Not every so-called supersonic aircraft obeys the area rule, but if they don’t, there is a penalty to pay, such as needing 43k thrust to get marginally transonic. (Or as one American said of the Scimitar, “only the Brits could put that much thrust in an airplane and still have it be subsonic”.)
The Central Fusion Server, aka the Battle Analyzer?
A six-year-old PPT describing a future fantasy state, presented as if it answers all arguments. In the real world, wideband LPI/LPD satcom is still a dream and any F-22/F-35 connectivity is many years away. Typical Spud.
Loke – Misery loves company. Facing the prospect of being cut to a token force, RNLAF would like to see the Belgian force cut down to one F-35 squadron in a joint force, providing them with economies of scale and some depth. Probably up to the Belgian politicians at this point.
Back in the day, the F-35 was supposed to dominate in every mission, for an F-16 price and sub-F-16 operating cost. The True Believers have a hard time accepting that it didn’t happen.
Gripen NG is not an F-35 equivalent.
Since you don’t seem to feel the need to read anything, IGNORE FUNCTION GO!
I am shocked that AFs committing to the JSF have stressed its technical sophistication. After all there are lots of other reasons for writing a blank check on operating costs while cutting your force in half.
Gripen NG is not an F-35 equivalent, but it does many things as well and some better. As I pointed out above, as customers drop off (Denmark) or exclude JSF on cost grounds (Belgium?) it may well lead the pack of alternatives.
FBW – The claims that somehow the NG will be a quantum leap above the C are specious at best.
I’m sure you’re right. It only has a new engine (with the world’s best T/W), entirely new avionics (from sensors to displays) and a seriously modified airframe.
So, FBW, can you explain why those links are relevant? Checkmate? This is more like Mornington Crescent than chess.
Halloweene – Exactly the case re Rover.
Also, let us not forget that the physical aperture of a radar is important too, because all the TR modules in the world won’t catch the trons that go whistling past the antenna, and the repositioner means that aperture doesn’t drop off in the same way off-boresight.
FBW – It is not a question of believing Saab data versus LM’s (although one has a track record of delivering kit on time that does what it says on the tin and the other does not) but that the Gripen radar IS ON A FREAKING SWASHPLATE.
A better question would be “how many modules do you think the JAS 39E radar has?” because that is also a necessary number for the calculation. I have heard an answer to that myself but it was speedily recanted as the source turned green.
But that is Spud for you. For instance, when he is challenged on his dubious assertion that the EOTS beats the dedicated IRST at its own game, he will run to Russian brochures that he would be the first to trash as propaganda if they undermined the awesomeness that is JSF.
As for satcoms… The situation AFAIK is that Gripen E has them (as of mid-2011, DRS was on contract to deliver Face III Iridium) and JSF does not. It is in the magical world of Block 4.
I don’t think that JAS 39E will “directly” threaten F-35 sales. It’s well positioned as a substitute for nations that find the F-35 acquisition and operations price tag indigestible. But those nations have to admit they have a problem first.
Spud – If there was anything in that post that actually responded to what I said AND was factual (eg “They are getting Rover in Block 4” – nothing in Block 4 is anywhere near finalized, and “more and better sensors, better datalinks” – don’t make me laugh) it would be worth a reply, but it’s not.
Loke – Did they underestimate how expensive the F-35 will be to operate?
Sort of, if “believing rubbish claims” can be called “underestimating”.
Saab didn’t pull out of the Canadian competition. They pulled out of a political beauty contest and told the Canucks they’d be back if they actually did want a competition. Sensible move on Saab’s part.
Thanks, Flex – I wasn’t trying to imply “conspiracy” but making the point that nobody who has listened to anyone from the Netherlands’ defense establishment would ever have expected any kind of evaluation to come up in favor of anything but F-35, barring an asteroid impact.
However, looking at the capabilities listed (with the proviso that the report is more than five years old):
1-Offensive Counter Air/Sweep. Possible advantage to stealth provided that the weapons and RoE permit you to take advantage of any difference in detection/tracking range. On the other hand, JAS 39E has Meteor and better supersonic performance. (I can’t see how you would judge that JAS 39E “can’t do” this mission.) It’s also relevant that USAF does not regard the F-35 as an OCA platform (see Gen. Hostage’s recent comments.)
2-Defensive Counter Air/Cruise Missile Defence. Stealth irrelevant. Advantage JAS 39E.
3-Suppression/Destruction of Enemy Air Defences. Possible advantage F-35.
4-Air Interdiction. Possible advantage F-35 on deep missions vs. defended targets. Less so in second echelon scenario.
5-Close Air Support. F-35 Block 3F can’t do this because it lacks competitive EO/IR (EOTS has limited field of regard, no HDTV) and Rover compatibility. Fixing issue means adding a pod and destroying stealth.
6-Non-Traditional Intelligence, Surveillance, Reconnaissance. Block 3F has no capability, lacking suitable datalinks and sensors (HDTV/LOROP &c) and again, F-35 would need a pod.
So that gives me three missions (1, 3 and 4) where the F-35 may do better (and it is primarily a bomber, so two of those are “gimmes”). Two missions (5 and 6) that the F-35 can’t do. One (2) that the JAS 39E will do better. And 2, 5 and 6 are the missions that have been most required in the past 20 years.
And then there’s the awkward problem of a 37-aircraft force, and operating costs that even the Pentagon can’t quite agree on. But Hals- und Beinbruch! with that, as your neighbors say.
As for the current MinDef, I’d help bridge her capability gap, IYKWIMAITYD.
It would be interesting to know what those six missions were, and the criteria for success. Of course this is the nation where the defense minister went to work for LockMart’s PR company and serving officers use LM charts in their conference briefs.