Kramer2 C-130Js were put to use for transporting materials to Sikkim after the recent earthquake there. This is one transport that the IAF can do with a lot more of for sure. I hope the follow-on order for 6 more goes through quickly.
KramerThat’s how defence and aerospace forums work unfortunately. A topic comes up such as this, here involving India and Australia. If anyone else comments on the topic, such as someone from Britain, and says something that the Indians don’t like, then the Indians will then start trying to pick faults with Britain, even though it is completely unrelated to the discussion (India and Australia). It’s not so bad on this forum, but other forums it just gets ridiculous. We could just stick to the topic, but they’d rather get their pound of flesh in revenge 😉
its funny that you play the victim here..your pattern of inflammatory posts against India on this forum is quite well known actually. It was you who started off with this type of post (which you conveniently deleted but unfortunately someone already quoted a portion of) which is clearly trolling- you have an axe to grind against India and then you claim that you merely made an innocent comment?
Judging from previous Indian programmes like this, it’s more of a national pride “show off” project,
You’re right on one account though- people shouldn’t bring Britain into the argument. I mean, just claiming to be from Britain doesn’t mean much by the way..doesn’t necessarily make you a Briton. 😉
KramerRevenge for what exactly? British occupation of India was as much the fault of Indians as of the British. But of course it is always easier to blame others than to blame yourselves. The current hundreds of millions of Indians in poverty is Britain’s fault too I presume? 😀
The UK has between 0.5% and 1% Indians. I’m not sure if that counts as invasion TBH!
no I’m merely pointing out the ridiculous logic you used to claim that India would want to invade Australia (of all countries !) could also be used to claim that India could invade UK to exact revenge for the colonial rule of India and the terrible toll it extracted of Indian people..if you can justify that India could invade Australia for resources, then you could justify this too, no doubt ! (In truth, only idiots would justify either or suggest that either is possible)
KramerAgreed! Good relations now doesn’t mean things won’t change in the future, especially considering India and China will become ever more determined to obtain resources, and Australia has lots of natural resources.
which world do YOU guys live in ?!! 😀
maybe even the UK can start considering India to be a threat now huh? India could invade them in the next 2 decades or so if not for non-existing resources then for revenge ?! :rolleyes::D
Kramerold news on the MiG-21 Bison crash..why’re you posting it again ?
KramerI don’t want to get into an F-16/MiG-29 discussion, but on the subject, what would an F-16 even have done against a MiG-29 during a Cold War encounter? It didn’t even have BVR armament, and up close, no HMS and R-73. F-16s would have been used as part of an AWACS/larger BVR armed fighter network….sounds like the exact same thing CGI would have done for the MiG-29.
a similar situation arose during the Kargil war in 1999 and 2 F-16s were locked onto by a single IAF MiG-29..in the words of PAF Air Cmde Kaiser Tufail
I have been out of the PAF for a few years now- and in some respects have as much access to sources now as some civvie aviation fanatics- but still do retain contacts which give me the inside scoop sometimes.
Here’s my unbiased opinion on what happened in this incident. First some disclaimers- the IAF NEVER gave Chibber a big gallantry award- this was a routine award for a job well done- like an Air Medal in the USAF- not an award in the league of a Medal of Honor or DFC! Secondly, in this particular occasion, the PAF was bested- there, I said it- there’s no shame in it- there have been many occasions in the past conflicts of 1965 and 1971 when it was the other way around- any professional pilot will tell you that success and failure are two sides of the same coin- anyone who claims to be invincible is lying or an adolescent amatuer masquerading as a professional. To lay this story to rest- and though the PAF is understandably not keen to trumpet it around town- those in the know know- lets keep it at that, so I’m not exactly revealing any state secrets.
The PAF in Kargil was NEVER tasked to aggressively counter the IAF (forget the crap about them being scared)- it was very much an Army (read Musharraf) show- with even the civilian leadership in the dark about some aspects. Our friendly neighborhood tinpot dictator (Musharraf) then looked for scrapegoats- so he got rid of Nawaz and then turned on the PAF for not doing its job (bull****!!!) by firing much of its top brass recently. Forgive me for digressing, but as someone who dedicated his life to the service of Pakistan, I hate to see it falling back into dictatorship. But the key message is- the PAF was never under orders to engage the IAF, unless they crossed the LOC. On this occasion, I gather the Indian MiG-27s did cross the LOC briefly and the local NLI commander who was having the crap bombed out of him called in desparately for support- the PAF, which had been frustrated at having to sit it out till now, saw an opportunity to bloody the IAF nose as they were reported to have crossed the LOC. Two Falcons on alert were vectored into the MiGs, but received the jolt of their lives when an IAF MiG-29 locked onto BOTH of them (to answer the ongoing debate I see on this aspect of the IAF Mig-29s capability). They tried to break lock- but the MiG persisted, and while I do agree they could have pressed home- there were some controlling factors:
1) strict orders not to cross the LOC
2) Hell, they thought they were about to get a salvo of R-27s up their noses…as an aside, one of the Falcon pilots was a greenhorn and was pretty shaken by this experience- got razzed to death for weeks afterwards.
What would have happened if the Falcons had pressed home- who knows???? The MiG had a definite BVR edge and in close combat with the R-73/HMS, all bets are off. Plus, if the Falcons did cross the LOC, they would have been fair game to any other MiG-29s lurking about as they would no longer be over friendly terriotory- sometimes discretion is the better part of valour, n’est c’est pas?
The score could well have ended up being 2-0 in the favour of MiG-29s !;)
KramerBoth from induction and acquisition cost as well as operating cost, the Gripen NG would make a lot of sense for the Malaysians..however, they’ve been operating twin engine types (MiG-29N, F-18D, Su-30MKM), so it does appear that they want the safety that comes with having two engines. That would put the Rafale, Typhoon and F/A-18E/F in a better spot, even though they’d be costlier to buy and operate. The best possible solution would be to simply induct another squadron of Su-30MKMs, but maybe they want to have a western supplier as well.
the IAF’s MRCA deal will be followed keenly by the Malaysians- they have a history of close cooperation with the IAF and their equipment purchases from Russia mirrored those of the IAF (MiG-29N and Su-30MKM) with IAF instructors being deputed to Malaysia to train their pilots. Whichever aircraft wins there, has a natural advantage of a closer spares supply line and maintenance facilities for overhauls.
Kramernews – a MiG-21 Bison crashed with the pilot, a Flt Lt ejecting safely.
and the IA has named is Weapons System Integrated (WSI) Dhruv helicopters ‘Rudra’, which as per wikipedia means
“Rudra (Devanagari: रुद्र) is a Rigvedic God, associated with wind or storm,[1] and the hunt. The name has been translated as “The Roarer”,[2][3] or “The Howler”.[4]”
KramerIAF pilots in a Cheetah helicopter rescue mountaineers from glacier at 23,000 feet pressure altitude..
HQ WAC pressed two helicopter rescue team of ‘Siachen Pioneers’ Squadron led by Wg Cdr S Srinivasan got airborne from Leh Air Force Base, within a matter of minutes. The rescue team which comprised Wg Cdr DC Tiwari, Flt Lt A Agrawal and Flt Lt A K Bharmoria, led by Wg Cdr S Srinivasan.
The mission involved flying into unknown territory and landing at a density altitude of approximately 23000 ft over an inhospitable glacier. After assessing the landing site which was covered with snow and wide crevasses of the glacier, Wg Cdr S Srinivasan manoeuvered his helicopter to land in the restricted area with negligible reserve of power.
KramerThe list of armed transports is much larger, so only a few:
AH-60L Arpia
MD-500/530
OH-58D
MI-8/17/171 Hip-E
KA-29
Socat
Panther
Bo-105
Gazelle
W-3
Lynx
you can add the Weapons System Integrated (WSI) Dhruv to this list.
KramerThere is also the issue of maternity leave where the IAF will need to give prolonged leave to female pilots when they get pregnant which will impact squadron availability figures. I had read that being mentioned, especially since training pilots is costly, it is a tricky issue.
Also the possibility that women may experience trouble flying when they’re going through their menstruation cycle. But I’m not sure about the second point- since other air forces have female fighter pilots and physiologically they seem to be able to take g’s just as well if not better than male counterparts.
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Mpacha, this is in response simply to the ridiculous “sexist” allegation by Quadbike. I won’t continue on this further.
OK, lets get back on topic now please!, M’Pacha
KramerYou have to radiate and the signals will be picked up by listening posts on the ground and in the air. Why would one want to reveal their capabilities to the fullest extent on either platform?
listening posts on mainland India? Are you suggesting that if a Su-30MKI radiates at full power near the testing ranges at say Maharajpur AFS (at the heart of India) then some other power can sniff it out? So then the IAF would to date have never really tested out the Su-30MKI at its full power?:D
KramerFirst of all, if this is aimed at me I’m an Indian resident living in Nashik. Happy?
Secondly, it is quite unfair to attack NRIs and foreigners for expressing geniune(if, from you POV, misguided) concern about perceived misuse/ wastage of Indian public money.
no it wasn’t aimed at you.
KramerGreat. Hostility, sarcasm and over-defensiveness. You’re right. We have absolutely no right to complain or criticise. Let the GTRE take as much time as necessary, no deadlines required! See ya in another 25 years!:rolleyes:
And like I said, I don’t care about the higher-thrust Kaveri. Even with their current level (and GTRE themselves say so) it’s quite possible to deliver a lower-thrust engine for a trainer aircraft, a UAV or even spin-offs for locomotives, tanks, gas turbine generators and marine propulsion. But all we get are verbal assurances, as it is the K9 Kaveri has not even finished flight certification let alone started development of a functional trainer/UAC engine derivative. And likewise the tank, generator and locomotive derivates remain on the drawing board(if even that). The only other product that shows any promise of being functional in the near future is KMGT, and even that has had no updates for years.
See, having a key research project is fine, but if it keeps going at its own pace without any ready, deliverable product of any sort along the way(as opposed to more prototypes and proposals) yes, it is worrying. I’m not expecting them to deliver the moon, but I do expect something tangible to come out of their seemingly never ending research.:(
which is why Corrosion giving you the number to call up GTRE and lodge your personal complaint seems logical. I mean you say “I’m not expecting”, so its your own personal expectations (whether you have all the facts right or not is a different issue) so why not talk to them and see if you get a response?
KramerOwning property or having investments in India which the Govt taxes is not akin to being an Indian resident, paying taxes on regular income itself. For which the term tax payer is usually used.
exactly..its not a personal attack but if one is so concerned about the motherland and the tax payer there, then maybe one’s services could be offered instead of complaining about those who are actually sitting back there trying to do something, whether successful or not.
an NRI pretending to be so vexed about Indian tax payers’ money not being utilized wisely because GTRE hasn’t delivered on its goals to date is a bit, if I might say so, rich..
I mean the alternative is to simply import without investing in indigenous capacity and capability building which means losing more tax payer money to foreign companies, both in the short run and long run. I’d much rather see GTRE being given guidance, direction and being made more accountable. To simply lament about tax payers without assessing all the associated factors is rubbish, pure and simple.
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