SD-10Originally posted by AirToAirCombat
I doubt the lucrative export item theory.The Israelis sure as hell aren’t going to sell them to the Arabs and that’s a huge chunk of the market right there.
They aren’t going to sell them to the US.
Europeans are going for IRIS-T, ASRAAM, and Sidewinders.
Who’s left? Africa, Asia, South America. The Japanese are building their own AAMs. They don’t even operate the AMRAAM even though the Japanese version is years behind schedule and China has Russian BVR missiles.
Singapore operates US weapons and IF they go for a European fighter, chances are high that they’ll either continue to use US missiles or adopt whatever is standard on the European aircraft.
China might go for it, if they don’t decide to build their own. Even if China does buy, how many can you sell?
Taiwan? Not a chance. Israel is buds with China and won’t want to **** them off just to sell some missiles. Plus it would really **** off the US, which is most likely to bailout Taiwan if China gets hostile.
South America and Africa aren’t even worth the time to comment on.
I just don’t think that the market you claim is out there.
China has its own IIR (128*128) program with thrust controls
both for short range and medium range missiles. So i don’t think
there is market there. You forget some think.
SD-10Originally posted by Arthur
SD-10,
Please tell me why the Soviet/Afghanistan/Pakistan – US/Vietnam/China comparison is not valid according to you? Not with a senseless rambling about China being a nuclear power (what on earth has that got to do with anything), just how exactly it was fundamentally different with the subject we’re talking about here.As to your poor shot at Soviet missiles (yes, a very poor pun that was), please tell me how many Soviet AAMs (be that BVR or WVR ones) were fired against the PAF? Wouldn’t that be a grand total of zero – so what on earth are you babbling about!
So according to Your logic there is no difference between US vs
CHINA and SOVIET VS PAKISTAN. Escalating a war against CHINA
is whole different ball game vs escalating a war against Pakistan.
Situations may be the same but the Players are completely
different. What a nonsense.
Slight change in CHINA policy and alot of countries in this world
will be SH1TING in their pants. From what i read in the above
posts either Soviet fighters radars do not work(Does not know
that F-16 is coming after them for WVR kill) or they were working
under stupid assumption that nobody will hit them when
were hit repeatedly and still not chose to carry escorts or
whatever defensive measure against WVR missile.
Sharmji
China purchase of Russian is very smalll part of total budget. The
budget which is usually publicized doesnot include Acquisitions
and R&D. China has its own large scale missile programs
completely independent of foreign purchases.
SD-10Originally posted by Vympel
Why C-803? Oh, it’s Chinese, I got it – never mind that it’s only a mockup and it’s specifications aren’t exactly remarkable :rolleyes:It’s obviously the Kongsberg NSM- you know, for reasonable, unbiased people- which this forum has very frigging few of … though I must say that it’s not the best thing since sliced bread (sorry Jonesy, I know you have pictures of it up on your wall hehe)
What you mean by specification not remarkable? I put the
specification of YJ-83/C-803 and you should put some
specification of Exocet or Harpoon and don’t put any Russian
because they don’t work. The specification of YJ-12 is
unknown.
SD-10Originally posted by Arthur
Are there any backups for the claims that refugee camps inside Pakistan were attacked by the Soviets? It would be the first time i’ve heard from it.Basically, the Pakistani position vs the Soviet Union during the Afghan War was nearly identical as the Chinese position vs. the US during the Vietnam War. Both superpowers lost aircraft to enemies they weren’t at war with, were not to enter, and were not to engage. Courtesy of poor navigation (and helped pretty much by targets in the vicinity of the border), China scored a number of kills against the US, and Pakistan scored a few kills against the Soviets and Afghans. Big deal.
How this could translate into a heroic defence of the PAF against a Soviet onslaught is beyond me. And suggesting An-26s were potential bombers on an attack run is really putting too much hope on the gullibility of people reading that, PAF fan!
Besides, the only time real Soviet borders operated in the Pakistan/Afghan border region (and either ingressed or egressed towards their targets through Pakistani airspace), the bombers operated with impunity because for those planned incursions, the Soviets did make sure their aircraft were safe. Thinking that they would’t have done so on other occasions is just silly. It has been suggested though by the PAF that the An-26 was on an ELINT mission, which is slightly more likely (except for the fact that there were more populair aircraft for such missions, and that there were 21 fatalities in the crash).
An interesting read from a Pakistani viewpoint is in WAPJ #10, the article ‘Pakistan border battles’ y Linsey Peacock. While not without errors (Rutskoi being referred to as “Colonel Alexandrov” as the most unforgivable one), it has some details on a few engagements. It also mentions the second wreck-memorial: at Sarghoda there is a horizontal tail from an Afghan Su-22. The Su-25-wing at Kamra was mentioned here i believe.
You cannot bring CHINA example here. Just look at the size.
CHINA was adeclare/undeclare Nuclear power and had shown its
metal in Korea. It is more of showing of poor Soviet tactics
(bombing without escort) and substandard Air to air missiles.
I doubt any Soviet BVR missile has hit any thing.Just
look at missile hitting the ground instead in Air. Pretty hilarious.
SD-10Originally posted by Srbin
any info on that Chinese missile?
255KM range. Mach 1.6 speed, 165kg warhead, 700 to 800KG
weight, solid ramjet powered.
Probably there will be a Airlaunched version of YJ-12 with
hypersonic speeds in testing now.
SD-10C-803. 4 shots with JH-7A.
SD-10Originally posted by Kussikap
PLA,You’re right, we know how good FAS is is. We also know how good Pakistan’s defence R&D is.
When they “tested” Ghauri in 1998 and 2002, they said it was “indigenous”. We now know it’s a repainted North Korean NoDong now which Pakistan got in exchange for HEU enrichment technology.
We know that China transferred M-11 missiles in 1993.
We know that modified M-11s were named as Ghaznavi and tested in 2002
We know that the Shaheen-I is a clone of Chinese DF-15 or M-9
The fact is that Pakistani R&D establishment is a building with 2 phone lines, one direct to China and another to North Korea. The building also has an area with different paint containers. A room full of Color Xerox machines and multifunction scanner/printer sets completes the Pakistani R&D.
Don’t believe me? Look at the following latest analysis from the NTI (Nuclear Threar Initiative) led by non-proliferation expert and former US Senator Sam Nunn.
http://www.nti.org/e_research/profiles/Pakistan/Missile/index_3066.html
What nonsense
“We Know”
How you know or the other experts know. When all they are
doing posting pictures from China forums full of errors and
putting speculations based on pictures. Putting PL-9 range one-
third of PL-8 is one such example.
SD-10Sales to Zimbabwe and Sudan is high possibility in Africa. Possibly
some countries in Middleast. In Asia Mayanmar and Bangladesh
can also be considered. I have read that initial production run is
about 400 aircrafts.
SD-10Originally posted by cbstd
PRC does not now, nor never will have the resources to mount a sucessful invasion of Taiwan. Just at Germany could not mount the resources to cross 20+ miles of the English Channel to invade the UK in WWII, the PRC can not “bridge the 100+ miles of the Strait.The PRC’s only hope to “conquer” Taiwan is to have the world (and that mostly means the US) capitulate to the PRC’s demand that their “renegade provience” submit.
If the PRC made a hostile move across the Strait, the US and allies would cut off the supply of oil to the PRC and stop them in their tracks.
Scott
You should think about your own OIL before Chinese OIL. China
currently produces 3.3million barrels per day enough for
sustaining war. China is not interested in intervention soley for
economic reasons not for military reasons. China has to better
the lives of its 800M peasants before thinking about Taiwan.
Even if they recognize independence how many countries will
recognize them. For China it is more like buying time game when
Taiwan become irrelevant relative to China to be suitable for
intervention.
SD-10Originally posted by SOC
China isn’t making any, and that includes the medium-range SD-10 😀I’d say anything over 100km is long-range.
Long Range AAMs:
Meteor
AIM-54
AIM-47
R-37
R-33
AAM-L
R-77M
R-77M-PD
R-27ER1/ET1/EM/EP
That R-77M-PD is China-Russian joint project.
I better change my nam to SD-11
SD-10I will not call it a J-7 rather a MIG-21 copy. That big hump represents MIG-21. I consider J-7 from -E models. This is really a MIG-21 in China. And specially that Bison is really crude as compared to J-7G.
SD-10Originally posted by PhantomII
very crude shapeSo, the J-7, which is based on the MiG-21 looks better??
I’m rather confused….
And if by that comment you are referring to the double delta wing of later J-7’s looking better that would be a moot point because you can’t see the planform of the wing.
So you cannot figure out J-7 from MIG-21. Any aircraft which looks
crude is MIG-21. Cranked delta or otherwise it does not matter.
http://forum.airforces.info/showthread.php?threadid=18465&highlight=MIG21UPG MIG-21
http://forum.airforces.info/showthread.php?threadid=18469&highlight=J7PG J-7
http://forum.airforces.info/showthread.php?threadid=15549&highlight=J7PGJ-7
SD-10This looks to me a MIG-21 instead of J-7. very crude shape.
SD-10Originally posted by SOC
A J-7E/G may be able to hold its own in a dogfight with an F-CK-1 just fine, but it should never come down to that with the TC-2 the F-CK-1 sports.
J-8 will fire the BVR and J-7G will take care of any taiwanis aircraft with its HMS and PL-9 in WVR.
SD-10Originally posted by flex297
The RC-400 is practically an export copy of THOMSON-CSF RDI radar of late Mirage 2000C models, maybe with some RDY based systems… Proposed mainly for Mirage F1 and MiG-21 upgrades. Ain’t this radar a bit obsolete by now?
http://www.thalesgroup.com/all/pdf/rc400.pdf
MIG-21 picture is not there . can you show me any Russian radar having comparable features. I cannot find any Russian official web address. Weight should be less than 120Kg. power consumption<3.5KVA.
AIR-TO-AIRFUNCTION
• Very long range, all aspect, look-up/ look-down detection
• Automatic management of waveforms and antenna
scanning
• Multitarget automatic lock-on and TWS
• Raid assessment
• Simultaneous multi-target fire control
• Single Target Track (STT)
• Combat modes
• IFF interrogator capability
• Advanced ECCM
AIR-TO-GROUNDFUNCTION
RC 400 provides all the modes required
for day and night, all weather operations:
• Ground Mapping
• High resolution Mapping Spotlight SAR (picture)
• Terrain Avoidance
• Moving Target Indication and Tracking
• Air-to-ground Ranging
AIR-TO-SEAFUNCTION
RC 400 provides all the modes required for
BVR attack of surface ships:
• Long range detection
• Multitarget TWS
• Target RCS assessment
• STT
• ISAR mode (option)
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