The AIM-120D isn’t in service either. And we don’t know if the KS-172 or R-37M which is similar have been ordered – or not. Details of the last weapons orders from the RuAF were light on details.
AIM-120Ds are being bought right now, and will be in the inventory this year.:cool:
Not crazy at all! I like creative concepts like this, if they will likely offer better long-term strategic results at little extra costs (but with more insurance, etc). 😀
F 7 is already training base for international Gripen customer crews? So I guess even if Norway decided on 100% Gripen fleet originally, maybe Sweden could veto training RNoAF if they disagreed with a Norwegian policy? I doubt it. I think that would be included under the so-called ‘offset’ benefit, which is gained in a hypothetical contract deal. (e.g., it could smartly be negotiated in the front-end MOU, before signing papers).
Anyway the merit of the idea doesn’t sound irrational at all, imho – as you’ve mentioned some good examples for including expanded strategic thinking and long-term doctrine flexibility.
I’d just think the order numbers you presented might be slightly high though. Perhaps 35x F-35 and 20x NG for a total of 55 a/c?
Here’s one more crazy idea for you, conceived just now in pondering this plan of yours. Since it’s not practical or sustainable to really have a small (cute-sized) force structure (e.g. 20 F-35s or something), as an AF would need some training conversion units, test a/c, attrition, and the actual operational fighter squadron! How about 3-4 potential regional operators collaborate and negotiate a joint procured and joint operated Training Conversion Unit? Maybe each contributing AF of such a plan could buy 3-4 jets for the unit (not sufficient if a unique training force). But multiply by 4 operators and viola, each AF equally shares 16 jets for Training! Then, you could buy 25-30 jets as the national operational unit, thus saving euros for your NG complement? Every 4 yrs or so, maybe the joint training unit could relocate to a different country (to share any advantage of having a home-based mult-force training infrastructure)?
It’d be far better to have 56 F-35s than a mix totalling 55, and just keep the training as it has been done in the past.
Using the Su-34 for that role would be a waste of a resource, and the Su-30 would be a much better choice. Of course the KS-172 isn’t in service, nor has it been ordered so it’s a moot point.
Yes agreed, the F-15E could very well hold its own.
The F-15E is a great striker, which history shows.
But against units like Su-35S it would not hold its own.I don’t think high assets like the Su-34 are left alone without escort regarding any mission where it could face F-15/16 etc etc.
If one need a stand-off bomber or something closer to CAS, the Su-34 wins hand down any given day.
With APG-82/AIM-120D/etc… it should be able to hold its own. At the merge it’d obviously be at the disadvantage, but w/ JHMCS and AIM-9X, it still couldn’t be taken lightly.
And that was in response to-
There’s plenty of money. Don’t kid yourself.
What’s inaccurate about the defense budget remark? The RuAF is hardly rolling in the dough.
And the price tag shouldn´t be forgotten…
Various sources state that the fly-away price is around 30 to 40 million $..
That gives a plenty of financial room for additional equipment and weapons development/ integration.
There’s no way the flyaway is $30-40 million. Mig-35’s are ~$70 million.
AESA can be installed on the Su-34, but it’s PESA is specially designed for A2G ops and should be very good at such tasks. There is no way to prove or disprove if an AESA here would be better.
NCW abilities all depend on the onboard equipment, so none of that is much of an issue – it’s a customer choice thing.
Other than that, the SDB is an interesting weapon that makes US aircraft unique in that aspect – everything else the Su-34 can cover.
For A2G I agree, but for A2A/EA I’m gonna have to give the edge to the APG-82 over the Su-34s set.
Well if we’re going to compare the effectiveness of the cannons, then I’ll grant you that the 30mm cannon packs a heavier punch. I seriously doubt either of these aircraft are going to be spending much time firing their cannons though. The F-15s will all have APG-82 AESA radars, JHMCs, superior NCW capabilities, EA capabilities, the ability to carry 5,000lb bunker buster munitions, the ability to carry >20 SDBs which can take out one target per bomb in one pass(at over 60nm distance), the JSOW/JASSM, etc…
All of the E models are going to be upgraded with new avionics, so how exactly do you think that they’ve reached the top? You still haven’t addressed the variety of weapons, or how the cockpit layout of the Su-34 is awful if you have to tangle with another fighter.
Which one is more suitable for the air to ground role??
I think the SU is more suitable for global missions, which include multiple air refuellings, and hence the comfort on board ( pressurized cabin, toilet, seats that can be reclined to a flat bed ) and the roughness, for which russians aircraft are known, it might be a competitor for upcoming F 15 sale campaigns….
DOes anyone know anything about the avionics in this aircraft??
And a MTOW exceeding 44 tons….wow……
Considering both of them are designed to be used primarily for the air to ground role, I don’t think the original question makes much sense. The question is which one offers the greatest variety of weapons/flexibility.
what ever Isreal do, I would know they wouldnt mind having a couple of Squadrons of GR4’s – it’s the kind of job it could do so well.
They have quite a few F-15Is already.
Maybe the US should reimport F-35A’s from Australia…
I strongly suspect that the folks that are building the aircraft have much better numbers, than folks that are guesstimating.
Everyone’s entitled to their own opinion, but they’re not entitled to their own facts. If eyewitness accounts, BDA, and video analysis isn’t sufficient, then there’s no hope.
Actually when you think about it with a bit of tweaking the missile can be made to ‘home on jam’ which IIRC the Skyflash had in a rather primitive form. If the missile has that capability then trying to jam its radar just makes you an even juicier target.
AMRAAM has HOJ (without any tweaking at all).