Seem to recall Israeli pilots, during the early years of operating the F-15A/F-16A, when they used to train WVR the viper won most of the time. The Israeli Eagle pilots believing the F-16 must have been the best in the world at it due to the losses they received.

For me, the F-15, at slower speeds seems to have the edge in climb/acceleration and instantaneous turn at lower speeds (airshow speeds :p)

The Gascogne EC-2/7 rafale squadron is being reactivated (former mirage IV P nuclear deterence squadron which was closed in 2005).

The first rafales with the “colors” of this squadron can be seen in St dizier AFB.

It will be fully operational in 2010 with the ASMP-A nuclear missile.

source : air&cosmos from the 9th january.

Will these be the only Rafales wired operationally able to carry ASMP-A? Or will it be a simple switch with nother squadrons machine if a Rafale goes tech?

I would hope so……………..What happens if the PAK-FA is revealed only to find out its not nearly as Stealthy as the F-22 and F-35.

I would not put it past these chaps that they could have designed a fighter better then the F-22/35/EF etc.. (they have had a good deal longer)

Not that I would be a fan if they did lol Its all very exciting but whatever they do eventually produce, will become a very serious concern to alot of airforces; something to think about.

I would think the Rafale would have better odds in the case of the Swiss. Especially, if the money is available. If, not then the Gripen is the only choice…………

I did at first. But..there are much more detailed disscusions in the Rafale/EF threads, but the Swiss have confirmed price is not as important as what the plane can do. And since they are looking at predominately an interceptor/multirole the typhoon fits the bill, but as I said for more detail check the other threads.

Is there then reasonable assurance the PAK-FA will be shown to the public in 2009?

Swiss competition: Rafale, Typhoon, Gripen
Indian MRCA: Rafale, Typhoon, F-16I, F-18E, MiG-35, Gripen
Brazil FX: Rafale, Gripen, F-18
Libya (they didn’t sign anything final with Russia yet): Flanker, Rafale
Nederlands: F-35, Gripen

Swiss: Cannot see how it couldn’t be the typhoon for what they want.
Indian MRCA: MIG-35
Brazil FX: Hopefully the Rafale
Libya: Any Su-xx
Nederlands: F-35

No that was economic reality not politics, the two are very different.

Is that why the blueprints were burnt, and each piece of the remaining airframes bar 2 were completely destroyed? It was not just economics my friend.:(

The ADV wouldn’t want to do WVR with a Fulcrum/Flanker. Its strengths are in BVR.

It certainly is no slouch though! It could out turn/accelerate/climb F-4’s at all altitudes and speeds, and apparently could out accelerate the BAC lightning on the deck (whatever speeds this was, prob high subsonic to supersonic)

It is a 7g airframe, the limiting factor was the carrying of the huge hindenburger tanks limiting the F.3, when full, to around 3g. However if the BVR situation ever happened the tanks would most certainly be dropped.

The Tornado F3 is often deemed as a sluggish fighter, it may seem so compared to F-16’s, EF’s etc…but it’s not bad, just not quite as good.