GOKONEI’m late into this one Howard but I thought we had a number of thoughts to move this 4-5 years ago when some sellers said it was too cold in the hangar for a number of sellers while there were concerns about visitors also.
It might have been that other events were planned back then or there were clashes but when we used to start a season in the 90’s the first event was Shoreham which was always at the end of March, and to move into April gives us a better chance of having warmer and brighter weather, so if we can keep to this kind of date it will definitely help the event.
Its a shame we can’t meet sooner to kick off the new season but that’s the UK weather for you. Good to hear that the Holland seller is aware of the change too.
GOKONEXD875 COCKPIT MOVE
Is this correct? I can’t find any online update from HAM that it has moved from there. If it has then it may have gone to join the owner’s Vulcan cockpit that used to be at Brunty. This was the one that memorably had a tow through a small river by a tractor a year or so ago as posted online to get it to a museum/airfield where there was a show going on at the time. I think it stopped there after and wondering if it was Carlisle.
GOKONEI’m sure there are Brooklands pics online (not on the website from what I’ve seen though) that have an upward view into the top of the canopy which has circular rails below it. Attached to these may be those stopper items, they’re not very good res though if I remember right – the interior pics, about 4 in all smay be on a general Google search.
GOKONEWoz thinkin’ of ya Bill! I’d like to but I used up my pic allocation ages ago, will post on FB instead soonest, will also send you some by e-mail. Scorching weather, hottest I can remember, had to stay in a bit on Sunday, bottom of legs were getting stung walking around in the sun. Inside the hangar the model makers had some great examples including some for sale, got myself a lovely Harrier GR1 to go with my Falklands 35th display. Mike Esky did another great powered display, a new older exhibitor had some fine models and history of RAF launches/fast boats too, some of them working examples. A Falklands flying suit with the name patch of Dave Foulger, described as one of the ‘greats’ of AAR in a publication I read before the show, was also admired including its 55 Sqn Crest and ’55 Tankers’ patches.
Another striking ‘Rusky’ helmet display and related themed items from A&T Heathcote impressed as ever, as did the lady who won one of the prizes with the land army displays and seems to have expanded her displays by at least a third this year, really impressive. Scott Bouchard’s ‘Chariots of Fire’ idea had visitors listening to the song over helmet headphones just as the XM607 crew would have heard it after the bombing of the runway. Good to see Bill back too as a visitor, who also tried the cloth helmet on to listen to the music.
Dominie was well fitted out inside with lovely livery, in the heat I wondered if some of the decals might peel off some of the cockpits! Sea King looked very striking being such a large lump and has an impressive new door fitted already, one to look out for at future shows on its internal restoration. Phantom colour scheme was a very nice change and the Scimitar looks as impressive as ever. Beginnings of an Auster will grow by next year too and the 2 well-finished Slingsby Cadet glider cockpits from Aeroventure were unexpected arrivals along with an impressive wheels-on Chippy fuselage.
Back in the hangar the ‘walk-in’ Sea Hawk cockpit has grown a bit too while the related control column displays with it were as impressive as ever, including a few new items including the tilt-rotor U.S. thingy that i don’t have time to look up. We were the last to leave at 5.00pm as ever and hope Mike Esky got home OK with the fin on his roof! Osprey! (tilt-rotor).
GOKONEGlad to hear no one got hurt, the problematic Valiant spec was DTD683 – is this of that composition or is it just plain magnesium?
GOKONEPOPHAM 2017
Anyone attending? I know it’s been deminishing every year & every year I say I won’t go next year, but as I’m off work I suppose I may as well lol
Black Knight, are you a long way from home? Do you wanna be free to be me? We’ll be going anyway, if only for old times sake, we have a great laugh over the three days we go for and the Red Fort in Overton is a fave after/during. There are still some bargains to be had regardless of the lessened aero presence and its a chance to get some fresher air than in London. Plenty of cheap cutting discs, gaffer tape, magnet pick ups, cheap tools, gloves etc too, to get in for the restoration season.
GOKONEFEST PROPOSED LAYOUT / SECURITY
Thx for layout Howard, I can’t see any issues with security as if I did bring a cockpit I’d still go and sleep in my van away from it the way I always do while I’ve never heard of any theft issues after dark at the Fest – though someone at a Fest did take a switch or something like that from one of AeroV’s Meteor’s a few years back during the day, which was unfortunate.
In recent years the stretched out nature of the Fest along with intermingled kit for sale was one of the things that made it more of a carnival with a relaxed approach that everyone liked I think. In recent times its been more structured while this arrangement is very structured – atmosphere issues aside, my main concern here though is that due to the concentrating of everything it gives the Fest less presence AROUND the museum – and to show the public from the outset thereby, that its a special event weekend – Tony’s aerial flags when he had the Scimitar section up by the shop for example were a useful draw to show people that a special event was on.
There’s certainly no harm in trying it however though based on previous reductions in the more ‘carnival’ approach I mentioned earlier I think it will prove to be that the event isn’t spread around the museum enough – which also conveys the added impression of course of making it appear bigger in scope to visitors. Is the Ashton planned to move somewhere else when finished?
If it can be moved elsewhere at some point then the ‘Alley’ can be unpinched again for other Fests perhaps – I do think this area is important to the Fest as it is an avenue of displays that entices people in and looks attractive, and at present as the museum entrance is here, that would seem to indicate a need to have some cockpits there as a draw. If not, even two aerial flags either side of the vehicle entrance would encourage the perception of a special event – you could even put a cheese toastie on one of ’em..
GOKONEGood to be back Hugh, yes its a trek for many people but plenty of them seemed happy with the bits they had, while it was good to see further progress since the last visit including the astonishing transformation of the former jaguar skeleton that was formerly at Gatwick Aviation Museum. Well organised and with helpful staff, the weather stayed sunny as an added bonus with some Moths doing their thing outside also.
GOKONEWhy would you keep it? Besides adding to it with other related displays, posters and memorabilia I would say clearly because it was THE turning point in the early part of the war – but chiefly, because as Churchill said before it began, “Upon this battle depends the survival of Christian civilization…” –
You can’t get a more crucial reason for a display that that. I would say that it distinguishes it as something that should be kept together as it is the reason why we are all here today uploading. The development of other aspects of RAF history should wait or be planned elsewhere – when talking of immediacy and the need to engage with people of today that is all very well, but perhaps its up to more designers to make the BoB displays more revamped and fresh in their appeal. Its importance cannot be overstated.
GOKONECouldn’t agree more Tony, I’ve spent many visits there and its a totally unique display to see examples of types that were in the battle in one major hall – HOW could that not be a major learning experience that makes (dare I say it) sense for both adults and kids to learn from? Many museums would give a lot to have such a major one-off display and some of the other crits in the past like swapping original items off for repro ones haven’t helped. This BoB Hall though is a major loss to people and I’m not interested in seeing a revise display in a helter/skelter-ice-cream cone that just indulges an architect for a nice fat fee.
Its similar to the disgraceful clear-out of major civil and navy ship models from the National Maritime Museum that we could see for free when were kids, we now have to go to Chatham and in some cases pay to see them – a total loss to local people in Greenwich and the Isle of Dogs with so much local history of shipbuilding and of seeing these unique items in this national museum that has gone over too much to families and pirate play rooms- “We don’t do that anymore” I was told after complaining and asking what had happened to so many displays lost to the area today.
GOKONEOUT STILL FOR ME…
Apparently not Charlie – they’ve been dismayed by the unexpected proportion of Brexiters who have been appearing on expensive sites set up to promote staying in – a lot of the ‘out’ comments were also culled and posted up on a well-known newspaper some weeks ago. If we stay then I hope its for the right reasons though there are too many against I feel – how can you hope to reform something which is so patently dishonest and corrupt since inception? Its no different to FIFA.
Do you want to be dictated to or do you want to decide your own destiny instead of being coerced by a plan which as we have seen, carries on deliberately adding other countries and complexity into the equation (like Greece and others that shouldn’t even be in it), other than to get a financial leg up? “One size fits all” is a powder keg philosophy.
I couldn’t cover everything (though I had a go) and economically I’ve nothing against migrants coming here as long as we need them Bruce, though exploiters do cause offence or those who won’t accept our way of life. We’ve benefitted over centuries by immigration (I’m one myself as begun in the 1850’s) and a report last year pointed out that today’s settlers have contributed greatly to the exchequer while more migrants come from Commonwealth countries – as long as they have jobs and as long as they don’t have criminal records or spoil the chances of jobs for existing inhabitants then that’s fine – but illegals and poorly-vetted people are a major concern I’m afraid and no foreign murderers, rapists or child molesters should remain here. And if 4 out of 5 migrants are getting jobs here now (regardless of how wanted the jobs are) then the lowering of wages caused by such an influx isn’t helpful for all concerned, when this is an increasingly expensive country to live in.
Quality-wise even IF the wheat is sorted from the chaff of settlers coming here legally, it wonders me where they get to live when we can’t build enough housing for people here already, with 6 out of 10 youngsters being forced out of London alone due to unaffordable rents. I was a Landlord to hard-working Spanish people for 7 years who worked very unsocial hours at a Docklands Hotel, whereby I always charged them a cheaper rate than other people in the area to help them – they weren’t work-shy and I helped them as much as I could, which they were naturally very grateful for. That kind of help dosen’t happen much today though I would suggest.
Our growth areas are education and financial services. The financial services brings in billions and today in the EU, British financial institutions are still blocked and barred in certain financial areas in Germany and France from free trading in their financial markets, let’s face it 30 years in the EU is clearly not enough time to sort that one out.
In conclusion, we are restricted by red tape and bureaucracy in law and trade. We are now controlled. We can’t do what we want to do. We can’t trade in high growth areas around the world, to make our own trade deals, for Britain to prosper and develop. It is higher risk to remain in the EU because we do not have control over our borders, we cannot plan the number of people entering the country, to budget properly for our school systems and the demands on NHS and infrastructure we have today.
Vote REMAIN – If you want to be an EU citizen, to be in a state of Europe, to ironically let Europe have control over our borders, our laws and governance. Choose REMAIN, if you want Britain to be wrapped in chains, told what to do and how to do it. You are not allowed to make your own trade deals, and run your business or life in that way, it can only be what the overpaid EU meddlers say. You are not allowed to undercut or be more competitive than European businesses. If you like a much bigger government made up of lots of foreign and unelected ministers, if you like being controlled and if you think Greek officials have your interests in mind, then vote REMAIN.
Vote LEAVE – If you want to be a British citizen first, and second to be a member of the EU. Vote LEAVE if you do not want to be a subservient country. Vote LEAVE to have control.
It is fact that the EU has been too restrictive, makes poorly considered decisions while deliberately poisoning us with red tape and interfering in all aspects of our lives right down to things like electrical goods and light bulbs (when this is a depressing enough country in winter as it is), and God knows what is going to happen to aviation directives on heritage and collecting in the years ahead here alone. Outside of this though, I do take great offence at America’s presumption to tell us what to do – I don’t care if its historical, its so basic that I find it too angering – we live here, America doesn’t, and something as fundamental as this shouldn’t involve leaning on us and our greater sense of democracy.
I vote to LEAVE … To have FREEDOM.
GOKONEBREXIT – LET”S STAND UP AND BE A COUNTRY AGAIN & TRADE WITH THE WORLD
We’ve seen our fishing fleets eroded and haulage firms at severe disadvantage alone, while EU lorries come over here loaded on cheaper fuel, while enough have been uninsured and caused accidents. And they now want control of our coast, our waters AND our rescue services. We helped free these peoples, and now they have caused their own downfall in a protected economic ward which has goods 20% higher than they should be, while the disastrous ‘Open Borders’ has proved itself the disaster it always was.
Close Open Borders and increase our Freedom. OPEN BORDERS DO NOT WORK • It has been a disaster for Europe • Cross-border security ruined • Citizens safety compromised • No one HERE voted for such failure EU: THINK before you legislate, EU!
We’re a far smaller country than France alone, and our social services are already over-run by EU AND Commonwealth migrants since Labour’s disasterous ‘Social Experiment’ before the EU hordes began coming over here demanding money, while we can’t build enough homes for our indigenous people.
And the ‘Experts’ line up to threaten us – as Barack tells the world’s 2nd oldest democracy to give up its sovereignty to the EU, to act as America’s mouthpiece. Would he give up AMERICA’s? To the ‘back of the queue’ yourself sir!
Its due to the UK’s ‘close’ ties with the U.S. that O’Bama wants us in to push U.S. interests. Does he want to contribute towards the £350m P.W. it costs us in this economic dictatorship then? Don’t threaten us with trade sanctions like the French P.M. Barack, we take a dim view of people who threaten our country. The Treasury has already had to do some creative accounting for our supposed 2% of GDP defence budget – how can we afford both?
AND IF O’BAMA WANTS US TO LEAVE OUR BORDERS OPEN TO MILLIONS OF UNWANTED WELFARE SEEKERS…… WHEN will he scrap his fencing along the Mexicdan border and let all those people after a better life (as well as those smuggling its illegal narcotics) into HIS country? He talks about the linkage of U.S. WW2 GI’s buried in Europe, but they died to save it and democracy- not the EU.
CAMERON
What did this man’s claimed negotiating ‘skills’ win for Britain? Nothing but rubbish and contempt from EU wags! And its not even ratified and could be cancelled later.
Thanks for allowing us to VOTE on it all those years ago Tony: How are the after-dinner speeches coming along? Look on the brigfht side though – More commissions for Human Rights Cherie! How is the property portfolio coming along these days dear?
HOLLANDE
And Hollande tells the world’s 2nd oldest democracy also, “I don’t want to scare you, I just want to say the truth – there will be consequences” re a Brexit. Is HE scared, or are you? A failed French politician who never delivered his promises on rising to power – who’s scared of losing a £350m PW membership bonanza then? Au revoir, Mr Hollande.
In 2015 the UK made up 11 per cent of the EU population, but only 4.3 per cent of EU Commission employees. Do they REALLY want US or our £350M pw membership money? Their treatment of us alone suggests they despise us.
“• Our European Union is not in a good state. • There is not enough Europe in this Union. • And there is not enough Union in this Union” – Jean-Claude Juncker, 2015 President of the European Commission.
You CANNOT stop terrorism by restricting legal gun ownership. It only makes matters worse and impacts badly on heritage interests, museums and private collectors. EU: THINK before you knee-jerk!
MARK CARNEY WARNS BREXIT BAD FOR LONDON !
Well he would do, wouldn’t he? George Osborne hired him for the Bank of England job and pays his wages along with a considerable accommodation allowance. As soon as his contract ends he’ll be off back to Canada presumably with a healthy bank balance and no worries about the UK anymore. Like O’Bama after he comes over asking us to stay in a EU which needs massive changes before we can properly vote on it anyway. Once back in, the corruption and loss of our sovereignty and borders and membership billions will continue.
BREXIT BY BORIS:
“H.M. Treasury of course were the people who said we should stay in the exchange rate mechanism, and along with the economic benefits they also claimed of staying it it, both turned out to be a complete disaster.”
DESPERATE GOVT TACTICS TO STOP BREXIT
A govt spokeswoman actually said in a statement on the radio that we will be “permanantly poorer” by staying out, emphasising it in a really deliberate manner, when quoting a sum of £4,300 that we’ll all be down on, on leaving –
BUT THAT’S BY 2030, 14 YEARS FROM NOW!
Wouldn’t you think we’ll have just a few trade agreements in place by then? As an an outside trader like Norway? Along with the BILLIONS we’ll be saving every year?
What Does Turkey have to do with Europe? It seems that military men value the use of Incirlik airbase too highly. Do we want too many of 79M chancers coming here and more beggars on our streets? In 2007 taxpayers in Britain were saddled with a £2.5BN bill to pay benefits to Romanians and Bulgarians who did not migrate to the UK!!! It was Britain’s ‘contribution’ towards a £20BN 6-year funding programme – WHY? And HOW MUCH will the Turks expect us to subsidise them for staying at home?
Romanian families saw their benefits TREBLE. TaxPayers Alliance pointed out that British tax-payers were funding social security payments, instead of helping develop that country’s infrastructure. Does anyone REALLY want to subsidise Albanians also?
IF WE STAY IN, HOW MANY TURKS ALONE?
Did Cammo agree anything on numbers when Turkey (God help us) is allowed to join the EU? He couldn’t, the EU won’t let him. 70M people will become eligible to come to the UK – sure many will stay, but too many will come and the usual over-run of social services and crimes will result as the Govt will under-estimate numbers as in the last 10 years.
How will they be screened for violent and sexual crime and refused entry? Will criminals be DEPORTED ON CONVICTION? We’ve seen enough horror posts of foreign UBER driver rapists and pedestrian killers alone. Some hot climates have totaly different mindsets to life, law and order and violence, and we have enough indigenous hot-heads over here already – importing more from hot countries with their lousy attitudes to women on top isn’t wanted by the UK tax-payer
If Cameron cares that much about a “flexible, adaptable and open European Union” ‘…Then he could start by being honest about what’s actually at stake’. Frances Robinson, New Stateman
THE WARNINGS CONTINUE- Cameron – War, plague & pestilence (he left out the 4 Horsemen of the Apocalypse). Osborne: Claims a property slump on a Brexit – at the rate affordable homes are being built? WRONG George – but if so, great, a slump in house prices will make them more affordable and less attractive to overseas buyers.
£9M spent on 27 Million booklets about staying in the EU? And yet we can’t even give our doctors & nurses a good deal while building refurbs needed to NHS buildings total over £1BN.
MIGRATION FIGURES ‘MAY BE HIGHER’? YOU DON’T SAY?
For ‘MAY’ read ‘DEFINITELY’ if they are government figures
It seems that like Labour, the Tories have difficulty accounting for all unwanteds caught arriving here uninvited.
• National Insurance numbers used by EU citizens will be published in May ahead of the EU referendum.
• Meanwhile Culture Sec John Whittingdale claims that official figures suggesting 257,000 migrants arrived in 2015 are looking to be out a bit – as no less than 630,000 NI numbers were issued to EU citizens!
HUMAN RIGHTS FIASCO & INSULT TO BRITISH TAX-PAYERS:
LET’S JUST LET FOREIGN KILLERS & RAPISTS CARRY ON…
It was published this year that EU governments have ‘no specific need’ to update one another on their foreign killers and rapists when they are allowed to go traipsing about from country to country killing and raping people. The mix includes Jamaicans, Congolese and Sudanese.
• 98 have convictions for crimes such as child sex abuse, murder and rape. Among these, 10 are murderers and 48 are rapists, including 8 who raped children and 10 who committed other paedophile crimes. Their numbers soared by a fifth in the past year. • Most appeal against deportation under human rights and their ‘right to a family life’.
• WHO would marry this excrement and have a family? Any idea Cherie?
WHAT DOES UK WANT?
The RIGHT to govern ourselves & make our own laws / Trading Partners / Business Colleagues / Friends
We had this before the EU AND military co-operation with NATO – which can still continue! And WHY would the EU NOT co-operate on terrorism when it is a basic?
Maternity care in the NHS will continue SOARING for as long as successive govts allow it – but surely their EU inaction and lousy UK Border Agency (so bad it was renamed) has overloaded our social services enough and given us enough worker bees NOW, to do future jobs for us as we (supposedly) live longer?
Cameron left out far too much ‘fine detail’ when he negotiated his EU ‘settlement’ terms recently. I still want out of the EU.
The UK has around 800 years MORE experience of democracy and self-government than the U.S. – I like to think we value it just a bit more than O’Bama.
GOKONEIf its Strike Command Victor or Vulcan Servicing School then what does the ‘T’ stand for?
GOKONESTCVSS sounds nasty, I hope they find a cure.
GOKONEYou would have thought they WERE for some other motive given the more sensible measures that I outlined – yes charities notably lose out badly who need every penny they can get, and the seaside towns and others who need such spend from shows will suffer regress. But the loss to the exchequer of income and VAT tax is also allied to the potential to send many people supporting such established events to the wall, or suffer drastic drops in living standards. This does cause the thought that for some unknown reason the air-show scene has been targeted despite the major effects it will now cause so many people to suffer – once again, we see that we’re not ‘all in it together’.
Sign In
