AEROBOOTS AND THE ONLINE AGE

I’m just playing the Devils Advocate here but…what is ‘The Hobby’..? If folks are interested in ‘Historic Aviation’…then books today are absurdly cheap. There are tons of them at jumble sales, in charity bookshops.
If ‘The Hobby’ means collecting items which are a finite source (Whatever they may be.)…then of course, over time, the prices will escalate. Collecting rare items cannot be popular and cheap….things don’t operate that way in the real world.:)

The problem is it isn’t down just down to finity and books – crucially items of essential hardware like kit & instrumentation, many of which are still reasonably available and usually bought at aeroboots or privately at sensible prices, are being adversely affected by silly dealer demands as some copyists are inspired by commercial concerns with their ramping up of prices. Collectors understand that commercial dealers have to make a living, it has always been the degree that they wish to apply commercial rates however, for items like guages, seats, control boxes etc besides absurd prices for whole aircraft.

Collectors & Grass-Roots people AND any potential NEWCOMERS who need affordable projects to always use aeroboots as well as for the networking aspects. We won’t pay £25 + P&P for a thrust guage that we can get for £5 at a boot. The V.A. has actively supported aeroboots for many years after seeing the dangers long ago that still threaten the hobby today.

It could get to the point whereby ever-changing technologies throw new streams of collecting, that older generations will just sell to themselves before passing on and what will our youth be left with – they can’t get onto the housing ladder as it is and it will be a sad day if it gets too elitist and aimed at the higher end of the market as some dealers attempt to carve out new affluent clients and look further afield than UK shores.

Yes, some items of aviation collecting are more specialist and in relation to WW1 / WW2, but crazy prices on jet items have been causing concerns and unhealthy market distortions for a good number of years iif this area pf the hobby is to remain affordable to ensure that our aviation history has a renewable source of private custodianship.

A good number of us warned of this at the time prices started spiralling on the web with some knock-ons being felt soon after – its annoying and sad seeing pimped velvet-cushioned ejector ‘gaming’ seats being advertised with silly demands for example, regardless of whether or not ‘you pays your money….etc’ .

Niche dealers can be seen at our aeroboots because they see it as a way of making easy money further down the line as they will re-stock where possible and sit on it with their higher mark-ups on their eBay shops – we just have to beat them to it where we can and do our own deals – for unlike dealers who don’t care about their survival, we need aeroboots more than ever, regardless of matters such as dwindling stocks.

One old contact said this week that “It could all actually blow up in their faces one day…..ie no new blood, no new interest, no business.” This might encourage further casts of the net abroad however and for one-off big money items as smaller items dwindle or are not worth eBays silly fees and charges.

At the time, we expected that the Battle of the Boots with eBay was about to begin. Upon this battle still depends today, the survival of affordable aviation collecting. Upon it depends our networking, and the long continuity of our swaps, private deals and beer drinking. We have felt the whole fury and might of the chancing dealer being turned on us. They know that they will have to break us in this island or lose the war. If we can stand up to them, specific areas of aviation collecting and heritage may remain affordable and the life of British and Empire preservation may move forward into broad, sunlit uplands.

But if we fail, then the whole collecting sphere, including the United States, including all that we have known and cared for, will sink into the abyss of a new dark age made more sinister, and perhaps more protracted, by the lights of perverted mark ups. Let us therefore brace ourselves to our duties, and so bear ourselves, that if the Aeroboot and Cockpit Fest last for a thousand years, men will still say, This was their finest hour.

For once they stop everyone will miss them, preservation will diminish and many will turn to other pastimes and the healthy increasing interaction of private collectors with museums will also diminish. Here are some attachments for the furtherance thereof. My image allowance was red-lining last time I looked sadly so I’ve tried to reduce them to the lowest jpeg possible. Yes it did take most of the afternoon, yes I’m hungry, but I have some beans on toast ready when I get home… Farewell Aerobooters of the Empire 😉

Keeping the ‘Bilia Going

The Wellington cross section from memory was £50, a decent chunk at a very rough guess 70cm x 40cm. The seller may be a forum member?.

Yes I am a member but I was also with James who normally has a big van and square covered pitch with lots of space outside it too at Popham, selling lots of varied stuff besides aviation bits. I sold the Wellington bit though – I’ll try and find the Facebook link the museum’s photographer mentioned to me they wanted stuff posted to as I don’t have much space left on this Forum and I don’t have time to do comps to save on memory like I often do, so if anyone has it then be good to post it up soonest but I’ll look later.

Festy Countdown Day 3 & Holding

[QUOTE= Plus a few images from last year in the Museum Gallery![/QUOTE]

Hi Howard, just wanted to ask is it because you’re out of space of the museum website re taking the pics of the old Fests down, and will they be posted up again at a later date or have I read it all wrong?

(Still a bit worse for wear and on VitC to avoid the lurgy down here). Liked seeing the old uploaded ones to look back at the last 40 summers (and winters) anyway.

Also had to record here that I sometimes wondered if it might happen one day, and though I didn’t actually meet him, GOKONE saw GOKWAN socializing outside the entrance of Gordon Ramsey’s at W1 on NYE.

He obviously didn’t appreciate the importance of his proximity to his illustrious forebear, and while I doubt if he and his luvvies are into aircraft he could certainly do worse than to come and sample some of the wares of the museum cafe and have a peruse in the shop after – GOK’n’SHOP till you DROP. 😀

CHIPPY COCKPIT

Thanks for the support Anon.

But what realy hurt was being pushed down there to make room for a totaly non aviation item!!

On arrival, I was told that we should have been where the Army lorry was parked, next to anothe DH icon, the 125 cockpit, which would have been great. We know we don’t exactly turn up with world shattering projects each year, but we do work very hard to be there at all.

Still I got my own back!!!!! So next year I will be luck if we are not left outside the gates!!!!!

I’m usually a jet person Rich but I really enjoyed the chippY cockpit you both put together including the personal touches in it, it really looked the part and look forward to seeing it again.

CROP CIRCLE QUERY

[QUOTE=Air Ministry;1901655]Empty van….tick, return trailer to Hire Firm….tick.

Later on, taking a last stroll around the field, I came across a bloke hiding in the bushes. I asked him what he was up to. He said he’s a member of the East Midlands UFO Society and he was keeping vigil. I asked him what had attracted him to the field. He said they’d discovered a large crop circle in the grass with a perfectly formed letter “H” in the centre of it…:eek:

An ‘H’?

Are you sure it wasn’t a large ‘W’ Al? 🙂

COCKPIT FEST 2012…

Less than a month to go now ….eeeeek, so much to do to the Lightning and quickly running out of time!!!
Really looking forward to this and fingers crossed we get some nice weather:cool:

all the best Matt

Its kicking in………

(PS- Can anyone tell me what happens when you get to the end of the red bar regarding all your previous attachments???) 😮

E-BAY ITEMS UPDATE

Garry,

The big point is this – that while you didnt mention the company by name, you picked on items that they were selling, and that would be well known.

To say they were hopping mad would be an understatement.

This thread is for the discussion of items being sold on ebay, and not a discussion on their prices.

If companies (including mine) can make a living on ebay by selling items at whatever price they see fit, then that is entirely up to them. In these difficult times, it is hard enough to make a living without having people sniping at us from the sidelines. If you don’t want to pay the prices, then by all means dont, but please dont tell others not to do so.

Bruce

Hi Bruce,

Thx for the reply. I’m sorry for the problem this originally caused, but my naming of certain items were prompted by a number of things-

If it was a newspaper that had posted the original comment then I considered that any report might just mention costs for certain items offered on e-bay being regarded as high by many preservationists and other observers in aviation, while covering hopefully both sides of the story besides getting feedback on them. I appreciate this dosen’t seem realistic on a forum however.

It was also due to comment that has cropped up regularly regarding such items over some years now and I was mindful of some straightforward and frank comments in particular last year, that were posted in relation to a large item that was being sold at that time – I never checked to see if these were deleted subsequently and they may well have been on another site.

I also wrote my comments while being mindful of selling terms and methods that were freely seen by presumably millions of people worldwide over some years, and which I considered had obviously been given by sellers historically, when quoting them in relation to the items. I didn’t realise this couldn’t be commented on with specific reference to the items concerned.

I never considered that having previously advertised seller terms and conditions restated by myself would make any concern hopping mad, as they would not be any different from what had actually been advertised on seller sites previously, while we have all seen the media employed by some concerns in the past so that there has not been any shying away from publicity to achieve a sale when an item has stayed on offer.

Digital comment has been naturally high as a result, though I see now that it has to be restrained on the forum and I’m sorry if the wording came across as bashing due to my comments on costs – its just the concern as to the effect of what are regarded as high costs and the knock-on to preservation and collectors.

We all understand its business but its the degree of what is being demanded by some companies for certain items as buyers struggle to survive like sellers and some costs have caused concern for a number of years now. The future of preservation is in many people’s minds and the point that B.Honeydew made, as to who /what is going to replace us if no one comes along after us due to high costs, was an apt one.

With the national debt making future generations indebted thanks to inept politicians and not enough houses being built alone, its not like any new (potential) collectors will have much money, while high online prices for certain items that drive up expectation will put many lesser players off and they will move onto other things – I wonder what the average member age is in many museums nowadays?

If the subject is unsuitable for this thread then fine also, though this never occurred to me as I was obviously responding to another posted concern about high prices and didn’t know it was meant to be about e-bay finds – so I gave my own opinion on it and I don’t regard the valid concerns originally raised which I responded to as sniping via the examples I mistakenly gave too much detail on originally. I don’t regard this as a happy hunting ground scenario – the concerns raised are important and they will not go away in preservation.

I would contest that if the prices being paid weren’t made that some companies wouldn’t exist, due to some (but not all) of the high sums involved for certain items not being realised in a sale. I like to think that I don’t tell others NOT to buy, I think its fair to be free to say however if some items are thought of and can be alluded to (in general) as being high in cost however, and of course I wasn’t referring to you in the first place.

If no direct comment can be made on a forum as opposed to say, that of an independent press association regarding the concerns I have mentioned, then I will refer to matters like this in an indirect, general and generic fashion in future and on other threads if you still object to this one being used, while remembering not to quote clear cases that many are already familiar with and which are always discussed at aeroboots, other forums and private e-mails.

One other general thing – I’m already hearing that many of those who rely on e-bay to sell a few occasional or minor items are finding the new postal charges unaffordable – a contact reports that “most things cost £2.50 to post now so its loused it up for lots of low-value items that poor people are trying to sell to keep their heads above water”.

Yet another reports frustratingly:”I’ve had more non-payers in the past 3 months than I had in the previous 5 years !!!! What the hell do you do, Buyers have you by the short and curlies and you can’t leave the t—s negative feedback either”.

Regards, G