witnessed the whole thing!

He had many other adventures in WWI and shot down 25 aircraft. He later joined the RNZAF in WWII and commanded RNZAF Station Woodbourne, then Wigram, then went to India and onto the UK.

I think his early career would make a great story, especially since he served with many aces and had some really amazing adventures. And he survived. He died in 1980.

So what IS the right version?? :confused:

What do you mean by ‘right’?
I think he was this kind of a man that had he died a natural death in his own bed, surrounded by his family, many people would consider this was not the right way to die for him.

So what IS the right version?? :confused:

Voytech, I really like the sound of your idea of him for a subject of a film, but I have to say (however accurate) Daz’s ending sounds more dramtic and better for a feature film. 🙂

That’s probably why the American authors chose this version of the story to put in their book 😉

Voytech, I really like the sound of your idea of him for a subject of a film, but I have to say (however accurate) Daz’s ending sounds more dramtic and better for a feature film. 🙂

Guess who(Clue CATS EYES).

AGV Pilot, Robert T Smith :rolleyes: , First US ace in one combat 😮 , Heres one more, What about the Fighter pilot that fell in love with a Princess 😉 , Ring some bells 😀 , Sure they could get a Hollywood Movie out of that One, Cheers and Tally Ho! Phil 😎

Playing Scooby-Dazz

The last couple of comments stuck in my mind, so I looked up the book anyway (much against my own comment!!):

“Shortly after the war, Zumbach and two other former RAF pilots started a charter air transport company that became a cover for a banknote-smuggling operation. Its activities soon expanded to include the shipping of Swiss watches to London, gold bars from Tangier to France, Israeli agents to Palestine, and various kinds of weapons to various kinds of countries.

After several years of this, having stayed one step ahead of the law the whole time, Zumbach retired from smuggling and went more or less straight. With the money he had made, he opened a discotheque in Paris. In time, he married a French woman less than half his age and fathered a son. But life eventually became a little too sedate for Johnny Zumbach. In 1962, he went into the mercenary business, setting up a primitive air force for Katanga, the breakaway Congolese province. Five years later, using the alias “Johnny Brown”, he performed the same service for Biafra during its war with Nigeria. On bombing raids, Zumbach was the pilot of Biafra’s only aircraft, a World War Two-vintage B-26, while his bombardier, an Ibo tribesman, dropped homemade explosives on Nigerian targets.

snip

Even at seventy, an age when most men are firmly retired, Zumbach was still living on the edge. “Trouble comes naturally to some men,” he once wrote. In late 1985, he told Ludwik Martel in London that he was involved in a hush-hush deal that was going to make him a lot of money. “It was clear,” Martel said, “that something fishy was going on.” A couple of weeks later, Zumbach phoned Tolo Lokuciewski in Warsaw and talked vaguely about some “buying and selling” he was doing.

The next day, January 3 1986, Lokuciewski received another phone call, with a message that left him in shock: 71-year-old “Johnny” Zumbach had been found dead in Paris. No cause of death was ever announced, but many of his friends were certain he had met with foul play.”

Considering how little I know of Zumbach, I’m not sure how much of that is true or not. :confused:

Well, it was just a passing comment, anyway, but I’m sure you’re 100% correct.

I shan’t bother to look it up if it’s going to cause aggro! 😉

Hmmm… VT, don’t want to question your sources or knowledge, but the book For Your Freedom And Ours states something otherwise about Zumbach’s death.

At least I’m pretty sure it’s him, anyway, I could of course be (and probably am) wrong.

Daz,
1) By all means, do question my sources or knowledge if you think I’m wrong! Other forumites have tried to in the past, and many of them succeeded. That’s what this forum is about, isn’t it?
2) I don’t have my copy of “A Question of Honor” (that’s the original title which got changed when they translated the book from American to English), so I cannot check at the moment what you meant – do you mind being more specific?
3) Anyway, I meant to say that he didn’t die in any of the wars he fought in, nor was he killed in a crashed aeroplane or anything like that. I know various stories are told of the actual circumstances of his death, but AFAIK: he was pretty old when he died, he was a family man when he died, he was quite happy with his life when he died.

Hmmm… VT, don’t want to question your sources or knowledge, but the book For Your Freedom And Ours states something otherwise about Zumbach’s death.

At least I’m pretty sure it’s him, anyway, I could of course be (and probably am) wrong.

How about Jan (Jean) Zumbach?
– a Swiss national (how many pilots of Swiss parentage fought in WWII?)
– fought in the Battle of Britain, and with some success
– commanded 303 Sqn
– the unit under his command introduced the 94 FS to the tricks of fighter combat over Europe when they arrived in Britain in the autumn 1942 (that’s for Hollywood, although they would probably put this part of the story the other way round)
– led a Mustang wing in 1944 (for Hollywood: they escorted US bombers over Germany)
– became a smuggler after the war, carrying gold accross Europe, watches from Switzerland, and soldiers to Israel
– as a mercenary he set up the Katangese Air Force
– he then organised the Biafran Air Force in another war in Africa
– meanwhile he owned a night club in Paris
– died as a happy family man
In general: he drank a lot, he flew a lot, and chased girls a lot. Perfect movie character.
And he wrote his slightly improved autobiography “On Wings of War”/”Mr Brown”, so there is no problem with the basic script.

MPJay, what’s wrong with the HBO movie Tuskegee Airmen?? I didn’t think it was too bad, although a little cheesy in parts. Some nice, but brief footage of the Cavanaugh Museum’s Buchon, too 🙂

I think it was already done by HBO, but how about a proper movie about the Tuskegee airmen. Proving that black men can fly and fight as good as any in the army air corps. Their stats are pretty impressive if i remember correctly.

Paul Mantz

For years there has been a script floating around Hollywood called “Hollywood Pilot” about famous film flyer Paul Mantz.
He did the stunt flying for scores of pre-war films. During the war he commanded the USAAF motion picture unit in Hollywood, Ron Reagan was one of his lieutenants, and post war did flying (and crashing) for films like “It’s a Mad, Mad Mad, Mad, World” , served as director of aerial photography for “Strategic Air Command” and “Spirit of St. Louis” both with James Stewart, crashed a B-17G for “12 O’Clock High”…before being killed in 1964 or 65 while flying the cobbled together plane for “Flight of the Phoenix.”
His partner, Frank Tallman did the B-25 work on “Catch 22” and flew the Grumman Duck in “Murphys War”. Together, they had a huge collection of classic planes…ranging from real WWI fighters, to a lot of inter-war stuff….a Lockheed Vega, Ford Tri-Motor, Curtis Hawk, Boeing F-4, to most WWII warbirds, even a DH Dragonfly…

At one time he bought 500 war surplus planes, kept a few…like the P-51Bs he raced, and sold the rest. They say he got more than his money back from buying the planes due to the amount of fuel still in their tanks.