Well I think she might of had some fresh paint on the hull but then again that could be the poor picture quality.
After that if you look carefully she has tow lines up font so I would say they are just repositioning in the yard maybe even dragging back into dry dock to outfit props and rudders as well as give her hull a further coat of paint.
Video won’t load.
Edit
Does now…a billion chinese must be trying to access it!
Ah well I was looking at what was available in the 90’s Swerve.
Looking at the 737 classic and A320 vs the 757 then I would say the latter type was more suitable. Remember the 757 was only pulled when the 737-900 became available.
I did consider a310 and 767 as well but to go to a wide body is a significant size and cost jump. I would think 757 is roomy enough but I agree a310 might of been interesting. Also over 1050 757 were built so they were not that unique in compaarison to Nimrod…
err, why would ditching in the seas be a factor ? it’s not a seaplane ?
sorry if I misunderstood your point.
Ahhh let me rephrase that…:D
Crashing in the sea!
I believe the RAF felt that an ASW type would have a higher risk of ditching/crashing in the sea. More then likely due to the level nature of operations and risk of enemy fire etc… Apparently podded engines are more problematic whilst trying to ditch/crash. Frankly I agree with F-111buff26 its a silly reason when you consider the benefits of a civil airliner.
It took some hunting but here is the only picture I can find of the Boeing 757 based proposal for the 1980 P3 replacement program. Eventually won by Lockheed with a revised P3 design then cancelled.
To add to the previous post Bae partnered with Boeing could of used much of the structural planning already developed for the LRAACA program. Add in Searchwater2000 as well as the Boeing mission system and aircraft would probably of been in service right now. How much would a green 757 airframe off the production line cost in comparison with the Nimrod rebuild? To extend the thinking even further the 757 would of been the perfect replacement for the VC-10 in the tanker transport role, just imagine how much money could of been of saved over the years instead of running a unique British civil airline type!

Personally I do feel that Bae should of looked at some more airframe options back in the 90’s when the contract was up.
I do realise that the RAF regarded an aircraft with podded engines as less then ideal when ditching in the sea but I think that should of been weighed against the logistic and cost savings of picking a more common civil airliner type.
Even if they had built new build Nimrod we are still talking about a unique design. Civil airliners allow you tap into a huge spares and support infrastructure globally.
Personally I think that looking at what was available to Bae during the 90’s the Boeing 757 might well of been a good platform. Good range and payload capabilities including ETOPS and British Engines to keep people happy. Boeing would of been happy as well as it would of given them a possible future P3 replacement.
Try and visualise a 757 with a Nimrod style lower fuselage and MAD boom. Also it would of been a perfect descrete replacement for the Nimrod R1. They could of even contracted some support out to British Airways who were already operating the type.
There was no plan to export after SDSR!
A case of scrap em quick to save government blushes!
Actually whilst I’m not a Tory I have a lot of time for Liam Fox! He did the best he could to fight the armed forces corner during the SDSR process. Its the treasury and the previous Labour government who deserve the most beating over this whole mess!
Remember the letter leaked written by Liam Fox, he actually wrote a paragraph about the risk of dropping MRA4 and its capabilities! Transcript below for reference:
Dear David
We are nearing the culmination of the work we promised to deliver on our approach to national security; the NSC meeting tomorrow is a key opportunity to set out the risk and consequences of that work for our NSC colleagues. This is not a letter I am copying to others ahead of tomorrow’s NSC but I wanted to let you know my views, which are shared by my Ministerial colleagues.
Frankly this process is looking less and less defensible as a proper SDSR (Strategic Defence and Strategy Review) and more like a “super CSR” (Comprehensive Spending Review). If it continues on its current trajectory it is likely to have grave political consequences for us, destroying much of the reputation and capital you, and we, have built up in recent years. Party, media, military and the international reaction will be brutal if we do not recognise the dangers and continue to push for such draconian cuts at a time when we are at war. I am very grateful to Peter Ricketts and Jeremy Heywood for the help they have given officials who have worked strenuously to bridge a gap that is, financially and intellectually virtually impossible. I am concerned that we do not have a narrative that we can communicate clearly.
On 22 July the NSC endorsed the ‘Adaptable Britain’ posture because we decided that it was impossible to predict what conflict or global security scenarios may emerge in the years ahead. That meant ensuring the maintenance of generic defence capability across all three environments of land, sea and air – not to mention the emerging asymmetric threats in domains such as cyber and space –with sufficient ability to regenerate capability in the face of these possible future threats were it required.
How do we want to be remembered and judged for our stewardship of national security? We have repeatedly and robustly argued that this is the first duty of Government and we run the risk of having those words thrown back at us if the SDSR fails to reflect that position and act upon it.
I suggest we start tomorrow’s discussion by asking whether we are really prepared to see Defence spending reduced to this level. The impact on capability, particularly in the maritime domain, would be more substantial than one might imagine from the paper.
Our decisions today will limit severely the options available to this and all future governments. The range of operations that we can do today we will simply not be able to do in the future. In particular, it would place at risk:
The reduction in overall surface ship numbers means we will be unable to undertake all the standing commitments (providing a permanent Royal Navy presence in priority regions) we do today. Assuming a presence in UK waters, the Falklands and in support of the deterrent is essential we would have to withdraw our presence in, for example, the Indian Ocean, Caribbean or Gulf.
Deletion of the amphibious shipping (landing docks, helicopter platforms and auxiliaries) will mean that a landed force will be significantly smaller and lighter and deployed without protective vehicles or organic fire. We could not carry out the Sierra Leone operation again.
Deletion of the Nimrod MR4 will limit our ability to deploy maritime forces rapidly into high-threat areas, increase the risk to the Deterrent, compromise maritime CT (counter terrorism), remove long range search and rescue, and delete one element of our Falklands reinforcement plan.
Some risk to civil contingent capability, including but not limited to foot and mouth, fire-fighting strikes, fuel shortages, flu pandemics, Mumbai style attacks and the 2012 Summer Olympics
The potential for the scale of the changes to seriously damage morale across the Armed Forces should not be underestimated. This will be exacerbated by the fact that the changes proposed would follow years of mismanagement by our predecessors. It may also coincide with a period of major challenge (and, in all probability, significant casualties) in Afghanistan.
Even at this stage we should be looking at the strategic and security implications of our decisions. It would be a great pity if, having championed the cause of our Armed Forces and set up the innovation of the NSC, we simply produced a cuts package. Cuts there will have to be. Coherence, we cannot do without, if there is to be any chance of a credible narrative.
Yours
Liam Fox
Just been watching the 6 o clock news on the BBC, there was an interview with the Minister of Defence Liam Fox who made the usual points about MRA4 being late and over budget. He did let slip an interesting thing in that if the capabilty is found to be needed in the future something else WILL be purchased from elsewhere.
In other words off the shelf purchase of a proven type. Also some face saving back tracking.
If the Army thinks its going to get lots of funding post Afghanistan to replace equipment they will have a fight on their hand from the other services.
The opinion in the RAF and Navy is the Army have avoided large cuts due to Afghanistan and it will be their turn to suffer some deep reductions post 2015.
Certainly the draw down of the BAOR and heavy equipment which the army has fought against during the SDSR. Also the retirment of the hodge-podge of different equipment purchased under UORs.
The simple answer is no!
India has already stated that it might well take further options on the P8I they have ordered.
A319 solution would be interesting but as France intends to keep her Atlantique going for the moment its going to be a more costly option then P8.
The fact is the government is not going to buy any replacement if at all for the next few years as they don’t want to be seen scrapping perfectly good aircraft one day then buying different ones the next. Its capabilty gap for the moment! Also we have to ask some questions about who should operate such a type, by the time a replacement is purchased any RAF personnel with any experience will be long gone leaving only the Royal navy Merlin community. There is a strong argument as it is so needed for Royal Navy operations that the Fleet Air Arm operate any future replacement – not that the RAF will see it that way!
Well it then comes down to inferior and massively inferior!
The UK could do the same as Norway and life extend some P3 but it would mean taking some VERY old airframes from AMARG then putting them through a life extension and systems upgrade. It would still give a platform significantly inferior to Poseidon and Nimrod MR2 for that matter. It would only be useful closer into shore and if your going to do that then you might as well buy a smaller mpa. The RAF likes the high speed transit capability and range of a jet.
No point transfering anything from MRA4 onto Poseidon you want to keep them as close to US models as possible to keep costs down. Maybe Stingray integration and the MAD boom like Indian P8I.
So is Poseidon a more expensive option: Yes.
But if you want a jet capabilty then its the only option and with a massive USN purchase not as costly as one might think especially as it is based on the ubiquitous 737. Also I think Boeing would offer a similar turnkey maintenance package as already offered with the C17 Gloabmaster which should hold down some costs.
Give me the choice and I would want Nimrod MRA4 but as that is out of the picture new P8 Poseidon would be my choice over old P3.
Interesting report in the Telegraph about the capabilty gap now Nimrod is gone:
This paragraph is particularly interesting:
Privately, it is understood that senior RAF officers believe the strategic spending review has caused “untold damage” to Britain’s defences. The Telegraph has also learnt that very senior military chiefs have written privately to defence industry figures to begin looking at replacing the Nimrods in three years’ time. A likely replacement would probably be an inferior American aircraft.
That would mean P8 Poseidon probably taken from USN production slots similar to what was done with the C17. Also built to US spec (except maybe MAD boom in line with the Indian examples) and utilising USN training resources. I would also expect Boeing offering a very similar support solution to what they run with the RAF C17. Not as good as MRA4 but better then nothing and you buy into the cost savings of a huge USN purchase.
Actually I would second that!
Remember Key Publishing is a UK based company with all our wonderful:rolleyes:liable laws!
Might be better to be a bit careful when it comes to commenting about this guy…