plawolfthe rainbow looks PSed. 😉 also, why has the plane got its landing-chute cap open? :confused:
plawolfThe F-7MF uses the double delta wings of the J-7E/J-7G/F-7MG and not from the plain J-7.
The new nose adds weight to the aircraft. To retain the same performance as the J-7E, the Kunlun I or Kunlun II engine has to be used.
There are many logical and logistical reasons that makes the F-7MG sensible—maybe 10 years ago that is.
I guess it would be neat to see it live—but I would like to see it live in a photo to actually believe it. There is certainly no reason for Chengdu not too as there was no secrecy involved in revealing Guizhou’s FTC-2000 prototypes (I like to see a single seater of the FTC-2000 face off the F-7MF.)
Even if Chengdu is building prototypes for experimentation, my guess is that it’s still a private or low budget project, typical of the redundancies practices we have seen with the Chinese defense industry.
To settle the performance issue of the F-7MF vs. FC-1, maybe they should do a face off, then involve J-10s, J-7Gs, FTC-2000s into the mix.
well we only know of the model, so it is possible that the plain J7 wings are used to cut costs and time, even if the new double delta wings are used, its not that much of an addition.
the new engine can also be optional if the customer is willing a accept a slight decrease in agility compaired to the MG/E.
but i will agree with u that we should probably see it first before we get too carried away, just in case its another false alarm.
plawolfwell its got the payload for it, but the wings well probably need to be reinforced to support the load, or better yet, if they can somehow squeeze one of the missiles in between the intakes, then they can hang drop tanks on the wings to give it more range without needing AA refueling.
plawolfdrink too many right before take off in the MKK or MKI for a 12 hour mission. 😮 How many air-refuellings by that and visting what? :diablo:
it might not be that relevent to the IAF since they got carriers, but if trouble ever brued in the south china sea, PLAAF/PLANAF MKK pilots might well find themselves on 10, 12 hour missions to provide air support for any PLAN task group (provided the PLAN doesnt get an opperational carrier by then), which is why i think the PLAN should have went for the Su32/34 instead of the MK2.
plawolfwell, it applears ‘china air forces’ is what the chinese mags use, but i still dont like it. 🙁 u guys are going to think im spliting hairs here, maybe i am, but i just really cant see the point of them doing that.
fair enough the companies might want to add it to their models and CGIs as they will want to export the planes, what why the hell would a chinese mainland mag, with the vast majority of its readers on the mainland and almost all of whom are chinese, want to put ‘china air force’ on anything (which really should be ‘chinese air force’ at that, u dont see the Sweds refering to their airforce as the ‘sweden air force’ do u?) ? just seems like mindless copying to me, and frankly i’d expect better if that was the case. :rolleyes:
anyways, plawolf has reached his ranting target for the day, so i’ll stop here. 😉
plawolfjust had a crasy idea, could we be looking at the MF deal the wrong way?
IIRC, a J7’s wings can be removed fairly easily for maintanence, and its butt is purposely built to be easily detachable to allow access to the engines right?
if that is so, then theoretically, the only major difference between an J7MG/G and the J7MF is the main fuselage, and these arent that expensive. so could the MF actually be a major upgrade for PAF’s existing J7s? (and at an extension, anyone currently operating J7s could do the same).
so, for the cost of the new fuselage and radar, the PAF might be able to upgrade as many of its J7s as it sees fit into BVR capable fighters. this should be a fairly cost effective short term solution until the FC1/JF17 is ready for mass production.
if the MF is just a major upgrade of the J7, it could explain how CAC managed to get it flying so quickly (if the reports are true to start with that is), and also it shouldnt pose CAC much production problems or take up much of its capacity, as CAC could easily convert its existing J7 lines to make the MF instead.
the beauty of this deal for the PAF is that CAC probably independently did the bulk of the R&D already, so it shouldnt take that long or that much money to get the thing finished.
CAC benefits by getting some or all of the funds it already put into the MF project back, and also gets a bonus in the form of a ‘mini-FC1’ to offer to those countries that cant even afford the FC1 and so could get more money in that way. and the bucks will really come rolling in if they can pursuade the PLAAF to buy the upgrade for its newer J7s.
the PLAAF also benefits as it now can keep the currrent force structure without having to replace the J7 as its low end fighter, and so can concentrate most of its funds on the likes of J10s, J11s and MKKs. 😎
plawolfThe Su-34 has a toilet, small galley with a microwave (“heating closet”), the pilot seats have a massage function, and there’s enough room to lie down in the space between the seats. I haven’t heard anything about a folding bed.
well i did read the article a couple years back, so i could be wrong on the folding bed thingy. makes little difference really.
plawolfBut when they do, it is always China Air Force. You could see it also on the official PLAAF pilot watches as well.
well i didnt pay much attention to the flying watches, but even looking back at rick’s link, u can clearly see that it says ‘chinESE air force’ on the badge (which uses the right gramma).
this makes me doubt a little as to whether those pics were of real official (ie custome made standard issue) watches or just gift shop stuff.
plawolfHey plawolf,
Your the one question if I’m an Americain, so if you are going to call someone on such a line then expect me or anyother person to jump right back at you.
as i said before, i dont know nor care about the personal history of ppl who post here. as far as im concerned, all that matters is what u write and how u write it.
and quite frankly, ur use of english was rather poor in ur first post, so poor as to create doubt in my mind as to whether u were telling the truth about being american. if u are american, then im sorry for any offence caused, but u really should have put more effort into ur first post.
As for my facts well lets say I was there and been back way to many time that I care to be and if we did decide to attack the Iran we would’nt just use a small scale force.
well, im sorry, but ,’i was there so i know everything about that place’ isnt much of a reason for anything. for example just because i live in the UK dont automatically mean i know all there is to know about england.
if u have a valid reason as to why the US would want to launch an attack on iran considering all the risks and problems, or how they can manage it with its forces stretched as thin as they are, then please, state it and we can dicuss it. otherwise stop wasting space with merely chest beating and flag waving.
As for the UN its a Joke always will be one and thats how I feel about it, remember the reason the first Gulf War end to early was because the UN got cold feet. As a Humanitarian Group they are great but when it come to military well the record speaks for themselfs
Crazymainer
lol, again, showing a complete lack of historical knowledge and/or disregard for the truth.
the UN never ever wanted to annex iraq, it wanted to liberate kuwait and it did so. so there is no justification what so ever in saying the first gulf war ended prematurely, never mind the ‘UN cold feet’ claim.
the US might have had ideas about iraq, but ultimately opted not to go in, because, as GB sr said, ‘the US would be occupying an emencly hostile land with no viable exist strategy.’ which is pretty much where the US finds itself now. and it’ll make two such places if the US decide to go into iran. :rolleyes:
plawolfAlthough not confirmed visually, it is supposed to have a small, probably chemical, toilet.
Talk of ‘bed’ and ‘galleys’ is probably overstating the facilities – makes it sound like an airliner !!
There is enough room for the crew to stand upright – and lie down on the floor between the seats – that’s as far as the ‘bed’ goes !!!
As for galley – I dunno, but at most it would be a small microwave, or coffee-maker, that’s all !!!
The main advantage of the Su-34 over the Su-30 series is the payload/range capability – 8,000kg/4,000km.
Max takeoff weight is 45t – compared to 34-38t of Su-30MKI/K.
It holds a number of payload/height records.
Ken
well, IIRC, there is supposed to be a small folding bed. nothing like the kind some of u may have in your living rooms, probably just a tiny metal frame with a pizza thin matress and blanket to be ‘deployed’ behind the seats.
there is also a small microwave and a small cuboard storing a couple of microwave dinners, drinks and whatever else the crew can smuggle on board.
i could be wrong, but i seem to remeber reading somewhat about the Su34 also being faster then a flanker.
as for the flanlker’s superios agility. well thats only in AA combat load remeber. strap a couple of big arsed russian AGMs on them and i doubt any flanker will be able to out manover a fulback with the same load.
we are also talking about the russian air force here. even with its funding problems, the russians still have more then enough pure AA fulcrums and flankers to sweep any probably opponent out of the skies before they send in the strikers. so the agility of the fullback is most likely geared towards dogging SAMs as opposed to dogfighting with enemy CAP.
plawolfFirst I’m American I live in the State of Maine, and I’m a Vet of the first Desert War second I’m still work for the DoD on occasions.
As for the Dept question the United States never forgave any of the War dept. from WWII why do you think most of the ships that have been found in the Northern Rusian Convoy routes haven’t been touch it aint because of the depth beleive me we can recover stuff that deep. Why because the US claims ownership due to non-payment.
Now plawolf you have alot to talk about when it comes facts. So might I suggest you back off since you have No idea who the Bloody Hell I am. i suggest you go over to the Historical Forum and read some of my post or better yet go to the Warbird Resource group and you might learn a thing or two Mate.
Crazymainer
i aint interested in the personal history of anyone on this board, i just react to what i see being written, and thus far i have seen little from u that even reseambles being logical and well thought out.
get a problem with that? then think a little more and write better in the future. 😉
plawolfI’m surprised at you Plawolf. China Air Force is the translation for Zhongguo Kongjun on the magazine. As far as the use of English, even the logo for the 1st Division uses English.
:confused:
well of course i know what ‘chinese air force’ is translated from, but PLAAF is the offical designation for the chinese air force. quite frankly, i prefer ‘chinese air force’, but thats how the powers that be have decided to name the air force.
as for the use of english writting on PLAAF jets. well i havent had the opportunity to see all the new unit badgets yet, but even when english is used, it is used in conjuction with chinese, with chinese being the prodomonent language, and as far as i can remeber, the PLAAF rearly put writting on their planes at all.
plawolf‘everytime’ by brittney spires. 😮
funny, since thats about the only song by her that i can actually listen to without cringing. :rolleyes:
plawolfas far as i can remeber, the Su34 has greater range and payload capacity then any other flanker (all that extra fuel and supports in the airframe is in part what hinders its agility).
the Su34 also has a substantual RCS advanatge over the original flankers in that its designed with RSC reduction in mind. which is a big plus if the russians are going to use it as a mini-blackjack as i suspect, in conjunction with its tactical strike roles.
its side-by-side cockpit is also thought to be much more suitable for the kind of long-range long-duration missions its design to fly. (the B52 originally had a tandom cockpit, but was changed to the current config after the USAF specifically asked for it). and then there’s also the toilet, microwave and mini-bed, which all help to greatly reduce fatige of the crew. just imagine having a drink too many right before take off in the MKK or MKI for a 12 hour mission. 😮
plawolfA look at a future super-sized transport for the PLAAF. From a mainland science mag.
its kinda funny and sad the kind of gaffs these respectable chinese mags make sometimes. :rolleyes:
they have the PLAAF badge on the wing and tail, yet have ‘china air force’ in english on the side (which really should be ‘chinese air force’ at that). think they might be trying to make a political message? :diablo:
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