XH558 What next ?

‘Just Jane’ would need a respar to fly which would cost in the low millions if the cost of the work done to PA474 is used as reference. Apsrt from that everything would need certifying which would be an additional expence.
She could fly again – the Panton’s I believe have always treated her as a ‘reserve’ Lancaster should anything untoward happen with PA474 .

One of my dreams is to buy up the land (and donate it) and reconnect the af to the runway so East Kirkby could have a/c flown in. PA474 belting down the runway with Just Jane after her would be an incredible sight.

When I was at Air atlantique over the winter, they were saying that the blue T4 is waiting to be civillianised, and is in a queue for the work. It was sat outside on the grass and didn’t even have power applied during the six months I was there….

Has the starter cartridge problem been sorted out which had grounded the sea hawk and other canberra? I heard that supplies were running VERY low, and alturnative means of starting were being looked at. I know AA’s cranberry is flown still, but how often I could not guess…

I’d love to see a few more cranberry’s flying on the show circuit too. Imagine a T4, B2 AND PR9 in formation….

As for a new national project return to flight – are there any aircraft which COULD capture public attention as much as the Vulcan? With the exception of the lightning, I can’t think of one. In my humble view, someone should buy the recently retired military jets with a view to fly them at some point in the future (Jags, Tonkas….). HHA’s Buccaneer will probably be the next ‘complex’ aircraft to fly.

Would TVOC be interested in forming a ‘Cold War’ heritage flight? – Vulcan, Buccaneer, Hunter, Canberra PR9, Lightning (?), Phantom (?)… imagine the running costs!:eek:

arent the last three PR.9s effectively life expired?

Possible, wheres a PR9 expert when u want one 😀 However, probably a nice strip down & rebuild with OEM backing should sort them out. Bex

arent the last three PR.9s effectively life expired? ive just been reading vulcan 607, it has a picture of one of the first victors painted black with silver wings and a red cheatline down the either side of the fuselage from nose to tail, that looked stunning. it would be nice to see dx’s victor painted up like that……… or flying like that hehe

Im sure bex would agree with me on this, but i for one would love to see a couple more canberra’s on the uk circuit, certainly not quite as demanding as a vulcan? 😀

Oh I wont deny it Ben and I reckon most regulars on here know Im a little bit of a Canberra lover 😮 Id love to see more Cranberrys up where they belong thats for sure. AA do a cracking job keeping WK163 up, and I believe theyve also got the blue T4 on her way to getting her “Ticket to the Sky” aswell. However, theres 3 PR9’s that could be on the circuit and theres plenty of complete airframes around that could given the right backing to grace the skies again, Id certainly help, even its just with a paint brush!!!

They might not be Vulcans, but in aerobatics a Cranberry would give XH558 a run for her money. Roland Beamont had a habit of getting a rollocking from the powers that be for doing things “that a bomber shouldnt be doing” LoL

Bex

Im sure bex would agree with me on this, but i for one would love to see a couple more canberra’s on the uk circuit, certainly not quite as demanding as a vulcan? 😀

What about the next big thing a Gannet ????

Now that would be very nice…….. yes please 😀 Bex

What about the next big thing a Gannet ????

It’s the YAM example from Elvington .

The Leeming Javelin has some bits missing I think – not sure about the engines!….. The last Leeming Phantom is now in a hangar awaiting the scapman’s torch… XI(F) Sqn’s Lightning was complete and kept in potentially taxiable condition. It was a running joke to get new linies to ‘BF the Lightning’

I had to stop for fuel at Leeming a couple of weeks ago on my way to recover one of our aircraft from Newcastle. There is the Javelin on the gate and another on the pan at the end of the hangars, sat next to it was a Phantom and a Hawk that looked like it was going for a wash.

What’s the story behind the second Javelin? do they rotate the gate guard or something?

p_j

Lindy’s Lad wrote:

US Phantom – sure, providing that SALT II doesn’t get in the way and a good airframe is plucked from Nevada

I’ve seen this on a number of websites and forums. Those treaties such as SALT etc didn’t cover such airframes as the F-4. Not even the F-111 was covered by SALT. In relation to aircraft it only dealt with heavy strategic bombers.

Note inaccurate ref to SALT in this website

http://www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.uk/phantom/survivors.html

U.K. F-4s were scrapped under the CFE (Conventional Forces in Europe) Treaty. The treaty that the Russians have recently withdrawn from. The Russians used to come and visit bases such as Coningsby and inspect airframes under CFE treaty conditions. The same was done at Russian bases by CFE treaty signatory nations. The Russians destroyed huge amounts of fighters and fighter-bombers under this treaty.

Harrier ha ha ha pull the other one, its got bells on. TOO COMPLEX

In the U.K. I agree not a chance. Possibly a ground running Harrier? The private SHAR in the U.S. shouldn’t be too far away from first flight?

http://www.nallsaviation.com/updates/12.htm

It would probably be better to consider modern built and designed replicas of some of these aircraft. But the investment required probably wouldn’t give a high enough return.

However, I do wonder if someone like Martin Baker or Inflight Refueling might consider taking on Jaguars to try and preserve what remains of their current fleets.

What would it take to convert a Jaguar into an ejection seat tester?

‘Lindy’s’ condition, and that of the Brunty Victor are well docuymented on this forum – out of fatique life, well and truely. Strip to components, NDT the spars, possibly replace the spars, then work on all the other systems which us volunteers have messed with for years.

The only chance of a ‘complex’ aircraft to fly now is if a complete restoration was carried out with the design authority, OEMs and an EASA 145/part M compliant company running it. Sea Vixen ‘Foxy Lady’ being the exception to the rule since it already has a permit, and 558 soon to be flying. I can’t think of any complex aircraft (Lightning, Bucc, Phantom, etc, which has been maintained in a ‘just out of service’ condition, hangared, with Licenced engineers at the helm, and everything documented – unless the QRA Lightning guys at Brunty have done those things.

HHA’s buccaneer is a possibility because of their eminent position as an EASA compliant company, but nothing from the world of ‘preservation’ will fly unless a complete re-build can take place.

On the subject of Tornado’s – possibly one could fly, but we would have to wait until they were all retired and classed as non-effective. 2011 for F3’s was what I’ve been hearing, just for retirement. If someone was to have the foresight of Mr. Walton and buy an F3, all the support gear they could get, some engines (ALOT of engines)… then just maybe….

UK Phantom – no way, not enough spares
US Phantom – sure, providing that SALT II doesn’t get in the way and a good airframe is plucked from Nevada….
Javelin – no spares, and a dodgy safety record (plus complete re-build)
Lightning – possibly, if the CAA can get over the bad safety record and other well documented problems with a return to flight of a lightning
Jaguar yes, if someone acts NOW and gets the recently retired ones at Cosford (CanopenerAl’s masterpiece) AND all the still servicable spares….
Gannet Best chance is the one stuck at Goose Bay….
Swift no spares
Harrier ha ha ha pull the other one, its got bells on. TOO COMPLEX

can’t think of any more for now…….:D

The Victors were life expired when retired. Therefore they will not fly again .
The Mechantman at Brooklands is an interesting aircraft -does the public find freighter aircraft interesting? – possibly Air Atlantique have already cornered that market with the DC-6. What I think is worth pointing out is there are possibly fewer former military jet aircraft flying now then the was in the 1990’s. It costs money and lots of it to operate these aircraft – receipts from airshow appearances are fairly trivial in comparison to the actual operating costs.

Has anyone considered “XL231 “Lusty Lindy” as a candidate ?
Or the Brooklands Merchantman ?
Be lucky
David

I sometimes get the impression that the CAA attitude is ‘It’s never been done before so you can’t.’ A bit like the old RAF ruling on landing at Gib ‘If you haven’t done it before You’re not allowed to.’ I sometimes wonder what causes otherwise sensible people to make stupid rules. Almost as though they make them up as they go along with no thought as to whether they are right or neccessary.

Sea Vixen at Bruntingthorpe

Just for the record, the Sea Vixen at Bruntingthorpe is a privately owned airframe, it does have both engines still installed, but one of them is in poor condition with possible bearing problems. It has had its engines run in recent years, but has many problems to be sorted out, and is most unlikely to run in public in the future. This is not just an opinion; I am a close friend of the owner, and a member of the group that operates this airframe.
With most ex naval airframes, corrosion is the big problem for obvious reasons, but most pre 1960’s aircraft did not have the luxury of the exotic corrosion resistant metals we now take for granted. The corrosion problems on 558 are an example, and she was a very good clean airframe.
Also, remember that corrosion is not just in the airframe, engines and especially electrical equipment are also very vulnerable.
Also, 558 was a very well documented airframe, with all records intact and up to date. The CAA require proof on paper of such things as airframe hours, landing cycles, pressure cycles, engine hours, major component life histories etc, etc, the list is endless, and very few, if any old aircraft have this paperwork in place, this alone will permanently ground many.
So to be honest, I think it is unfortunately, very unlikely that we will ever see such as a Javelin fly again, Corrosion, paperwork and lack of spares not to mention funds will see to that.

‘Just Jane’ would need a respar to fly which would cost in the low millions if the cost of the work done to PA474 is used as reference. Apsrt from that everything would need certifying which would be an additional expence.
She could fly again – the Panton’s I believe have always treated her as a ‘reserve’ Lancaster should anything untoward happen with PA474 .

XH558 what next

it would be nice to see another classic aircraft hit the skyways as it were ,personally id like to see NX611 at east kirby getting her wings again,the airframe is in superb conditionas are the engines etc ,the main advantage of this would be to give PA474 some respite, and indeed NX611 did give up some spares to 474 when the latter was gate guardian at Scampton, having said that the chances of a privately owned bomber obtaining a Cof A are distant but the idea should be given consideration if NX611 is kept in her present condition which im sure she will be, in my opinion this aircraft represents the only viable option but this is my opinion

The Leeming Javelin has some bits missing I think – not sure about the engines!….. The last Leeming Phantom is now in a hangar awaiting the scapman’s torch… XI(F) Sqn’s Lightning was complete and kept in potentially taxiable condition. It was a running joke to get new linies to ‘BF the Lightning’