EELightningJust to point out for the Typhoon and Captor-E. With the array fitted to a ‘Repositioner’, it will provide a 220-degree total field of regard – 110 left and 110 right.
As much as Eurofighter GmbH consider the AESA to be important for export sales of the Typhoon. The Indians were reportedly very impressed with the Captor radar when they were in th UK. It was also reported that the RAF Typhoons couldn’t get the most out of it because of the lack of airspace…Which was huge for the Typhoon and MKI to train in anyway.
EELightningOpinion alert 😉
I feel Rafale has an edge here due to its flyaway price.
*sigh*
The flyaway price is just one thing concerning cost. Theres much more to it than just that alone.
EELightning2014? Have they changed the year because the last time I checked it was 2015.
If they choose the Typhoon, the first 18 will more than likely be 2 seat trainers rather than the full blown single seat, Tranche 3 with AESA.
EELightningOn the Typhoon, major airframe change, where abouts would you have those conformal weapons bays? If you look at the Typhoon head-on, its very-very slim & streamlined, it looks rather fragile too & looks as though the only place to have them is where the semi-recessed hardpoints are – even then they would have to be quite small and most probably only able to carry Meteors. Its not worth adding all that weight and mechanisms etc for the little doors just to carry Meteors. Too much unnecessary weight, too many unnecessary components, too much unnecessary maintenence. Not worth it.
I’d rather stick with CFTs, actually, excluding weapons maybe, after AESA I consider CFTs one of the most important upgrades for the Typhoon to have.
EELightning@Quadbike. What could you do to a Typhoon to make it a Stealth fighter? The way I look at it, very little, if anything at all. Remove the tail (TVNs taking the fin’s job of yaw control)…add coatings would be the most things you could do to it without further messing about with the actual airframe itself, minus the tail of course, & I really wouldn’t bother messing about with anything else.
The area(s) I would work on is the Typhoon’s AESA, electronic sub-systems etc enhancing them to be more capable to pick up stealthy aircraft at a great distance. Stuff like that.
EELightningCharmin character, indeed. If she’s long and lean, with fantasy hair and statuesque bombshells on top of that, then it’s definitely a keeper, buddy 🙂
Well, shes charming but not the others. Short, petite, black hair blacker than, well black & where its not black its Ferrari red and dresses emo/goth & prettier than the prettiest thing there is. Yep, I certainly consider myself to be the luckiest guy alive, shes definitely a keeper alright. 🙂
BTW those Kopparberg cider bottles are a bit…Hard…They don’t break…It turned it a bit of a dare. 😀
@EEL
The LEX are particularly useful for the low speed regime. No idea how much manoeuvrability could be improved by them, but I’m not so convinced that it would yield a 15% improvement in turn rates etc. It will help, but I don’t think to such an extend. What’s even more interesting was the good old EF2000 sim from DID published in 1995, the 3-D model of that aircraft featured LEX as well.:eek:
I heard someone else mention it improved manoeuvrability by that percentage, or near to it. If ever a Naval Typhoon is produced it would most probably be fitted with, especially if they’re useful for low speed regimes.
I never played that sim. Anygood? Worth buying maybe? 🙂
EELightning@EEL
there isn’t much out there about the proposed LEX aka apex strakes. I figured that I had an image from a wind tunnel model with those dating back to 2004 or so. The rest is known. DA5 was fitted with them and first flown on 13th September 2007. IIRC 10 test flights were conducted before DA5 was retired as the last DA on 30th October 2007. The Eurofighter 2020 proposal features them, but it makes me wonder why they don’t integrate it on other aircraft. It was described as a relative easy mod, though it would certainly require some further trials, also gun firing trials which might be the premier reason for not adopting them yet.
Okay thats fine, Scorpion82, thank you very much anyway. 🙂
To be honest I thought Eurofighter might had abandoned the idea but after their mention in the recent edition of Eurofighter World on the proposed Typhoon 2020, then I guess they’re something worth having. IIRC they improved agility somewhere in the region of 15%?
Apart from gun trials. I think the reason(s) why they haven’t been integrated on other aircraft is because there are others things such as AESA, further sub-systems enhancements etc that are a priority and maybe the 10 flights they had they got the test results they wanted?
I think also that maybe they could/would be fitted with the intergration of the TVNs? They would compliment each other very well indeed. They must have enough test results from LERX from flight trials and TVNs (although bench tests & simulations) to gather that these would further improve Typhoon’s performance capabilities.
EELightningFair points, but we can “counter” such words until we’re bouncing off the walls.
Theres a lot of political influence from Spain and Italy too, but mostly from Germany & the UK. Even though Eurofighter GmbH’s bid is German led theres a significant amount of input from the UK/BAE Systems.
Indeed the Rafale is “low risk” as you say, it’s already developed etc where as the Typhoon isn’t yet, but then again, India are keen to learn and be involved in R&D to help boost their industry so if they go with Typhoon, its a perfect chance to take the opportunities. This is a big part of the deal for India hence why they’re very vocal on ToT, R&D, offsets etc etc etc.
It might be easier to deal with one nation, the downside is is that there isn’t much else India can gain from France, both in industry and political. Where as they could from the UK, Germany, Spain and Italy. Theres more companies involved in the Typhoon that are willing to open the doors for India and have more opportunities to be involved in major programmes, present and future ones, and then you have European-Indian ties which I believe are more important than French-Indian ties. Eurofighter GmbH or also keen on to make at least 20,000+ Indian jobs too which is a big plus and Indian technicians have already begun working on Eurofighter related systems in Germany, as far as I’m aware they’re back in India at the Cassidian Engineering Centre in Bangalore developing their skills.
As I say we could “counter” with many words but it would just go and on. However, in terms of ToT, R&D, offsets, European-Indian ties so on & so forth, theres many advantages for the Typhoon I believe. But, have to wait and see in the end.
EELightningOkie dokie thanks, SpudmanWP. It should be interesting what LM have to announce. Pun not intended…Again. 😉
Stop saying “should”…While doing this and watching the coverage of the Formula 1 Japanese free practice sessions earlier from this morning with my girlfriend, I just said ‘Vettel “should” have been fastest on that lap’, my girlfriend said ‘I’m going to get a couple bottles of Kopparberg from the fridge’. As a joke I said ‘yeah you “should” then she looked at me in an evil way & said ‘I “should” break a bottle over your head, you Limey’ (No pun intended to the lime flavour of the Kopparberg cider…it was a direct malicious insult) Charming lass…No pun intended. 😀
EELightningI’ve not been able to find any reference to viffing in flight ever being used in combat.
Apart from the nozzles & piping to them, a large part of the Harrier engine could be considered dead weight most of the time.
It hasn’t been used in combat, neverless it has been succesfully used during A/A combat training.
True, but not as much weight when compared to the F-35’s equipement needed to perform take-offs and landings. Sens replied with my quote & explained in fair detail, but, with the F-35B’s airframe limited to what? 7g IIRC? with so much weight to hump about on top of that, IMO its nothing that special to write home about. Just my thoughts.
EELightningThe “should price” should be out this month, pun intended 😉
Sweet. How much should each variant cost or should each variant differ in price? Pun not intended. 😉
Scorpion82, do you have any information to read about with regards to Typhoon’s LERX, please? I’ve been looking about for something but haven’t came across much. Thank you in advance. 🙂
EELightningAnd at how much does this all come to in the end? Give me a buzz when we get a “should price” of the F-35.
EELightningWhat makes you think Dassault has a better ToT package?
Commonality with the Mirage might play a part but I doubt it’s as important as many people think it is. If India wanted commonality then they wouldn’t have so many different types of fighters with so many different types of engines, avionics, aircraft assemply lines and even weapons etc in their inventory.
The price is next to impossible to discuse as so much more will be involved other than the aircraft itself. And the Rafale ain’t that cheap as much as many of its followers believe or wish it to be. I would say theres not much difference in price when put up against the Typhoon.
EELightningOh dear LOL!
I don’t remember the Eurocanards having so many major technical problems as the F-35 has had and at how much so far? Nearing half a $trillion US, ah yes. And I don’t think these three “expensive” European fighter programmes have reached that much combined.
I do love some peoples optimism.
EELightningIt would be interesting to have a discussion (An intelligent one) on comparing the F-14D with Phoenix and Typhoon with Meteor. Shame the US still didn’t have any in operational service.
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