Summary = “J-20 is draggy, and underpowered, so it has to be designed as interceptor”. No, an
interceptor cannot be draggy and underpowered.Maneverability would depend heavily on weight, a 3 ton difference will turn J-20 from a flying brick to a decent dogfighter. Without empty weight, all speculations are baseless. However no matter how light J-20 is, one thing is far more certain: With less thrust, similar/greater drag, and lack of variable inlets, J-20 will have way lower (kinematic) top speed to T-50.
Plus, J-20 has no features to prioritize top speed. Canopy, fixed inlets, big canards, all moving stabilizers and AL-31 engines do not belong to a high speed oriented design.
Since we are speculating, my mk1 eyeball inspection says main wings are located way too at the back, that “canard”s will need to generate substential lift to balance the aircraft. As such, J-20’s aerodynamic layout is more like tandem wing to a canard-delta. This, combined with all moving vertical stabilizers, tells me J-20 is more oriented towards high maneuverability than people think.
And what about energy recovery? Are we going to go slow and High alpha? Or is it a high energy fighter. How well do the engines do in s Su-27 with a heavy weapons load, and tanks? Like I said again the plane could still be decent, but I suspect a F-18/F-16/ sized fighter would fly circles around it.
This thread is so speculative it hurts.
You believe its speculation to say that the J-20 is under powered? Like mentioned before, the F-35, F-22 and T-50 all showed post stall handling, while in the same phase the J-20 is in now. After all of the hoopla, and faked plane enthusiasts photos from the fence line, are you now trying to convince us the Chinese DON’T want to show off? I think this plane needs more engine for its weight. As a law enforcement guy, im used to making gut descisions. My gut says this plane is big, and would avoid a turning fight, with anything F-16 and above.
Furthermore, it wouldn’t be caught in a low energy fight either. It will NOT super cruise.
If a loaded Su-27 can’t supercruise with the same engine, then this plane being heavier has no chance. In its current state its a decent LO missiler, and Ill give it that.
If all the planes are armed with HOBS weapons what difference does it make?
With the exception on a guns only fight any WVR fight with these weapons will be a wash.
There is some indication about the overall agility of the J-20, frankly it reminds me of a MiG-31, only
with wings positioned differently. Most likely it won’t be as agile as the F-22 and T-50 but there is one parameter which could outweigh it all – speed. If the J-20 is able to supercruise at decent speeds and generally has a solid supersonic range, then it’s still a very potent interceptor to count with. These are exactly the virtues which the F-35 is missing, IMHO.
Msphere I agree with you on all points but one. If they haven’t mastered how to perfect the current Su-30 engine, how will they master a next gen supercruise engine?
Its like plankton trying for years to steal the secret formula.
… YES … and they do not import Su-35s … at least not now !
http://en.yibada.com/articles/40605/20150624/russia-final-contract-su-35-fighters-china.htm
?
One more thing sir. Please keep in mind that with all the planes mentioned above. They demonstrated great post stall handling in the same phase the J-,20 is in now. Even the early block F-35 with most systems not installed can demonstrate 100 degrees AOA.
Deino I will agree to disagree. In my opinion the plane is big and heavy.
I wouldn’t put much faith them leapbfrogging The AL engine either.
If they could master the tech easily, then
Then wouldn’t need to import SU-35s
Deino there is no chest thumping, but we have some evidence.
1. Its the consensus of the arm chair community the the J-20 is the largest and likely the heaviest of the fighters above.
2. We know the engine its using and we know the wet and dry thrust.
3. We have seen the Others in a post stall regime. If the J-20 could do it the Chinese would not hesitate to show us.
4.The AL-31F puts out less thrust than the F-35 dry, but the plane is twice the size.
This is not nationalism, or trolling, but the hard facts point to a plane this size being underpowered. Will it still do its job? Yes. Do I expect even F-16 level of manuvering, and acceleration? No.
So T-50=F-22 >>> F-35 >>J-20?
I know that this will annoy the China stronk crowd. Can we firmly establish that the J-20 is pretty far behind the performance curve compared to the T-50? In fact I would say T-50=F-22>>> F-35>>J-20.
Why is this planes nose always flying a slight few degrees AOA, and never super straight and level? Does the FCS trim the aircraft that way? Is it the camera angle?
LO your re-writing history. The contest was between Boeing and Lockheed, years ago. If the customer wants another plane, there is plenty to choose from.
Do you believe that countries have their own specific artistic style, when it comes to planes? Or are military design only about capabilities? If you saw advanced designs from each country could you tell by the mold line?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonnell_Douglas_X-36
I wonder why boeing didn’t use the X-36
For the JSF competition? The design was alot better than
X-32