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Tiger_01

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  • in reply to: Pakistani news, pics and speculation thread #2640678
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    a….

    Pak-French defence cooperation to deepen: President Musharraf
    (Updated at 2200 PST)
    PARIS, FRANCE: President Gen. Pervez Musharraf Wednesday met here with with his French counterpart, Jacques Chirac, at the Elysee palace, which lasted for around 90 minutes.

    While talking with journalists after his meeting with Mr chirac, President Musharraf said his message that during in the meeting a number of global and regional issues came under discussion a consensus was developed on majority of the issues came under the discussion.

    He told that the US-led campaign against terrorism must not be limited to military measures but include action to tackle the social and economic roots of extremism.

    “Pakistan happens to be in the forefront of fighting terrorism. But we see the combat as having two dimensions. One dimension is being applied. This is the fighting and the military aggression to which we are contributing the maximum.

    “However the second dimension does not seem to have started yet. And this second dimension is the real dimension — the strategic dimension — which is addressing the root causes,” he said.

    When asked he believed Osama bin Ladin was still alive but his whereabouts was unknown.

    Replying to question about purchasing of French F-16 fighter planes, the president said: “We would shore up defence cooperation with France in a number of matters.”

    He informed Pakistan itself too was making a jet plane for which many of the equipments needed for their manufacturing were being imported from France.

    “Kashmir issue was also discussed in our meeting and we have outright understanding over this issue like many others”, he stated.

    France believed tension in Middle East would never be overcome until and unless Palestinian issue was resolved, President Musharraf informed.

    President Musharraf also extended offer to Mr Chirac to visit Pakistan which former accepted.

    in reply to: Pakistani news, pics and speculation thread #2640681
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    As usual the Indian empty thetoric. Why does it buy MKI and wants PAF to stay outdated?

    US cautioned by India against Pak F-16 deal
    (Updated at 2145 PST)
    NEW DELHI: India has cautioned the United States against a decision to sell F-16 fighter aircraft to archrival Pakistan, Indian External Affairs Minister Natwar Singh said Wednesday.

    “We have cautioned the US against such a decision,” Singh told Parliament just hours before US Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld was due to arrive for talks with the Indian leadership.

    “We have also conveyed that US arms supply to Pakistan would have a negative impact on the goodwill the United States enjoys in India, particularly as a sister democracy,” he added.

    Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf met US President George Bush last Saturday during which he said he discussed the potential purchase of the F-16 fighters.

    Singh said New Delhi has pointed out that the supply of arms to Pakistan by the United States at a time when the dialogue between the two countries is at a “sensitive stage” would have a “negative impact”.

    Pakistan reportedly wants to buy up to 25 of the F-16s, which cost around 25 million US dollars each, to add another squadron of such planes to its existing fleet.

    Singh termed India’s relations with Pakistan as “accident-prone”.

    “We have therefore to deal with this matter with great restraint, great wisdom (and) patience,” he said. The minister, who was India’s Ambassador to Pakistan during the mid-eighties, said that of late relations had improved

    in reply to: IAF Thread : Dec 2004+ #2641303
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    Do I have to answer that? 😎

    in reply to: FC-1 : The Engine Options #2641308
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    If russia sold Mill military choppers then this engine is just a bluff to get India buying more Russian hardware. With Russian economy and forces being rusty they can use every penny.

    in reply to: Pakistani news, pics and speculation thread #2641319
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    No idea where to post this

    South Asia – AFP

    NEW DELHI (AFP) – US Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld is expected to discuss plans to sell F-16 fighter jets to Pakistan during a meeting with Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh this week, newspapers reported.

    Rumsfeld is scheduled to arrive in the Indian capital late Wednesday and meet with Singh on Thursday morning.

    Rumsfeld will discuss US-India relations with Singh, including arms sales, according to an official familiar with the visit.

    Sales of new weapons that could upset the balance of power in the volatile South Asian region have rankled both countries with Pakistan concerned India could get Patriot missiles and India concerned about possible sales of fighter jets and naval surveillance aircraft to Pakistan, according to the Indian Express newspaper.

    The Patriot, a ground-based missile system that can defend against ballistic missiles, cruise missiles and aircraft, is seen linked to India’s support of a proposed global missile shield, the newspaper said.

    In response, Pakistan may have already asked to buy up to 25 F-16 fighter jets in 2005 when President Pervez Musharraf visited Washington last week and met President George W. Bush (news – web sites).

    The two nuclear-armed countries, which have fought three wars in the past half-century, are in peace talks over the disputed Himalayan state of Kashmir (news – web sites) while developing new medium- and long-range missile systems at the same time.

    in reply to: IAF Thread : Dec 2004+ #2641322
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    South Asia – AFP

    NEW DELHI (AFP) – US Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld is expected to discuss plans to sell F-16 fighter jets to Pakistan during a meeting with Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh this week, newspapers reported.

    Rumsfeld is scheduled to arrive in the Indian capital late Wednesday and meet with Singh on Thursday morning.

    Rumsfeld will discuss US-India relations with Singh, including arms sales, according to an official familiar with the visit.

    Sales of new weapons that could upset the balance of power in the volatile South Asian region have rankled both countries with Pakistan concerned India could get Patriot missiles and India concerned about possible sales of fighter jets and naval surveillance aircraft to Pakistan, according to the Indian Express newspaper.

    The Patriot, a ground-based missile system that can defend against ballistic missiles, cruise missiles and aircraft, is seen linked to India’s support of a proposed global missile shield, the newspaper said.

    In response, Pakistan may have already asked to buy up to 25 F-16 fighter jets in 2005 when President Pervez Musharraf visited Washington last week and met President George W. Bush (news – web sites).

    The two nuclear-armed countries, which have fought three wars in the past half-century, are in peace talks over the disputed Himalayan state of Kashmir (news – web sites) while developing new medium- and long-range missile systems at the same time.

    in reply to: IAF Thread : Dec 2004+ #2641793
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    Buying an Interim Fighter
    Rupak Chattopadyay

    The Indian Air Force (IAF) is in the market for an interim fighter that doesn’t break the budget. Interim fighter purchases are always tricky. If one is not careful, one is likely to end up with unsuitable aircraft, in limited quantities, that needlessly complicate logistics. The paradox of limited budgets and ever increasing responsibilities haunts the IAF. This piece considers the challenges before the IAF and discusses some procurement options.

    What’s the problem?

    Of great concern is the fact that the IAF’s fighter fleet is in danger of block obsolesce in the absence of quick procurement decisions. Of even greater concern are rapidly declining force levels. In the medium and long term, there will be LCAs and Su-30s to plug any deficiencies in the IAF’s force structure. The problem is that in the immediate future large numbers of aircraft are due for retirement. The Type 66, Type 77 and Type 96 MiG-21s are now well past their prime. Indeed these types were due to be withdrawn over a decade ago. The MiG-23s too are beginning to get long in the tooth.

    Over the next five years the IAF will have to replace about six to eight squadron equivalents of MiG-21s. There are no easy solutions, but this provides an opportunity for some creativity and more importantly it provides an opportunity for a comprehensive review of ones force structures and doctrine. In the last five years the combat strength of the IAF has declined from thirty-nine and a half squadrons to thirty-seven and a half squadrons without any appreciable decline in threats. If anything there are glaring holes in the air defense umbrella.

    For the preceding thirty years, the IAF’s qualitative and quantitative superiority provided the bedrock on which India’s conventional posture rested. The IAF fielded enough fighters, of the right vintage, to properly defend both the eastern and western sectors. Over the last decade a proliferation of fourth generation fighter types in the east have rendered the resident Type-77 squadrons obsolete and the MiG-27’s specialized role is certainly a handicap. One isn’t suggesting that the Bangladesh or Myanmar Air Forces are necessarily hostile, but one must take cognizance of their enhanced capabilities. Nor is one suggesting that conflict with China is imminent. But the PLAAF’s changing profile is shifting the balance (if it hasn’t already).

    What solution?

    Once the Type-96s and Type-77s retire there will be a huge gap in the IAF’s force structure. Any replacement should be capable of filling both the quantitative gap and bringing IAF capabilities at par with those of potential adversaries. Keeping in mind that the IAF force structure in the long term is likely to see a high-low mix of multi-role Su-30MKIs and LCAs, what the IAF needs in the interim is a fighter that can be bought in large numbers, is versatile and can be integrated into the service at minimal cost.

    There are several ways in which one can address this, given budgetary constraints. One of course is to purchase second hand aircraft of a type already in service. The Pakistan Air Force has done this with some degree of success with respect to their Mirage III/5 fleet.
    The capital outlay for such purchases is relatively modest. However, there are issues of relatively higher life cycle costs and safety, as the PAF itself is finding out {Libya planes, South African wings, local products}. Another option is to replace manned aircraft with Unmanned Aerial Vehicles (UAVs) in some roles. This is certainly a more cost effective option in terms of both capital and life cycle costs. However, UAV and UCAV technologies are not mature enough yet to dispense completely with manned fighters – particularly where air defense duties are concerned. Over time it is indeed conceivable that the IAF will replace single-role (strike) fighters with UCAVs. The third option is to buy new build aircraft of a type that is already in service. The IAF has already exercised this option in purchasing additional Jaguars from HAL. However, the Jaguar despite its excellent abilities is a bomber and ill suited for other tasks. The IAF could also choose to purchase additional Su-30MKIs. Being a twin-engine fighter, with a complex thrust vectoring mechanism, it is likely to have higher operating costs and is to an extent still work in progress.

    What aircraft?

    The Ministry of Defence has invited bids from four vendors for 126 aircraft of an interim type. These include Bae/SAAB (Gripen), EADS (Eurofighter), Dassualt (Mirage 2000) and RSK-MiG (MiG-29). All these are contemporary aircraft and multi-role. Even though the Mirage and MiG airframes designs are a generation older, as far as systems are concerned the aircraft are roughly equivalent. From an Indian perspective the following are likely to constitute some important criteria for arriving at a final decision:

    1. Fly-away price
    2. Operating costs
    3. Logistical compatibility
    4. Offsets and transfer of technology

    Let us consider these in more detail (in reverse order). In each case where these aircraft have been offered for sale the vendor was willing to consider offsets and transfers of technology, where requested. Most recently, MiG and Bae/SAAB offered to supply fighters to Thailand in return for the supply of chicken. Similarly, Austria considered joining the Eurofighter program in return for industrial offsets and technology transfers. In this respect all the bids might be considered equally competitive.

    The Eurofighter and the Gripen are two completely new types and have no commonality with any other type of aircraft already in India service. Although one should note that the Gripen GE F-404 engine is similar to that used in the LCA. In terms of logistics, it is quite clear that both the MiG-29 and the Mirage 2000 can be rapidly integrated into the IAF. They will require minimal investment in maintenance infrastructure and retraining of personnel.

    While the cost of flying a single-engine Gripen is likely to be less than that of the twin-engine Eurofighter, it’s actual life cycle costs (especially in Indian conditions) are an unknown. Some information might be inferred from the Swedish Air Force’s experience about the Gripen. The IAF has operated MiG-29s and Mirage 2000s for almost 20 years now. Consequently, there is a sound basis for making a judgment about the operating costs for these types.

    The final issue is that of flyway price. Based on cost of aircraft being sold to Germany and Greece (since cancelled), the flyaway cost of a Eurofighter is around Euro 70 million (Rs 400-450 crore each). The remaining three types of aircraft are available for between Rs 150-200 crore, depending degree of customization. Clearly, then, the Eurofighter is not competitive.

    We can draw the following conclusions from the above discussion. First, that the Eurofighter is the least competitive of all the types. Second, since the other three types fall in the same price category, any final selection is likely to (or should) be based on operating costs and ease of integration. Introducing the Gripen will require the creation of a support infrastructure that is likely to take funds away from other pressing needs. In purely objective terms, this leaves the MiG-29 and Mirage 2000 as the only credible choices.
    MiG or Mirage?

    The IAF has a clear preference for the Mirage 2000 for good reasons. The aircraft has been unparalleled in its reliability, cost-effectiveness, versatility and safety. However, the MiG-29 too could be competitive, the added costs of operating the twin-engine type fighters notwithstanding. First, the upgraded versions of the MiG-29 are less maintenance intensive, less fuel hungry and considerably more versatile than the models currently in IAF service. Second, since the Navy too is purchasing MiG-29s, buying a common type could potentially lower procurement, maintenance and operating costs across the services.

    But how do the two aircraft stack up against each other? In purely technical terms the Mirage 2000-5 offers some advantages over the Mig-29K (actually a navalized ‘M’ version being built for the Indian Navy). In particular, the Mirage and its systems are less maintenance intensive, implying greater up time and aircraft availability. First, the Mirage has much greater airframe life: 7500 hrs vs. 6000 hrs for the MiG-29K. Second, the RD-33K engine for the MiG-29K is advertised as offering 1,200 hr MTBO (mean time between overhauls). However, based on IAF and Luftwaffe experiences with earlier models of the engine found that most engines require overhaul after 300-700 hours. The Snecma M53 powering the Mirage is of modular construction. This eliminates the need for complete overhaul at specified periods. The twelve modules that make up the engine can be exchanged or replaced during regular engine inspections. Third, the while RD-33 derivative powering the MiG-29 has lower specific fuel consumption (0.77) than the M53 on the Mirage (0.9) in dry mode, two engines on the MiG-29 make it more expensive to fly. Fourth, the Mirage 2000-5 can carry 6,300kg of ordnance compared to 5,500 kg for the MiG-29K. The two aircraft have roughly equivalent performance with respect to range and endurance, but the Mirage is more efficient. Last, and by no means the least, the Mirage 2000 has had a better safety record in Indian service.

    Just as in the 1980s, the IAF could choose to split the buy between the two types, but MiG’s financial troubles might yet prove a deterrent. There is of course the important issue of sticking to delivery schedules, but as with manufacturing any complex equipment, delays should be expected – more so since neither the MiG-29s nor Mirage 2000s have been built in quantity in recent times.

    Ultimately it is for the IAF and Ministry of Defence to choose which aircraft to buy. There is often a tendency in any competitive bidding processes to over-emphasize the issue of unit cost. One hopes that in procuring an interim fighter, both the IAF and the Ministry will take a more holistic view. Interim solutions should be optimal in BOTH financial and operational terms.
    (Rupak Chattopadyay is associated with ORF, New Delhi)

    in reply to: IAF Thread : Dec 2004+ #2641806
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    I just love the sound of US engines. Nice video.

    in reply to: Pakistani news, pics and speculation thread #2641846
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    Tiger, Saleem, Desert Fox, Arshad and others, stay on topic and stop getting personal.

    Here something intresting. Got it from Pakdef.

    U.S. Offers Pakistan Radar Planes
    Advanced U.S. System Could Elbow Out Swedish Erieye Bid

    By BARBARA OPALL-ROME, TEL AVIV

    The U.S. Navy has proposed selling eight airborne early warning and control (AEW&C) aircraft to Pakistan, reversing restrictions on selling advanced radar planes to Islamabad.

    One proposal would send eight new Northrop Grumman E-2 Hawkeye 2000s plus support equipment for an estimated $1.6 billion; a second option costing about half as much would include used aircraft upgraded to the advanced configuration, Northrop officials said.

    The U.S. Navy proposal — supported at the policy level by the U.S. State Department, Pentagon and other relevant government agencies — is yet another manifestation of Washington’s intensifying courtship of Pakistan, which is viewed by the Bush administration as a key ally in its global fight against terror.

    in reply to: FC-1 : The Engine Options #2642478
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    Indian thinktank report. For the rest I think you are smart enough to stop the oneliners.

    * The project began in 1987, with the PAC, Kamra, playing a major role in the designing and development of the aircraft. The PAF provided two pilots, 21 engineers and 24 technicians for the entire duration of the development phase of the project. This phase of the project included the conceptual design phase, detailed designing, technological preparations, parts production, sub-assembly and assembly sequences, and flight-testing. The first prototype trial flight was conducted on November 21, 1990, and the first aircraft arrived at the Kamra airfield on March 19, 1993.
    * Subsequently, the Aircraft Manufacturing Factory at Kamra embarked upon a phased programme of assimilating aircraft manufacturing technology for the K-8. The capability to indigenously manufacture the K-8’s horizontal tail, vertical tail and engine cowling has already been achieved. By 2002, the transfer of technology for indigenously fabricating the K-8 front fuselage is also expected to be achieved.

    You can imagine the rest about fc1. We have seen various reports about PAF engineers changing F6 and F7. They are doing the same with the F7 engine for more corrosion protection. They add valuable information cause they have experience in western parts and have worked with operational squadrons.

    in reply to: FC-1 : The Engine Options #2642503
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    I doubt that Pakistan is showing these kind of info to others. Whether you call it bs or not. Pathetic and stupid reaction.

    in reply to: IAF Thread : Dec 2004+ #2642535
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    take care not to get shot though 😉 it aint Netherlands!

    I wonder what this has to do with aviation.

    in reply to: FC-1 : The Engine Options #2642557
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    Since Pakistan pays a part. Pakistani engineers are a part of the team (look at video of prototype building, look at the video of testing first flight). Pakistan will buy huge quantities of this plabe. Pakistan will build this plane in Pakistan. Pakistan is busy selecting own avionics. Read some AFM or Janes articles and you know that Pakistan is a part of the project. Somehow it seem not to enter peoples mind. Particular group.

    in reply to: FC-1 : The Engine Options #2642897
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    [QUOTE=Sameer]When people say that Pakistan has some imputs in the project, may i know what those imputs are exactly apart from the funding and probably a few engineers going to China and being trained? What is Pakistan developing exactly?

    Ever heard about setting parameters? And testing? Or certainly know how about western parts? The verlastng questioning only one side doesn;t make another side better.

    in reply to: Pakistani news, pics and speculation thread #2642940
    Tiger_01
    Participant

    [QUOTE=Desert Fox]bullcrap, of course the Block 60 has better capabilities than the F-16A which can be measured/compared. and its not my theory of composites. its accepted. but if your GIK, Topi institute does’nt teach such stuff, then not my fault.[/QUOTE]

    Talking about personal crap. And no one is stopping this side.

    About PAF and F16. One AFM mag ago (november 2004) Pakistani ACM told that he was intrested in blovk 50/52 F16’s with AMRAAM and JDAM. But if not allowed he will go for second hand ones.

Viewing 15 posts - 31 through 45 (of 171 total)