The F-35 is optimized for X-band and K/Ku band stealth. The KJ2000 AWACs should have a radar coverage of 450km well outside Meteor range. It also operates in the S-band which means the F-35 might not be stealthy.

450km against what size target? If the radar is operating in the microwave wavelengths, it’s going to have difficulty spotting the F-35 at great distances, much less tracking.

If the J-10 have datalinks to the AWACS they can launch missiles without radar lock with mid-course guidance update from AWACs platform and terminal guidance provided by the missile’s seeker head. J-10 also has IRST. AWACS datalink and IRST can possibly negate X-band stealth.

This is a circular argument based upon the premise that a 450km detection range(or something outside Meteor/AIM-120D range), is a given.

Both sides will be operating under heavy jamming degrading datalinks and sensors. The goal of both sides would be to take out the AWACS platform first. F-22 rather than F-35 should be used for this attempt. The other side will use more aircraft(greater numbers) to provide a screen for the KJ2000.

On a systems level, do you honestly think that there are any comparisons as to the capabilities each side can bring to the fight, in terms of numbers of support platforms/jamming resistance, etc…?

F-22 has suffered excessive heat build up in the tail section since day one,
at least that’s what every GAO report on the subject says.

It’s a good thing that the front of the aircraft is usually the aspect an enemy fighter will see as you’re approaching then.:cool:

You clearly implied that the F-22 won’t be detectable beyond visual range and that is a tall and foolish claim.

I most certainly did not say any such thing.

And how am I supposed to know that?
Up until Farnborough footage, I’ve red many posts referring to that AUS character and his “testimony”, as an indisputable proof of F22’s stealth, be it in IR, or EM part of spectrum.
Now, we see it isn’t true, but even a casual observer could have guessed the same, well before this Farnborough.

No one has ever claimed that at WVR ranges, the F-22 won’t be spotted on IRST. By that point it’s pretty irrelevant though, if you can already see it with your eyes. At BVR ranges without the afterburners on, in a head on aspect, it’ll be much more challenging to spot though.

The main RCS increase comes from the engine

and any surface that isn’t shaped to minimize returns(especially ordinance hanging under the wings, in a non-recessed profile).

and the J-10B uses the same arrangement the F-35 does, the same inlet type, true the J-10B carries its weaponry in external pylons but carries more weaponry but it has an airframe designed for dogfights unlike the F-35 which airframe is for a stealthy bomber with secondary self defence capability.

The F-35 was designed to be able to dogfight better than the aircraft it’s replacing, as well as carry bombs.

The F-35 has to content with less missiles and its aft RCS and iR signature is not as stealthy as the F-22 it does not use TVC and has no supercruise, so in terms of performance the J-10B is better.

The J-10 doesn’t use TVC, and unless you have a source saying it can, it doesn’t supercruise either.

Now in order to beat the J-10 you need a fighter that keeps stealth all the time and at BVR.
In close there is no chance it will beat the J-10B with its small visual and RCS signature.

The J-10 isn’t even better than Typhoons, Rafales, Super Hornets, so I think you’re being pretty optimistic.

Stealth does not mean you can not be detected, simply it means you might be detected too late.

It means that it takes longer to be detected, and that it’s harder to get a solid track.

Everything will depend in numbers and aerial assets that support each fighter.

If you have 50 F-35s with AWACS versus 10 J-10Bs without AWACs well no match contest.

50 J-10Bs with AWACS and SAMs against 20 F-35 with AWACS that is different because stealth uses flight planning in order to avoid radar detection and use radar gaps in the defence system.
Use enough radar assets and fighters you will have a hard time keeping stealth carrying less missiles in a disadvantage if you are detected.

20 F-35s w/ AWACS support should be able to handle 50 J-10s. The SAMs won’t be of much use as fratricide issues arise if the J-10s are in the same airspace they’re covering.

Why wouldn’t it? It certainly uses TVC for low speed control in its airshow displays. I think it is a reasonable assumption. One could argue that TVC can cause an aircraft to bleed speed, but wouldn’t that be up to the pilot’s discretion?

If the pilot needed to point the nose faster than he could turn the plane, I could see using TVC at the merge, but the F-22 is agile enough without it, that he’d likely prefer to maintain airspeed.

I’d think 10 F-35s flying with 4(or 6 in later blocks) internal missiles, and staying stealthy the entire time would be preferable, to ever betraying their position. Or, have some F-35s stealthy, while the others carry large missile loads. It wouldn’t make sense to have all of the F-35s carrying external loads, as that would negate one of its most important attributes. It’s better if the J-10s never knew what killed them.