KramerSorry — there is source in your post that I missed?? Or is there a source in the thread saying that Catic / PAC could not afford??
a pakistani poster named “redgriffin”..
KramerPeople, rejoice, rejoice! Thunder is making progress and hitting the headlines. Massive achievement for PAC and CATIC.
Leave flamers to wallow in bitterness.
bitterness ? I thought you said and I quote from page 6 of this thread
Yeah, lets see what happens. I will take the word of the Pakistan High Commission though.
If you think we are taking 2 planes just to park ’em up you will be disapointed.
In your determination to put down everything Pakistan (lets not pretend and hide it as anything less), you forget this little bit of the website link your provided.
now that its not flying despite what the Pak High Commission said, you’ve changed your tune totally and instead are saying that they’re bitter because they’re asking why it didn’t fly..turns out they did bring 2 planes just to “park ’em up”. Funny how fast you forgot what you wrote.
Kramer‘it seems’ based on what – you have a source saying they were not able to afford — or is it just more sour grapes??
read the post above..or maybe read the thread more carefully. :rolleyes:
KramerThere’s nothing to support the suggestion it had anything to do with insurance. Farnborough have made it clear that the static display was at the REQUEST of the PAF.
This was posted by redgriffin, a Pakistani poster
Originally Posted by redgriffin
The actual reason is that somebody in the admin chain forgot to arrange adequate accident insurance for the display. By the time it was found out that the existing cover is not enough, the time remaining had shot up the addittional premium required for the display making it cost prohibitive. Hence the decision by the PAF not to put up a flying display. Simple and nothing to do with the technical merits/demerits of the plane.
There must have been some reason why the PAF suddenly asked that the JF-17 only be given static display status when the Pakistani High Commissioner himself, not some lower ranking “source” stated that the JF-17 will be flying..
Kramerwhere are the videos of flying display that members here promised us ?
PAF or CATIC, don’t know which couldn’t afford the insurance cover it seems. So no flying display.
KramerDepends how you want to spin it.
I thought SD 10 would have already been sorted. I admit that.
HOWEVER, it shows that plane is capable of firing SD 10. Most likely SD 10 has already been fired from JF 17.
I always maintained plane is BVR capable, integrating is not that difficult for makers of JF 17, considering even lesser radars KLJ 1 on J-8 can fire BVR missiles.
“Fanby Talk” Coming from IAF cheerleaders, which threads get most news posted.
its you who is trying to put a spin on it actually. No one has said that KLJ-7 cannot fire BVR missiles, that is pure hogwash that you’re coming up with. If it couldn’t have fired BVR missiles then PAF wouldn’t even have selected it for the first batch. What people have been asking is proof that the SD-10 was ALREADY integrated which people like you have been saying has already been done since the JF-17 was always meant to be BVR capable..
turns out that its not a done deal just because its original specifications required it to be BVR capable.
Its no big deal that the plane is CAPABLE of firing SD-10s..even old MiG-21 Bis upgraded with modified weapons computer and a new radar to become Bisons could fire R-77. A fighter entering service now would obviously have the capability to fire BVR missiles..the integration and testing is the big part.
As for the part about “most likely SD10 has already been fired from JF-17” that is the fanboy talk I am referring to..no proof, no reports, just internet fanboy talk.
Kramerso its confirmed- the SD-10 is UNDERGOING integration and will be finished by the year end..all the fanboy talk about it already being integrated with the JF-17 and that the JF-17 was already BVR capable was just that- fanboy talk.
KramerHow significant is that argument ? The Rafale has very low RCS which atleast the French claim to be lower than fighters with an internal probe.
The French apparently introduced the non-retractable fixed probe on the Rafale as a cost cutting measure, to keep maintenance low. But a fixed probe is a drag as well as RCS increasing object. That is fairly obvious common sense.
KramerDoes the current LCA LSP’s have a non-retractable refueling pod?
have you seen one on any LCA till now ? by the way its a “non retractable probe” not “pod”.
KramerBAe and HAL to soon sign a contract for 57 additional Hawk Mk.132Ys for the IAF and IN. That will give the IAF 106 Hawks and the IN 17, a figure that is closer to what they actually need as compared to the artificially low number of 66 that was originally signed for..
expect similar increase in numbers for the MRCA winner.
BAE Systems has not only managed to fend off a low-intensity war with HAL over a host of problems with the Hawk advanced jet trainer license build programme, including a damages claim, but is on the threshold of receiving a fat follow-on order for 57 more Hawks to add to 66 already contracted for. All 57 will be manufactured by HAL in country.
With this new development, India’s RFI last year for 57 new jet trainers — sent out when things had really soured between BAE and HAL — is null and void, and the Hawk prevails after all. As was the plan earlier, 40 of the new order will be for the air force and 17 for the Indian Navy. HAL chairman Ashok Nayak told Hindustan Times correspondent Rahul Singh in Farnborough yesterday, “We have ironed out all niggles with BAE Systems. The deal is going to be signed soon.” Just how both sides ironed out those niggles would be supremely interesting.
KramerKeep in mind that the AMCA will be twin engined and the Kaveri-M-88 engine was touted as a possible fit for that fighter..and if it is successful in meeting the thrust, weight and reliability criteria, a production run of 250 Kaveri-Snecma hybrid engines is not only likely to be met, but may be exceeded as well. Turbofan engine development being a nationally strategic issue, it is quite imperative that the Kaveri-Snecma be developed- but at the same time, its timelines are not dovetailing with the IAF’s requirements for the Tejas Mk2, so these 2 programs have to be run separate.
KramerGuys
Please IGNORE flamers and stick to subject. This is a great and fascinating time for the Pakistan Air Force and lets provide more excellent sources and pictures.
Obviously some members are riled by the progress this wonderful little cheeky air force is making. The best shot back they have is FC-1 may have been based on another design. Who cares? So be it. This airplane is currently guarding Pakistani skys and being touted on the international market. Only 5-6 countries in the world can claim that right now….
China has designed and built fighters that have been guarding its skies for a decade or more now. Pray, name the 5-6 countries in the world that can claim that right now..there are 4 just within the Eurofighter consortium in case you’re including Pakistan in such a list because it “cooperated” with China on the FC-1.
KramerIAF has begun Apache trials.
IAF begins Apache trials
Sunday, July 18, 2010
By Saurabh Joshi
The Indian Air Force (IAF) began trials for the AH-64D Apache Longbow attack helicopter last week. IAF sources confirmed that the aircraft, which is competing with the Russian Mi-28 for the IAF’s tender for 22 attack helicopters, has already completed trials in Jaisalmer and is currently undergoing high altitude, flight and maneuverability demonstrations at Leh.The trials are expected to continue till the end of next week, after which the Mi-28 is expected to be given a similar once-over. The maintenance and weapons trials of the former will be conducted in the United States in the coming weeks.
Dean Millsap of Boeing Rotorcraft Systems, told visiting Indian media in Philadelphia in May that the company had crash-tested the aircraft to a drop-speed of 40 feet per second. The company is pitching its ballistically-tolerant structure, which can withstand an impact up to 23 millimeters, to emphasize the survivablility of the aircraft. The aircraft also has self sealing, Kevlar armor-protected fuel cells under the pilot’s seat, as well as a system to deploy nitrogen gas to starve any outbreak of fire of oxygen, called nitrogen-inerting crash resistant fuel cells. Both, pilot as well as gunner, have the benefit of the night vision generated by FLIR (Forward Looking Infra Red) sensor. But Boeing expects the Longbow radar on the Apache to end the argument. The radar dome, which has a millimeter wave radar, is located on top of the main rotor allowing optimum detection capability. The aircraft can also digitally share information on targets with other aircraft and systems.
Interestingly, Boeing has developed a capability in the Apache to control Unmanned Aerial Vehicles (UAV). While so far this ability is restricted to control over a single UAV, the company is building systems to allow airborne control over multiple UAVs. So far this is not a capability that has been offered to or requested by the IAF.
The first of the Apache Block III are expected to be delivered in October next year and deployed with the first US Army units by June 2012.
The trials for the IAF’s requirement for 15 heavy lift helicopters are also expected to begin after the Apache, on July 27, with the Chinook being put through its paces at Chandigarh, where it has already arrived, and Leh. Both the Apache and the Chinook were brought to India by C-17 aircraft, possibly to quietly underline the capabilities of the strategic lifter, ten of which are also being considered for purchase by the IAF, after it underwent trials last month
Kramer^^^
The contents of that article seem extremely similar to an article by Ajai Shukla..its almost plagiarism !
Kramerthanks Shiphone. Appreciate the pics you’ve posted.
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