Who betrayed the Bomber Boys?

I am not bored.

If I was, I´d go somewhere else.

In fact, having a discussion like this, questioning our leaders decisions is what the war was about.

Or?

Regards

Jon

I am not bored.

If I was, I´d go somewhere else.

In fact, having a discussion like this, questioning our leaders decisions is what the war was about.

Or?

Regards

Jon

Try 3in1.

I’m sorry but why do you think you are entitled to comment on the length, or otherwise, of anybody else’s posts? Nobody is forcing you read what they have written but common courtesy dictates that you restrict your comments to the content of their arguments.

Not in the least. Repeated longwinded postings usually tend the ramble and make topics difficult and tiresome to follow, especially if they get off-topic. In this case, the thread veered off down the ‘Dresden’ & ‘Area-Bombing’ Scalextric slot….zzzzzzzz……

Try 3in1.

I’m sorry but why do you think you are entitled to comment on the length, or otherwise, of anybody else’s posts? Nobody is forcing you read what they have written but common courtesy dictates that you restrict your comments to the content of their arguments.

Not in the least. Repeated longwinded postings usually tend the ramble and make topics difficult and tiresome to follow, especially if they get off-topic. In this case, the thread veered off down the ‘Dresden’ & ‘Area-Bombing’ Scalextric slot….zzzzzzzz……

Just curious, were the Luftwaffe members shot down over Great-Britain treated this way?

These two were.
http://www.oldcatton.com/archive/featured_articles/featured_articles_pg02.htm

Just curious, were the Luftwaffe members shot down over Great-Britain treated this way?

These two were.
http://www.oldcatton.com/archive/featured_articles/featured_articles_pg02.htm

I find that comment offensive. Please don’t put words in my mouth.

It was a genuine question. I’m happy to be corrected but that type of response stifles questions.

It’s an emotive subject, always has been and will continue to be so, especially as the numbers of Bomber Command Veterans decline. Whoever is responsible for the decision not to retrospectively grant a specific Bomber Command campaign medal should hang their heads in shame. It’s a small enough token of the gratitude of a Nation.

As to your original post I clearly misread it as a statement rather than a question and for that I offer you my sincere apology.

I find it particularly galling that the powers that be somehow deemed that aircrew operating over Europe after the 4th June 1944 should no longer be awarded the Aircrew Europe Star. There should not be any difference between a bomber crew lost before 4th June or after. I’ve always thought this decision was scandalous, as though those completing two months operational service before 4th June 1944 were somehow deserving of an award more worthy. Perhaps if the issue of the Aircrew Europe Star had been awarded to all aircrew who flew over Europe between the beginning and end of the war, then maybe there wouldn’t have been the clamour there is now for a retrospective award of a specific Bomber Command medal.

Regards,

kev35

I find that comment offensive. Please don’t put words in my mouth.

It was a genuine question. I’m happy to be corrected but that type of response stifles questions.

It’s an emotive subject, always has been and will continue to be so, especially as the numbers of Bomber Command Veterans decline. Whoever is responsible for the decision not to retrospectively grant a specific Bomber Command campaign medal should hang their heads in shame. It’s a small enough token of the gratitude of a Nation.

As to your original post I clearly misread it as a statement rather than a question and for that I offer you my sincere apology.

I find it particularly galling that the powers that be somehow deemed that aircrew operating over Europe after the 4th June 1944 should no longer be awarded the Aircrew Europe Star. There should not be any difference between a bomber crew lost before 4th June or after. I’ve always thought this decision was scandalous, as though those completing two months operational service before 4th June 1944 were somehow deserving of an award more worthy. Perhaps if the issue of the Aircrew Europe Star had been awarded to all aircrew who flew over Europe between the beginning and end of the war, then maybe there wouldn’t have been the clamour there is now for a retrospective award of a specific Bomber Command medal.

Regards,

kev35

Which statement at least has the attribute of brevity. :rolleyes:

I’m sorry but why do you think you are entitled to comment on the length, or otherwise, of anybody else’s posts? Nobody is forcing you read what they have written but common courtesy dictates that you restrict your comments to the content of their arguments.

Which statement at least has the attribute of brevity. :rolleyes:

I’m sorry but why do you think you are entitled to comment on the length, or otherwise, of anybody else’s posts? Nobody is forcing you read what they have written but common courtesy dictates that you restrict your comments to the content of their arguments.

Btw, here…

http://www.ebay.de/itm/120987392018?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649#ht_500wt_1413

… some very nice pics of the Wehrmacht burying with the honors (and the St-George’s cross on the coffins) the team of a shot down British bomber.

Just curious, were the Luftwaffe members shot down over Great-Britain treated this way?

Btw, here…

http://www.ebay.de/itm/120987392018?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649#ht_500wt_1413

… some very nice pics of the Wehrmacht burying with the honors (and the St-George’s cross on the coffins) the team of a shot down British bomber.

Just curious, were the Luftwaffe members shot down over Great-Britain treated this way?

By the end of the war, those in power regarded the indiscriminate bombing of German cities as an embarrassment: that much is clear.

On a less contentious note, I thought the makers of the programme had made a decent effort to find some less familiar newsreel to illustrate the argument.

Tom

By the end of the war, those in power regarded the indiscriminate bombing of German cities as an embarrassment: that much is clear.

On a less contentious note, I thought the makers of the programme had made a decent effort to find some less familiar newsreel to illustrate the argument.

Tom

I agree…..it’s not as if this is a historic aviation forum where people who are interested in the subject can come to discuss it! :rolleyes:

Which statement at least has the attribute of brevity. :rolleyes:

I agree…..it’s not as if this is a historic aviation forum where people who are interested in the subject can come to discuss it! :rolleyes:

Which statement at least has the attribute of brevity. :rolleyes:

Phew. A lot of verbiage and recycling old non arguments…

I agree…..it’s not as if this is a historic aviation forum where people who are interested in the subject can come to discuss it! :rolleyes:

Phew. A lot of verbiage and recycling old non arguments…

I agree…..it’s not as if this is a historic aviation forum where people who are interested in the subject can come to discuss it! :rolleyes:

Old Arguments.

Phew. A lot of verbiage and recycling old non arguments. Non of which really explains or excuses the way BC were treated.

There are often comments about the effectiveness of BC. The early period was rather innefective, but without it, and the technology that resulted from it, BC would never have become the mighty weapon it did….

If BC wasn’t effective, many other actions such as D-Day would almost certainly never have succeeded. BC constantly kept German resources pinned-down, and AA guns etc were only a small part of that. Men and resources repairing, rebuilding and moving production facilities could not be on the front, – or anywhere else for that matter…..

The argument about German war production is seductive, but totally misleading. To maintain output of, for example, fighter a/c, an exponentially greater effort was required as the war went on. That effort had to come from somewhere…. Remember what Harris said about ‘Panaceas’….. Harris was, of course, correct. All a waste of time when one has no pilots or fuel of course…..

Likwise the argument about the moral of the people not being broken. Sure, they carried-on. In the UK there was at least a light at the end of the tunnel; Not so in Germany. Efficiency, quantity and quality suffers when a system is under that much pressure. Propaganda aside, it’s clear that German moral ineviitably tailed-off later in the war, especially once they knew they had a war on three fronts…..

I suspect, that if the Dresden raid had not have taken place, the agitators would have cited the previous large raid etc. Such people would not like to be on the losing side, but often distance themseves from the means to achieve victory. Such is war. Had the Germans have been successful in 1940, they’d probably have been high on their lists to round-up, and would have recieved a swift reality-check.

Old Arguments.

Phew. A lot of verbiage and recycling old non arguments. Non of which really explains or excuses the way BC were treated.

There are often comments about the effectiveness of BC. The early period was rather innefective, but without it, and the technology that resulted from it, BC would never have become the mighty weapon it did….

If BC wasn’t effective, many other actions such as D-Day would almost certainly never have succeeded. BC constantly kept German resources pinned-down, and AA guns etc were only a small part of that. Men and resources repairing, rebuilding and moving production facilities could not be on the front, – or anywhere else for that matter…..

The argument about German war production is seductive, but totally misleading. To maintain output of, for example, fighter a/c, an exponentially greater effort was required as the war went on. That effort had to come from somewhere…. Remember what Harris said about ‘Panaceas’….. Harris was, of course, correct. All a waste of time when one has no pilots or fuel of course…..

Likwise the argument about the moral of the people not being broken. Sure, they carried-on. In the UK there was at least a light at the end of the tunnel; Not so in Germany. Efficiency, quantity and quality suffers when a system is under that much pressure. Propaganda aside, it’s clear that German moral ineviitably tailed-off later in the war, especially once they knew they had a war on three fronts…..

I suspect, that if the Dresden raid had not have taken place, the agitators would have cited the previous large raid etc. Such people would not like to be on the losing side, but often distance themseves from the means to achieve victory. Such is war. Had the Germans have been successful in 1940, they’d probably have been high on their lists to round-up, and would have recieved a swift reality-check.