It make sense as BAE is backed by the UK, Dassault is backed by France…And airbus not clearly backed by a one country. They are the weakest link and are looking for an industrial alliance to maintain their R&D offices and skills. Surely BAE is more “compatible” than with Dassault which is a big high tech SME compared to other multinational.

However this would be politicaly sensitive as Airbus is also working on SCAF with Dassault. But if in the end SCAF and Tempest can fuse in a single fighter program that will be good news for Europe.

It seems that there is some kind of a remake of the early eighties with competing demonstrator which eventualy lead to Typhoon and rafale programs. Hope this will end well !

Interesting times ahead…But decision must be taken quickly as it will be more difficult to join forces if already a lot of work and effort have been invested in respective programs.

Considering the amount of British tax payer money still going into Airbus and the recent interference by Tom Ender’s in British political matters my opinion would be that Airbus can carry on on their own. That comment by Mr Ender’s was a cynical way of accessing more British tax payer money nothing else. Airbus were late on A400M and the Typhoon was a pain to get into flight. I don’t know what tranche they are in UK service now.

Better to work with SAAB, JAPAN, Boeing.

Btw, dassault systemes also own catia.aswell as solidworks. And dassault is main stakeholder of thales. Far from that small.

But I don’t see the relevance.. CATIA is popular because of the firewall that it has to ensure that it’s customers data isn’t lost or shared.

That’s my point. I guess it opens the door to formal Italian participation in the future and they obviously needed to include Leonardo because of their position in the UK defence industrial complex.

Here is a good and details article about the Tempest programme in a UK context:

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/tempest-a-look-at-what-britains-next-generation-combat-jet-could-be/

If Leonardo in the UK is talking to the MOD you can assume they are firewalled to the hilt and its not necessarily Uk-italy Collab.

Why Tata and not HAL?

To bring in new companies to the sector HAL already swamps aerospace in India. it would also give the likes of Tata and Mahindra some more experience to take on global markets and companies. Tata with a bit of experience would be good for example as a bidder for UKs GKN .

What controversies ?

some noise about giving away key locations for military sensitive areas up north.

TICs require support in different ways and frankly every TIC is different. The question was not whether the UAV is an ideal CAS platform but whether one was available that was designed for CAS. MY argument is there is no ideal CAS UAV, just like there is no ideal CAS aircraft. All have strengths and weaknesses. A good ATO will planner will ensure that various assets with different capabilities are available for support. We also get coloured by CAS experiences in Iraq and Afghanistan. CAS support at the end of Vietnam showed clearly the type of aircraft that were required in an environment where the AAA threat was significant enough that CAS aircraft stopped going below 10kft.

A significant UAV limitation for CAS is weather, UAVs do not function in adverse weather well at all, they long thin wings are not designed for high wind for instance.

Correspondingly UAVs are great for situational awareness and identifying enemy and friendly troops. The UAV is controlled by a pilot but also has a payload operator and in most western nations has intelligence/imagery analysts present as well. A manned CAS aircraft does not have that expertise to call upon.

I’m not claiming that the MQ-9 is the best or only UAV capable of CAS, what I am claiming is that it can conduct CAS, simple as that, as can pretty much any armed UAV with a decent sensor. There is no “designed for CAS” UAV because there is no requirement for it.

I understand your points, and also understand that CAS UCAV means different things depending on the battlefield and need of the day/time. The MQ9 is great for loitering over deserts and open terrain providing support through hellfires as needed. I was merely asking if people were developing UCAV specifically for CAS which does not mean I don’t think the mQ9 can do CAS just that I think it was a role it was asked to do in Iraq and Afghanistan. UCAVs don’t need to have thin wings etc. etc. Those are a remnant of their original roles. The terranis, nueron and x47 all are delta tailless aircraft. The mq8 fires scout is a helicopter. None of those were designed for close air support from outset.

What does CAS stand for, Close Air Support. CAS doesn’t stand for ground attack only delivered by a gunship or A-10 or Su-25. The guys on the ground don’t care where the bomb or rocket or shell or bullet comes from. They care that it is there. As for purpose built CAS UAVs, any armed UAV has the potential to do that.

As an example “The MQ-9 carries a variety of weapons including the GBU-12 Paveway II laser-guided bomb, the AGM-114 Hellfire II air-to-ground missiles, the AIM-9 Sidewinder,[16] and the GBU-38 JDAM (Joint Direct Attack Munition).”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Atomics_MQ-9_Reaper

That is more than enough to support ground troops and also given that the MQ-9 can be available for CAS for extremely long durations these are perfect platforms.

MQ-9 may be able to play a role for CAS but that’s not the same as a CAS UCAV and that is still only 1 UCAV.

Hi all, are there drones for close air support or border security on the market? I have done some research and have not seen anything however I am not an expert.