Originally posted by kya bidu
Likewise how do we know the J10 is more capable than the F16?

Perhaps we should ask crobato. After all he does claim it to be

I see how this goes. First make a claim, when evidence is asked for, support it by claiming secrecy and little data available.

Then make more claims about power, manouvrebility etc based on the original claim. When evidence is asked for point to the first unsubstantiated claim and claim secrecy for anything else that cannot be proved.

Then make another claim, and so on and so forth.

If anyone steps into the argument insisting on subtantive evidence call them flamers, bigots, noobs, make personal attacks etc… Say anything, claim anything, point to previously posted unsubstantiated evidence. But real proof will never be forthcoming. It is secret after all. If it is so secret then how come there are millions of words written over it on the internet.

All this time the whole smoke and mirrors speculation rests on the original unsubstantiated claim!!!

A real neat system to support something for which there is nothing official available, and an aircraft which may not even be in service right now.

No I think the reality is the J10 and other programs are just as likely to be in the stages claimed by the Chinese posters as likely to be STILL IN THE TESTING AND DEVELOPEMENT STAGE. There is no evidence to prove that conjecture wrong either. It is still a secret so what makes your claims more believeable than mine?

Is the Chinese govt. so dense that it does not realise the so-called truth is already out there? I don’t believe they are. I believe they know exactly what is being said about their development efforts on the J10 on the net. I believe they are hiding facts because the J10 does not meet their performance specs. That is a much simpler explanation for the secrecy – rather than the complicated one we are asked to discard our disbelief for. Occams razor states that given a complicated explanation and a simple explanation for anything, the simpler expalnation is far more likely to be the the truth.

You’re jealous of Chinese accomplishments? It’s so obvious.
Your LCA is a good start but nobody thinks it’s in the same class as the J10 yet you guys are comparing it to the Typhoon. You guys don’t even have the kaveri engine working yet you guys are boasting about going to the moon. One questions whether the kaveri will ever work. The russians won’t help you. The french and USA won’t. Everyone wants the kaveri to fail. and most likely, without their help, it will be a failure. And if the kaveri fails, guess what? the LCA will fail as well.

They should also be developing a B1B sized superplane with stealth, moderate maneuverabilty (7g), supercruise, awac level radars 1000+km range that can carry 100+ A2A medium (60miles) and long range (200+km ramjet) missiles, or its equivalent A2G bombs.

After all, in A2A combat, manueverability is not needed anymore. Stealth, long range radars, and long range missiles do all the work.

If China or any other nation can build such a plane, they’d be feared and would absolutely rule the air with an iron fist. A stealthy B1B sized aircraft that can see first, shoot first, and fly away fast would absolutely rape F22’s with their shorter radar, and limited missiles. It would absolutely destroy awacs that are slower, and non stealthy. Imagine shooting 100 long range ramjets at awac planes? toast!

Let other nations field small planes like F22 but China is China. They have and always will think large. These superplanes would rule the airs with unprecedented superiority. I would call this new class of super planes Dragons.

These planes should also have laser weapons that can shoot down ICBMs, and incoming A2A missiles. They should also be equipped with invisiblity technology, like F22’s are reputed to have.

I’m totally serious about this. Smaller planes like F22 are antiquated, expensive, and carry limited weapons. What we need is an air-carrier for the skies. 100+ missiles with ramjet. superior Awacs level radars that can see at least 1000 kms. Stealth to avoid detection. Invisiblity to avoid visiblity. Supercruise for long distance range. Laser weapons to shoot down ICBMS, and A2A missiles. A crew of about 20. It can also serve as an Awacs for other planes. Price tag: 500 million.

:p :p

Erez you are clearly racist or very nationalistic. you are so biased you can’t see clearly.

First of all, to any objective person, the J10 and Lavi look similiar but are not identical such that one cannot say without solid proof that J10 was based entirely on the Lavi. The Lavi is however identical to the F-16 except for the canards. I would say Lavi is much more of a copy of the F16 than the J10 is of the Lavi. How much help the Chinese received from Israel, nobody can say, but clearly the J10 is not a copy of the Lavi. One can even say the two look quite different in many areas. However to you Erez, you are unable to see this. Because as others have pointed out, you are nationalistic and perhaps, racist.

Secondly, the Lavi is a failed Israeli project, while the J10 is a successful Chinese project. The Lavi may have flown briefly but ultimately it was cancelled and therefore, it’s a failure. Anytime a project is cancelled, it is a failure. To say a successful project is entirely based or was dependent upon a failed project is illogical.

Thirdly, the Chinese are capable of creating indigenous aircraft. They have produced numerous planes on their own for many decades. They have vast experience in many areas, more than Israel, Pakistan, India combined! Because they were politically isolated, they had no choice but to be indigenous.

what software do you use? what do you do for a living?